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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:20 AM   #26
Adriendod
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Nobody seems to have really understood the problem here..

It's not that these countries don't have 4G networks or whether or not Apple call it 4G for marketing reasons (as said above, everybody does).

The problem is that these countries HAVE 4G networks but don't work with the same frequencies that the US networks. The new iPad is only compatible with the US 4G frequencies.

They still sell it in other countries saying it's 4G, but even with a carrier with a 4G LTE network, it will not work.
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:21 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by spcdust View Post
I actually think if Apple are using the 4G capability of the new iPad to be a major part of their marketing strategy in countries that do not have 4G infrastructure in place then it's a fair point to bring them to task on this. It is somewhat dishonest to prominently highlight a feature that is incompatible / unavailable in a territory.
European countries --DO-- have LTE infrastructure. It's just that the iPad is ONLY compatible with the LTE-infrastructure of the United States, but Apple's ads make you believe that the iPad will work with LTE ANYWHERE.
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:21 AM   #28
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We can expect the hammer to fall on Apple in the UK fairly shortly as well. I just received an email with the following text following my highlighting to the Advertising Standards Agency (ASA) of the ambiguity of Apple's Marketing:


"Dear Mr Flynn

Thank you for your recent complaint regarding. I am sorry to hear that this advert has caused you concern.

You may be interested to know that we have received a number of complaints about this ad for the reasons you describe. I will add your complaint to our file, and you can expect to hear from a member of our Investigations team in due course.

In the meantime I would like to thank you for your patience and for bringing this to our attention."


Before anybody jumps on my back, nobody is suing anybody, there are just many of us over in Europe and elsewhere (ie. anywhere that is not in North America) who take serious issue with something being advertised as "Wi-Fi + 4G" when the device concerned will NEVER support the frequency bandings that we as a region (in my case, the EU) have chosen as our standard for LTE (800/2600MHz). I don't care that the 3G capability is "almost as fast" as North American 4G, the EU and Ofcom in the UK define 4G as: "WiMAX, WiMAX2, LTE and LTE-Advanced", and "The New iPad" doesn't support any of these in any of the regions in which it is being advertised as 4G outside North America.

I realise this will hardly affect sales, but at least it shows Apple can't just waltz around making up it's own rules as it goes along.
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:21 AM   #29
mrklaw
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Originally Posted by Konrad9 View Post
Why are they singling out Apple in this case? While I agree Apple shouldn't be advertising 4G if it isn't "true" 4G, every other company does the same thing.
nobody else is selling anything flagged as '4G' in Europe yet. Never mind the advertising guys, I bet the operators aren't that happy, as they'd want to push 4G when they actually have 4G networks ready
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:22 AM   #30
Konrad9
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Originally Posted by mrklaw View Post
nobody else is selling anything flagged as '4G' in Europe yet. Never mind the advertising guys, I bet the operators aren't that happy, as they'd want to push 4G when they actually have 4G networks ready
Sure wish it worked that way in the US.
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:22 AM   #31
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Isn't the US late to the 4G game ? Where do you get "different frequencies" as meaning they "need to get with the program" ? Have you ever thought that maybe it's the US that's being dumb with its choice of frequencies ?
The US announced the frequencies that were going to be dedicated to 4G far, far in advance. If you'll remember, the 700MHz spectrum was freed up when the US killed off the analog TV broadcast spectrum. There were public auctions of the various "blocks" or ranges of frequencies. Ring any bells?
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:25 AM   #32
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I could see this being an issue if they didn't offer a 100% refund if your not satisfied.
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:25 AM   #33
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Fat boy Phil Schiller (SVP Worldwide Product Marketing) has some answering to do!
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:26 AM   #34
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Why don't they just call it "9G" since that's probably not reserved for anything? Then they would put an asterisk and say "Apple defines 9G as a group of the following technologies: …" and then list the precise, exhaustive list of all the things it supports.
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:27 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by Doc750 View Post
This is exactly why you don't roll out new tech to the rest of the world at the same time as the US. They simply can't handle it, send it to them 6 months later right before it becomes obsolete and no one has any problems.
You're absolutely wrong, the problem is marketing and incompatibility, and that wont change in 6 months.

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Originally Posted by applesith View Post
Even if Apple changes the name to just iPad Wifi+3G or Wifi+Data for Europe, everyone else in the world knows this as the 4G iPad.

Apple should just not mention 4G on the boxes shipped to Europe and take 4G off their European sites.

This is just so stupid. Europe is so far behind with 4G and LTE and has to use a different frequency. This is part apple's fault but Europe really needs to get with the program.
I agree they should remove the 4G label, but your conclusion is so wrong. Different frequencies has nothing to do with being behind. Sweden was before north america to deploy LTE and they did it with the frequencies that most other countries now adopt so if anything, north america is using the "wrong" frequencies.
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:27 AM   #36
ivan2002
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So, let's summarize all the completely off things people have said so far on this thread:

1. But LTE *is* 4G! - Not the issue here. The issue is that you can't get any 4G (LTE or otherwise) using the new iPad in some of these countries, due to the difference in frequences supported.
2. But others are doing it as well, citation: T-Mobile is advertising a 4G that's slow, AT&T is advertising 4G even though it doesn't cover the entire US - Again, not an issue. The issue here is not how fast it is, it's that the frequencies don't match - anywhere in a given country!
3. Those damn Europeans and their frequency fragmentation - Actually, they are less fragmented in Europe than we are here in US. They are just different from us.
4. Europe needs to "get with the program" and use the same frequency as US - Oh, where do I even begin?

I'm pretty sure I missed some, but even with this many on just a few posts, it makes you think: what in the world?
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:27 AM   #37
sclawis300
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Doesn't anyone know how to read fine print anymore????????
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:28 AM   #38
macchiato2009
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class action soon in the US ?
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:28 AM   #39
ZipZap
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HSPA+ is not 4G

HSPA+ is 3.5G

LTE is 4G
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:29 AM   #40
sclawis300
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Originally Posted by Winni View Post
European countries --DO-- have LTE infrastructure. It's just that the iPad is ONLY compatible with the LTE-infrastructure of the United States, but Apple's ads make you believe that the iPad will work with LTE ANYWHERE.
No they don't. Am I the only one who heard/read the disclaimers that said 4G not available in all areas?

Last edited by sclawis300; Mar 28, 2012 at 10:41 AM.
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:29 AM   #41
ivan2002
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Originally Posted by sclawis300 View Post
Doesn't anyone know how to read fine print anymore????????
Here is another one: this is about the commercials. There was no fine print in commercials!
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:29 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by Konrad9 View Post
Watch TV or go outside and look at an advertisement on the internet. Almost every AT&T commercial says they provide 4G to 90% of americans or some other absurd number.
And what does that have to do with the present discussion ? That's not what you were saying. You were saying every other company "does it", ie, advertises 4G capabilities of their devices when there is no compatible carrier for it.

Are you mixing up issues here ?

So again, Citation Needed. Show us all those "other companies" claiming "4G!" on devices that aren't compatible with any carriers in Europe or Australia. This is the actual topic.

BTW, AT&T is 4G compatible thanks to HSPA+.

Quote:
Originally Posted by John.B View Post
The US announced the frequencies that were going to be dedicated to 4G far, far in advance. If you'll remember, the 700MHz spectrum was freed up when the US killed off the analog TV broadcast spectrum. There were public auctions of the various "blocks" or ranges of frequencies. Ring any bells?
And what makes those the "superior" frequencies or "Defacto 4G frequencies" ?

US centric view much ?
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Last edited by dejo; Mar 28, 2012 at 10:48 AM. Reason: Consecutive posts.
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:30 AM   #43
ivan2002
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Originally Posted by sclawis300 View Post
No they don't. Am I the only one who hear/read the disclaimers that said 4G not available in all areas?
The issue is that the disclaimer should say that 4G is not available in ANY area!
As it is not in the country that uses different frequencies.
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:31 AM   #44
sclawis300
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From Apple's website. When you see something with an "*" or a little number by it, that means there is a footnote. READ IT. It is not that hard.

"2. 4G LTE is supported only on AT&T and Verizon networks in the U.S. and on Bell, Rogers, and Telus networks in Canada. Data plans sold separately. See your carrier for details."
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:31 AM   #45
taxiapple
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Originally Posted by thekeyring View Post
I'm really confused.

I'm sorry I'm probably being very stupid, but can someone explain it to me in words I understand.
no
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:31 AM   #46
fruitycups
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Wirelessly posted

Why dont countries standardize around the world. Stpuid
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:33 AM   #47
Puevlo
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Honestly, if you're stupid enough to believe anything Apple says you deserve to get scammed. A frivilous lawsuit.
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:33 AM   #48
tekno
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Originally Posted by flynndean View Post
We can expect the hammer to fall on Apple in the UK fairly shortly as well. I just received an email with the following text following my highlighting to the Advertising Standards Agency (ASA) of the ambiguity of Apple's Marketing:
Out of interest, did you know your iPad wouldn't work when you bought it or is it as a result of this fall-out that you now realise?

And would you return it if Apple UK are forced to allow you to?
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:34 AM   #49
igazza
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We all love apple but i hope they get hit hard for this.
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 10:35 AM   #50
KnightWRX
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Originally Posted by sclawis300 View Post
No they don't. Am I the only one who hear/read the disclaimers that said 4G not available in all areas?
Sorry, yes, they do :

http://www.apple.com/uk/ipad/features/
Quote:
Really really fast is your only option.
The new iPad supports fast mobile networks the world over up to 4G LTE.2 So you can browse the web, stream content or download a film at incredibly fast speeds.
If they didn't, that tidbit wouldn't be on their UK site. Yes, the 2 points to small print saying this is a US only feature... why then display it on their UK site ?
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