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japanime

macrumors 68030
Feb 27, 2006
2,916
4,844
Japan
So, you're telling me that my budget-priced $999 MacBook Air is using a budget component as opposed to a higher-end component found in higher-priced models?

How is this news?
 

TripHop

macrumors regular
Mar 18, 2009
202
1
Mac Mini Has Light Ridge

My guess the new Mac Mini's also have the Eagle version. But specs state it supports dual display - most likely one on Thunderbolt and one on HDMI port.
It says right there in the article that Mac Mini uses Light Ridge so you might want to guess about something that isn't documented as the opposite of your guess right in the article. Mini supports 3 monitors - two front the Thunderbolt and a third from the HDMI.
 

troop231

macrumors 603
Jan 20, 2010
5,822
553
Is that really a DIP switch on the lower left side of the board? Talk about wasting space...

If you're talking about the white thing, I don't think that's a DIP switch. No reason for a DIP switch on a laptop logic board if the configuration will never change. It may be some kind of connector though.
 

Arcadie

macrumors regular
Dec 6, 2008
197
0
According to CultofMac.com: "The scaled down Thunderbolt chip used in the new MacBook Airs, however, is named Eagle Ridge, and features only two Thunderbolt channels — meaning it’s half as fast — with support for just one external display."

No not half as fast, half as much bandwidth...

If you have 1 external HDD connected to them for example, the speed will be the same on both chips.

Its if you have multiple devices that a possible slowdown will occur. But how many TB devices do u plan on attaching to an air? a display and HDD? thats only 2 devices, you will not notice any difference.
 

ovrlrd

macrumors 65816
Aug 29, 2009
1,384
146
I was more enthusiastic about this Air refresh (I have the previous generation with the 320M GPU), but every day there's a piece of news about how it's not sooo amazing as expected: Different SSD models ("did you get the fast one?"), integrated GPU "almost as good" as nVidia offer, and now a thunderbolt port that's, let's face it, crippled down compared to other Macs.

To me it just sounds like you are trying to make yourself feel better about having a previous generation. There is nothing wrong with doing that mental justification if it helps you, but the reality it is still a fantastic update to the MBA line.

The GPU thing is unavoidable due to licensing, and while the HD 3000 isn't as impressive on paper, it still performs well enough. The simple fact is that nobody is going to be doing high-end GPU work on the MBA because of battery constraints. Gaming has always been a "bonus" achievement, and never a requirement.

The different SSD models is the most overrated debate ever, there is absolutely no practical difference between the two drives, and the only people upset are people who run benchmarks all day long to inflate their ego.

Finally, this news about the Thunderbolt chip, you need to understand that this is not a gimped Thunderbolt, or less powerful. It still does the 10Gbps requirement of Thunderbolt, and that is all that really matters. You aren't going to be daisy chaining 5 devices that can make use of 100% of the bandwidth on the MBA. It's simply just not a situation that would ever happen. Having 2 channels at 10Gbps means that you can drive one display, plus any number of devices that could use up to 20Gbps (thats a TON) of bandwidth. To put that into perspective, you would need ~2000 Blu-rays running at the exact same time to saturate that kind of bandwidth. That's an insane amount of bandwidth, and the fact that you think it's "gimped" is hilarious.
 

justinfreid

macrumors 6502a
Nov 24, 2009
501
23
NEW Jersey / USA
Is that really a DIP switch on the lower left side of the board? Talk about wasting space...

The white, rectangular, maze-containing component, whatever it is, is not a collection of DIP switches. I've asked the iFixit community to figure out its purpose.

UPDATE Looked at the underside of the logic board and the pictures of the MacBook Air on Apple.com: the component I described above, and that you mentioned, is the bottom of the SD card reader. It does look funky.
 
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nagromme

macrumors G5
May 2, 2002
12,546
1,196
That’s OK... when my Air needs 3 screens, I’ll use my iPad as the third. (I’ve heard that works, but haven’t tried it: I bought an app that makes the iPad to decently as a second screen with my old Air, for my email or palettes; but have not tested using a REAL screen for the third. I will have to try that with my next Air!)
 

Stetrain

macrumors 68040
Feb 6, 2009
3,550
20
So is the chip in the Macbook Pros only being half utilized? It seems like the Light Ridge chip is capable of driving two full bandwidth Thunderbolt ports. If there's only one port all you should need is the Eagle Ridge chip.
 

tbobmccoy

macrumors 6502a
Jul 24, 2007
967
216
Austin, TX
That’s OK... when my Air needs 3 screens, I’ll use my iPad as the third. (I’ve heard that works, but haven’t tried it: I bought an app that makes the iPad to decently as a second screen with my old Air, for my email or palettes; but have not tested using a REAL screen for the third. I will have to try that with my next Air!)

It's unfortunate that air display is bugged with lion or this would be a great method :(
 

al2o3cr

macrumors regular
Oct 14, 2009
210
0
If you're talking about the white thing, I don't think that's a DIP switch. No reason for a DIP switch on a laptop logic board if the configuration will never change. It may be some kind of connector though.

It's the SD card slot's contacts...
 

hayesk

macrumors 65816
May 20, 2003
1,460
101
So is the chip in the Macbook Pros only being half utilized? It seems like the Light Ridge chip is capable of driving two full bandwidth Thunderbolt ports. If there's only one port all you should need is the Eagle Ridge chip.

No, you connect the second display to the first. It's daisy-chaining.
 

Duncanreally

macrumors member
Feb 24, 2010
56
35
I'm not sure where they're getting their information that the 13" MBP can't drive dual displays, but I was driving dual monitors on my Dimension 2400 with an MX4000 too long ago to remember. For perspective, that's the card that was in the original iMac G5.. 7 years ago.

To boot, I drive an external display at work five days a week, and can drive the internal display at the same time. If I close the lid, I have to drive just as many pixels with dual external displays - totally feasible.

You can drive a low res display plus a high res display, but not two high res displays (e.g. two 27" external Apple Cinema Displays at their native resolution).
 

lesiu

macrumors newbie
May 23, 2011
26
12
A simple solution - somebody make a Thunderbolt to USB 3.0 adapter, my guess it possible a single Thunderbolt channel could possibly drive 2 USB 3.0 ports - not sure if can combine 2 USB 2.0 ports on one channel.

Sounds good (the bandwidth equation at PHY level seems fine )
but have some doubts at technical implementation level:

=> this is not a simple task as there is significant processing power required
to shake 10Gbps data at transport/logical levels.
(=> additional controller/processor/buffer/memory required => $$$)

=> I have not seen any USB peripherals using 2 ports to increase bandwidth,
guess it is due to USB topology (tree), so such adapter will be only able
to stall +50% of the Thunderbolt traffic ... :|
(or an additional logical/transport 'USB over Thunderbolt'
layers handling is required to handle 2 separate USB 3.0 'channels':
I guess not currently implemented in any OS)

=> such adapter will require additional power provided from USB 'host' side
(powering is not a Thunderbolt feature as far as I understood),
means the USB 'ends' need to have 'host' functionality:
this is not a case of most of the USB 3.0 peripherals to be connected ..

Conclusion :
The cost and complexity of such adapter would axe benefits
of using available or(/and) more affordable USB3 peripherals ..
 

drewyboy

macrumors 65816
Jan 27, 2005
1,385
1,467
These 'thunderbolt' ports and controllers are only somewhat pricey because they are a new introduction. Now that Intel has ditched the "light" part of its original "Light Peak" specification (at one point, 'light peak' ports were going to be optical in nature), they should be just as cheap as any other port eventually.

They can and will use optical. It WILL be compatible with current TB ports on all macs. You ask, how do you know? It's be cuz of the chips at the ends of TB cables, which is part of the beauty that tb is. Cable length can change which requires different chips on the cable, cable can change from copper to optical and only need different chips on the cable. This was just plain smart. So, in closing, current TB ports on mac will work with optical and varying lengths of cable because all the special hardware needed is the chips which is included on the cable!

Edit: it's why no matter what, we won't see these cables going for ~$1-2, at least not for years when TB is old hat
 

jclardy

macrumors 601
Oct 6, 2008
4,171
4,401
I'm not sure where they're getting their information that the 13" MBP can't drive dual displays, but I was driving dual monitors on my Dimension 2400 with an MX4000 too long ago to remember. For perspective, that's the card that was in the original iMac G5.. 7 years ago.

To boot, I drive an external display at work five days a week, and can drive the internal display at the same time. If I close the lid, I have to drive just as many pixels with dual external displays - totally feasible.

Two external displays...along with the internal one. So Like having two Apple thunderbolt displays and the MBA display.
 

G4DP

macrumors 65816
Mar 28, 2007
1,451
3
Thunder...Thunder...Thunderbolt. Every time I hear that name I think of a cartoon. I hope it survives.

Thunderpants Ho!

Seems they like hiding little bits of information secret doesn't it. Now for a general user, not a deal breaker, for someone who wants to get best bang for buck they sure it damn difficult.
 

ZipZap

macrumors 603
Dec 14, 2007
6,076
1,448
Still limitations should be revealed when Apple knows the default assumption will be different.

Lets see what they put in the MBA 15...as that might just turn out to be dream laptop.

Oh, and the whole cutting cost perspective is BS. They make a huge profit on every single item they sell.
 

gnasher729

Suspended
Nov 25, 2005
17,980
5,565
According to CultofMac.com: "The scaled down Thunderbolt chip used in the new MacBook Airs, however, is named Eagle Ridge, and features only two Thunderbolt channels — meaning it’s half as fast — with support for just one external display."

Which is of course totally stupid and means they don't know what they are talking about. Light Ridge has two channels connecting to one port, and another two channels connecting to a second port. Eagle ridge has two channels connecting to one port. So the MBA has one port that is exactly as fast as one on a MBP, but the second port is missing.

And you can connect two monitors as long as you have one monitor that acts as a hub, like the new Thunderbolt monitor that Apple starts selling soon. You just can't plug one monitor into one port and a second monitor into the second port, because there is no second port.
 

res1233

macrumors 65816
Dec 8, 2008
1,127
0
Brooklyn, NY
I'm not sure where they're getting their information that the 13" MBP can't drive dual displays, but I was driving dual monitors on my Dimension 2400 with an MX4000 too long ago to remember. For perspective, that's the card that was in the original iMac G5.. 7 years ago.

To boot, I drive an external display at work five days a week, and can drive the internal display at the same time. If I close the lid, I have to drive just as many pixels with dual external displays - totally feasible.

Do you know what resolution means?
 

Lesser Evets

macrumors 68040
Jan 7, 2006
3,527
1,294
Crikey.

I love the possibilities Thunderbolt delivers... just waiting for an economical reality to complete the consumer technology. It will be a year before Thunderbolt drives and other peripherals finally take over the market and provide somewhat reasonable prices.
 
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