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Old Feb 7, 2012, 06:10 PM   #26
Rodimus Prime
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Originally Posted by chrono1081 View Post
I think its a good rule. Developers should take pride in their work and make their app reflect the quality of their product. Its sad that Apple has to enforce this (which should say something about the Dev's who have it done it's products.)
I can understand that but what about the dev who say made the app a long time ago before the 4 came out or shortly after the 4 came out. All he had was say either a 3GS or iPod for testing and taking easy screen shots and much better screen shots than could be grab off the SDK.

All said dev wants to do is update some bugs in the app but lacks the tools to really do a full retake of the screen shots.

I think the rule is good for future apps but making it Apply to updates I think can be an issue as it can increase the work load on older apps just doing a basic patch.
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 06:21 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by chrono1081 View Post
I think its a good rule. Developers should take pride in their work and make their app reflect the quality of their product. Its sad that Apple has to enforce this (which should say something about the Dev's who have it done it's products.)
And what about any developers who develop exclusively for the older (pre4) platforms?
(They do exist. Not every developer jumps on the must-upgrade bandwagon.)
This arbitrary change is basically Apple forcing developers to purchase more hardware.
It also puts the users at risk, since it imposes the possibility that a developer could opt-out of updating a fatal flaw or security hole in their app, just because they didn't/couldn't or didn't want to bend over backwards to satiate Apple's strong-handed need for new new shiny & new screen-shots.


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Originally Posted by Rodimus Prime View Post
I can understand that but what about the dev who say made the app a long time ago before the 4 came out or shortly after the 4 came out. All he had was say either a 3GS or iPod for testing and taking easy screen shots and much better screen shots than could be grab off the SDK.

All said dev wants to do is update some bugs in the app but lacks the tools to really do a full retake of the screen shots.

I think the rule is good for future apps but making it Apply to updates I think can be an issue as it can increase the work load on older apps just doing a basic patch.
Exactly!

If Apple wants screenshots to be standardized in their store, they should take them themselves.
Apple has access to every app. They could easily automate it during the approval process.
At least Apple created screen-shots would be a more accurate third-party representation of the actual app (instead of the BS promotional "screen-shots" that are often used, that sometimes don't even reflect the actual functionality).

Last edited by 2 Replies; Feb 7, 2012 at 06:29 PM. Reason: reply
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 06:22 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Rodimus Prime View Post
I can understand that but what about the dev who say made the app a long time ago before the 4 came out or shortly after the 4 came out. All he had was say either a 3GS or iPod for testing and taking easy screen shots and much better screen shots than could be grab off the SDK.

All said dev wants to do is update some bugs in the app but lacks the tools to really do a full retake of the screen shots.

I think the rule is good for future apps but making it Apply to updates I think can be an issue as it can increase the work load on older apps just doing a basic patch.
While I agree with you, playing devil's advocate, if the developer is already paying $100 a year to be a publisher on the App Store, it's not asking a whole lot of them to, at the minimum, buy an 8GB current generation iPod touch at $200. While it's annoying to have to spend $200, it's probably a development expense that won't have to be done often unless Apple changes up the screen size and/or resolution in the near future.
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 07:20 PM   #29
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While I agree with you, playing devil's advocate, if the developer is already paying $100 a year to be a publisher on the App Store, it's not asking a whole lot of them to, at the minimum, buy an 8GB current generation iPod touch at $200. While it's annoying to have to spend $200, it's probably a development expense that won't have to be done often unless Apple changes up the screen size and/or resolution in the near future.
True but that brings up the other issues I have with the App Store which the devil registration cost is way to high big time when you compare it to others. Apple is making profit off of it. Google for example is $25 one time fee for life but that is another argument.
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 07:28 PM   #30
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True but that brings up the other issues I have with the App Store which the devil registration cost is way to high big time when you compare it to others. Apple is making profit off of it. Google for example is $25 one time fee for life but that is another argument.
Once again, I agree and take similar issue; however, once again playing devil's advocate, Google makes its money from Android in an entirely different way than Apple does from iOS and Microsoft does from Windows Phone 7. Also Microsoft charges Windows Phone 7 devs the same $99 annual registration fee that Apple does iOS devs. Again, I agree that number is needlessly high, but it's apparently the going rape (whoops, meant "rate").
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 07:34 PM   #31
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Once again, I agree and take similar issue; however, once again playing devil's advocate, Google makes its money from Android in an entirely different way than Apple does from iOS and Microsoft does from Windows Phone 7. Also Microsoft charges Windows Phone 7 devs the same $99 annual registration fee that Apple does iOS devs. Again, I agree that number is needlessly high, but it's apparently the going rape (whoops, meant "rate").
True ms does charge a fee but to new design it is insanely easy to have the feeling waved for the first year and for students always free but yeah way to high. In terms of student support I find Microsoft the best by far Google in the middle and Apple's support is just beyond crap. They should make the fee for students be free and waved. Google fee is low enough that it is easy to absorb and no other cost for life.
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 07:36 PM   #32
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Am I the only one who got an initial mental image of devs having to scan their eyes and submit that with their apps?
I did too. Fun stuff.
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 07:39 PM   #33
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This arbitrary change is basically Apple forcing developers to purchase more hardware.
How does requiring retina screenshots force developers to purchase more hardware? There are other ways to get screenshots besides capturing images on a device.
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 08:11 PM   #34
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How does requiring retina screenshots force developers to purchase more hardware? There are other ways to get screenshots besides capturing images on a device.
I. Am assuming that you can do it in the sdk. Just it is harder to get as good of shots off of the sdk compared to the phone/iPod. It is a work around.
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 08:25 PM   #35
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And what about any developers who develop exclusively for the older (pre4) platforms?
Apple know exactly what percentage of app store revenue come from users of these older devices. So all this means is that developers who cater to that small demographic aren't making Apple enough money (Apple's 30%) to care one whit.

Quote:
If Apple wants screenshots to be standardized in their store, they should take them themselves.
Apple has access to every app. They could easily automate it during the approval process.
Great screenshot selection and screenshot artwork are one of the few ways for Developers to market their apps in the App store, and you want to take away that marketing channel? Crazy!
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 08:30 PM   #36
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Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A405 Safari/7534.48.3)

No excuse. They had over a year and a half to update. They should have known this date would come.
This is a prime example of the fanatical mentality I so despise. I must be crazy to believe in freedom of information and the ability of software developers to present their vision, not some Corporation's vision for a product. People should be free to develop their own apps any way they choose. Apple should have no say it in it what-so-ever as on the full Macintosh platform. In fact, I'm afraid it is that platform that will eventually be brought in-line with iOS and not the other way around, keeping all but hackers from being able to install programs of their choice freely and without the consent of some corporate entity. I don't think some of you will really get it until the day comes that companies are recording your image and/or voice from your phone without you knowing it. They'll claim it's only analyzed for targeted advertising or some crap like that and you'll wonder why you can't get a job after talking about joining some socialist organization to a friend over your smart phone....
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 08:55 PM   #37
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People should be free to develop their own apps any way they choose.
People can. Easy. As long as they don't try to make Apple distribute the app in Apple's iOS App store.

There are lots of Developer who do this. Open-source apps on github. Closed-source iOS library modules available for licence. Etc. I have several "white-icon" weird apps that I wrote for my iPhone.
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 10:17 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by MagnusVonMagnum View Post
This is a prime example of the fanatical mentality I so despise. I must be crazy to believe in freedom of information and the ability of software developers to present their vision, not some Corporation's vision for a product. People should be free to develop their own apps any way they choose. Apple should have no say it in it what-so-ever as on the full Macintosh platform. In fact, I'm afraid it is that platform that will eventually be brought in-line with iOS and not the other way around, keeping all but hackers from being able to install programs of their choice freely and without the consent of some corporate entity. I don't think some of you will really get it until the day comes that companies are recording your image and/or voice from your phone without you knowing it. They'll claim it's only analyzed for targeted advertising or some crap like that and you'll wonder why you can't get a job after talking about joining some socialist organization to a friend over your smart phone....
This is just the very OLD 'closed' v 'open' ecosystem rant.
Let's not get into this debate as it's been done every time a news article even mentions apple trying to control the user experience.

In this case it isn't even about that, it's just Apple making sure their app store looks the best it can. If you're really against better looking images, encourage developers to scale up their screen shots without increasing pixel density, that ought to show em!
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Old Feb 7, 2012, 11:12 PM   #39
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I see no problem with a store setting basic quality standards for the marketing materials the a publisher provides.

Seems normal and standard for a store of almost any kind.
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Old Feb 8, 2012, 02:09 AM   #40
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Ah wonderful. Now I just need to somehow make retina screenshots with my 3gs.
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Old Feb 8, 2012, 02:20 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by SiriusExcelsior View Post
Am I the only one who got an initial mental image of devs having to scan their eyes and submit that with their apps?
It does sort of bring that image to mind doesn't it? Well, as we move ever closer to the 3, it's time to get ready to package up my 2 and send it to the States....( gift for a buddy ) It won't be too long now!
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Old Feb 8, 2012, 04:01 AM   #42
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True ms does charge a fee but to new design it is insanely easy to have the feeling waved for the first year and for students always free but yeah way to high. In terms of student support I find Microsoft the best by far Google in the middle and Apple's support is just beyond crap. They should make the fee for students be free and waved. Google fee is low enough that it is easy to absorb and no other cost for life.
Yeah, come to think of it, my university did have a special deal with Microsoft to promote the development of apps on Windows Phone 7 for free. Yeah, Apple should be better about pricing; they all should be. But luckily for them, they don't have to. Clearly there are plenty of app devs that will pay the asking price.
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Old Feb 8, 2012, 04:40 AM   #43
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Clearly there are plenty of app devs that will pay the asking price.
In business, only the foolish give it away for free if customers are happy to pay.

The annual cost of a development license is about 3 hours pay for one of our developers...
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Old Feb 8, 2012, 06:09 AM   #44
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Use of the term "Retina" is misleading

Someone reading the headline could get the impression that Apple was requiring developers to submit scans of their physical retinas (the ones in their eyeballs) as part of some Orwellian-nightmare security scheme ran amok.

I do urge the editors at MR and elsewhere to use a little common sense and good judgement when writing up headlines. Apple's own directive makes no mention of the term "retina" - instead it simply specifies the required resolution.
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Old Feb 8, 2012, 10:56 AM   #45
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I see no problem with a store setting basic quality standards for the marketing materials the a publisher provides.

Seems normal and standard for a store of almost any kind.
Except that Apple is the only store around (short of jail breaking) and so you have no choice what-so-ever if you want to officially develop on that platform. It amazes me today's generation are so welcoming of someone else controlling everything they do. I guess it's different when you grow up during the Cold War period and other countries want to destroy your way of life and take away ALL of your freedoms. Wait long enough and it will happen again and people will value their freedoms once more. They take it for granted these days way too much, letting laws be passed to control everything they do and how they do it and letting corporations monitor everything they type and everything they do online. It's "normal" for them to be spied on.
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Old Feb 8, 2012, 11:00 AM   #46
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The annual cost of a development license is about 3 hours pay for one of our developers...
The annual cost of an iOS Developer enrollment is less than 1 hour of consulting time for many iOS developers around my area. Seems worth it.
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Old Feb 8, 2012, 11:03 AM   #47
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Fedirico Viticci over at MacStories posted this earlier, but I echo his sentiment. I think this is just house-cleaning to get ready to ditch the iPhone 3GS.

I hope not. I have a 3GS as well as a second Gen touch.
And my daughter has a 4th gen touch. I want my games to play on all my devices as well.
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Old Feb 8, 2012, 11:06 AM   #48
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Except that Apple is the only store around (short of jail breaking) and so you have no choice what-so-ever if you want to officially develop on that platform. It amazes me today's generation are so welcoming of someone else controlling everything they do. I guess it's different when you grow up during the Cold War period and other countries want to destroy your way of life and take away ALL of your freedoms. Wait long enough and it will happen again and people will value their freedoms once more. They take it for granted these days way too much, letting laws be passed to control everything they do and how they do it and letting corporations monitor everything they type and everything they do online. It's "normal" for them to be spied on.
Develop for another platform. No one is being forced to develop for the iPhone.

There is nothing unique about this. As software developers we have been purchasing specific development licenses for select computer platforms for decades.
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Old Feb 8, 2012, 02:01 PM   #49
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How does requiring retina screenshots force developers to purchase more hardware? There are other ways to get screenshots besides capturing images on a device.
Please name them.

My app uses the video camera (not available in the simulator) and features of the device that only appear in my interface if the device you are holding has those features. To get screen shots of those features I require at an iPhone 4S which I don't have access to. I'm going to have to create a temporary hack to get those shots, or perhaps I'll just pass the current shots through a graphics program and save at double resolution. Finally, if I do this hack, I'll have to edit the image anyway to remove the word iPod from the top left. If I don't, two screen shots would technically be misrepresenting two capabilities on that device. What a PITA.

EDIT: I crossed out that text because I found turning on airplane mode displays the airplane icon and hides the iPod text.


----------

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Originally Posted by ncaissie View Post
I hope not. I have a 3GS as well as a second Gen touch.
And my daughter has a 4th gen touch. I want my games to play on all my devices as well.
Apple dropping older hardware from sales doesn't mean developers can't still develop for it.

Do watch out downloading updated apps. I recently ran into the problem of apps being updated to run only on iOS 5 but my touch is still at iOS 4.3. It may be time to update that device.
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Last edited by xStep; Feb 10, 2012 at 03:13 AM. Reason: Crossed out text and explained why.
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Old Feb 8, 2012, 02:38 PM   #50
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@xStep

Thanks for the tip.
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