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Old Apr 1, 2012, 09:39 AM   #101
Umbongo
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Originally Posted by Jack40 View Post
I think Mac pro is dead , cause Apple didn't announce new Xeon EP workstation unlike other such as HP.
I need Thinderbolt so I'll buy a workstation PC with the new MSI Z77-GD-80 the only thunderbolt motherboard equipped for workstation Intel Ivy bridge
I dislike Apple has discontinued Mac Pro and I say **** off Apple!
Yeah I think Dell and Lenovo have also abandoned workstations cause they haven't announced anything either.
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 11:45 AM   #102
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If Apple did that I would rather see Apple make a deal with one or two PC vendors to allow them to sell machines with OS X.
I had a Power Computing Mac OS clone desktop for seven years. It was faster and half the price of the Apple equivalent.

I can easily see Apple licensing it's OS to one or two PC box manufactures during the final transition from the box PC era to something "different".
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 12:33 PM   #103
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Let's assume the Mac Pro is Dead. Finitto. Over. Now what?

So where does that leave me? I like the new FCPX a lot, and really don't want to go back to Avid - but what choice do any of us have?

:

Sounds like an opportunity waiting to happen for someone.
Stage 1: Try the Hackintosh route. It may work for a little while with older video cards, but, eventually will fizzle because people will want to support Radeon HD 7970's and Nvidia GTX 680's and beyond.

Stage 2: In the meantime, if Avid is smart, it will build a full-up Linux version. This will turn out really, really well for Avid. And, you know what, Avid might do it anyway, even if Apple does finally release the new Mac Pros.

But, I can't believe Apple would be so stupid as to encourage, in fact, hurry, the replacement of OSX with Linux for content production. This is much bigger than just FCX.

Oh, about that cloud thing -- it works well when the ratio of computation to data is large. It doesn't work very well the other way around, and that is what video is-- too much data. How many people will have 10 Gbps to the home any time soon?
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 12:35 PM   #104
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I had a Power Computing Mac OS clone desktop for seven years. It was faster and half the price of the Apple equivalent.

I can easily see Apple licensing it's OS to one or two PC box manufactures during the final transition from the box PC era to something "different".
I think I would like to see it, but Job's feelings on licensing OS X were strong enough to carry over to the current administration.

The people I've talked to at a certain fruit company have graded this as a "not going to happen." Not that I don't hope they're wrong.
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 12:36 PM   #105
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I had a Power Computing Mac OS clone desktop for seven years. It was faster and half the price of the Apple equivalent.

I can easily see Apple licensing it's OS to one or two PC box manufactures during the final transition from the box PC era to something "different".
Do we not learn from mistakes? Or are we just way too young?
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 12:40 PM   #106
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I think Mac pro is dead , cause Apple didn't announce new Xeon EP workstation unlike other such as HP.
I need Thinderbolt so I'll buy a workstation PC with the new MSI Z77-GD-80 the only thunderbolt motherboard equipped for workstation Intel Ivy bridge
I dislike Apple has discontinued Mac Pro and I say **** off Apple!
Does this mean the iMac is dead too?!?! I mean didn't hp just announce a new all-in-one and Apple... well Apple has said nothing about a new iMac so this must mean its dead.

The Mac Pro is not dead. In one form or another, creatives, scientists, and the other countless professionals out there who count on a mac workstation to make a living will have a 2012 apple option. (and this form will not be a loaded iMac as apple is obviously killing that line of desktops)

Also unless they want SJ to resurrect himself as a giant bird and destroy the earth and thus all of humanity on dec. 21 2012.... I highly doubt you will ever see apple licens osx to anyone. Ever.
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 12:45 PM   #107
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Here's one reason why not - almost every Mac Pro owner will also buy a Macbook (Air / Pro), an iPhone, and probably an iPad.

If you need a workstation, you'll get a HP / Dell. Then you'll want a Toshiba laptop, so you can use the same software (not switching between Mac / PC versions). You won't have a Mac computer, so why not try an Android phone, which is bound to be cheaper?
This. Moving to a PC workstation means I'll probably end up with a Android/Windows 8 phone, a PC laptop, etc. The whole point of the walled garden, curated experience thing is that you can get everything you want from one place. If Apple changes that, that reasoning goes away.
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 12:57 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by goMac View Post
I think I would like to see it, but Job's feelings on licensing OS X were strong enough to carry over to the current administration.

The people I've talked to at a certain fruit company have graded this as a "not going to happen." Not that I don't hope they're wrong.
??
Jobs didn't just kill "the clones" because he felt so....
It was plain obvious that it was costing Apple money.
Apple makes money buy selling hardware. They try to sell the hardware by embedding gr8 software on it.
Being iOS / OS X or apps.

It's so different from Microsofts model: they make money buy selling software.

IF Apple were to license OS X to 3rd parties, they must find a way to make money off it, AND try not to loose income over their own hardware.
That'll be tough to do.
And, BTW, Apple HATES the idea that their software runs on some ugly POS.

C'est tout.
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 01:04 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by MacsRgr8 View Post


IF Apple were to license OS X to 3rd parties, they must find a way to make money off it, AND try not to loose income over their own hardware.
That'll be tough to do.
And, BTW, Apple HATES the idea that their software runs on some ugly POS.

C'est tout.
Spot on. Especially that last bit.
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 01:32 PM   #110
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Here's one reason why not - almost every Mac Pro owner will also buy a Macbook (Air / Pro), an iPhone, and probably an iPad.

If you need a workstation, you'll get a HP / Dell. Then you'll want a Toshiba laptop, so you can use the same software (not switching between Mac / PC versions). You won't have a Mac computer, so why not try an Android phone, which is bound to be cheaper?
I agree to a point. An individual who owns a Mac Pro has proven that they have funds to own other Apple products. And the owner of a Mac Pro almost certainly is going to need a laptop... I'd guess a MBP, if I was betting .... Plus perhaps an iPad and iPhone. So I agree with that....

But. How many Mac Pros are bought at the company level? Those MP users are just using the tools provided by the company, and will likely own other Apple products at the same level as the general population. And it's unlikely that the company is providing MBPs to those employees.

I sometimes wish Apple released sales figures with a bit more detail.

But here is something else.... didn't Apple start opening Business Support centres in some of the Apple Stores? If they are supporting clusters of Mac Pros in companies, then they may be making enough money off the support contracts that it makes a lot of sense to keep the Mac Pro. Does anybody here have any insights into what and how the business support centres are doing? There may be clues there?
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 01:40 PM   #111
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Does anybody here have any insights into what and how the business support centres are doing? There may be clues there?
They are a joke. Unless of course you only run your business off Apple branded software like iWork. I had to set something up not too long ago for some out of state work. Chatted for a few minutes and realized they won't do anything relating to 3rd party software. What? Not even Office 2011 or similar. Not Adobe, nothing. So in a professional environment what good is it? To have a "just passed an exam" genius come to your business and not understand how to configure for RADIUS WPA2-Enterprise? Their level 3 network techs were baffled. I hung up. You can have support at over $25,000+ a year for real business needs. That has always been there. Otherwise use the consultant network.
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 01:47 PM   #112
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Long time lurker, first time poster here. I know there are a few threads on the Mac Pro already but my theme is different.

I don't want to endlessly argue about whether a Pro is coming or not.

Let's assume the Mac Pro is Dead. Finitto. Over. Now what?

I am a video editor and my working life has revolved around Macs for the last 12 years. I love them and what they offer me.

Would I be comfortable cutting a thirty second promo on an iMac? Sure why not.

Would I be comfortable cutting a 10 part series of hour long shows an iMac? NO f&*king chance!

So where does that leave me? I like the new FCPX a lot, and really don't want to go back to Avid - but what choice do any of us have?

Apple isn't the same company it was in the 70's or 80's or even 90's/early 00's.

Its management are different and have completely different agenda. Steve may have seen the value of keeping the faithful happy - but I am not sure the current line up do. Its very bizarre that they feel no obligation to tell us one way or the other as plenty of people's business's depend on their products.

I think traditional pros need to move on, but I am not sure where to head. The thought of going back to Windows after years away fills me with dread. And I don't know Linux well enough to comment.

Sounds like an opportunity waiting to happen for someone.

I hate to say it but, You have answered your own Question!
Avid on windows is really the only place to go right. I mean who else do you trust.


But here's something to bake your noodle.

If the Pro is dead then maybe apple will redo and release something like it later on.

Remember the Cube after they cancelled it 3 years later they released the Mini.
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 04:05 PM   #113
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They are a joke. Unless of course you only run your business off Apple branded software like iWork. ....
OK, well that answers that question.... thanks.
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 04:27 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by MacsRgr8 View Post
??
Jobs didn't just kill "the clones" because he felt so....
It was plain obvious that it was costing Apple money.
Apple makes money buy selling hardware. They try to sell the hardware by embedding gr8 software on it.
Being iOS / OS X or apps.

It's so different from Microsofts model: they make money buy selling software.

IF Apple were to license OS X to 3rd parties, they must find a way to make money off it, AND try not to loose income over their own hardware.
That'll be tough to do.
And, BTW, Apple HATES the idea that their software runs on some ugly POS.

C'est tout.
It's not a money thing. It's a principle thing. They're making a stand on principle that they don't license OS X to other companies because it makes other companies look better.

They don't want Dell leaching off Apple's marketing, especially in since Dell could use that to sell Windows tablets and Android phones to people they sell computers to. They want to make Dell associated with low quality hardware running crappy Windows. Allowing Dell (or any other company) to make machines running OS X makes that more... complicated. If Apple is willing to put their name behind a Dell box running OS X, well that's just one degree of separation past Apple putting their name behind the exact same hardware running Windows. It puts them in a very awkward spot of trying to sell the iMac against bland PC boxes, while supplying the software for bland PC boxes.

No where did I say it makes monetary sense or that it would be a bad move like you seem to be assuming. I'm just saying it's what Apple does, and from what I've heard, there are absolutely no plans to change that.

You do have to admit the clones were partly killed because Jobs loves controlling Apple's image as well.
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 04:33 PM   #115
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Will there be more used MacPro models on ebay after cancelation ??

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Originally Posted by Umbongo View Post
Yeah I think Dell and Lenovo have also abandoned workstations cause they haven't announced anything either.
Ok guys, just in case Apple will abandon the Mac Pro, the real big question now it this:

Will the price of used MacPro models on Ebay rise or go down?

Will there be more or less used MacPro models on Ebay after cancelation ???!!!!
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 04:46 PM   #116
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OK, well that answers that question.... thanks.
Look into it for yourself to see if it suits your needs. This was only for my specific needs at the time.
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 06:40 PM   #117
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Ok guys, just in case Apple will abandon the Mac Pro, the real big question now it this:

Will the price of used MacPro models on Ebay rise or go down?

Will there be more or less used MacPro models on Ebay after cancelation ???!!!!
For the short term existing supply will "churn" is my prediction. 1) I think there are a lot us who will pick up a 2010 Mac Pro earlier than we anticipated to replace our 2008s (earlier) if it's EOL'd, and 2) I think there a lot of people who are waiting a little past their normal replacement cycle to see if a new Mac Pro is announced. If it isn't they will also pick up a 2010 Mac Pro as a "better than the alternatives" system.

Obviously a lot of the replaced machines will end up on Ebay, but at the same time people with really old machines not enough budget to buy from Apple will be picking up the Ebay machines because - for them - an old Mac Pro is better than the alternatives.

I don't think anyone with a functioning Mac Pro will let it go just because of an EOL announcement. They'll just run it into the ground.

Long term I think the supply of Mac Pros will dry up.
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Look into it for yourself to see if it suits your needs. This was only for my specific needs at the time.
No need. I was just asking to see if we could get some insights from the business centres as to Mac Pro sales and supports to provide some fresh fodder into the purely hypothetical thread....
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 07:21 PM   #118
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It's not a money thing. It's a principle thing. They're making a stand on principle that they don't license OS X to other companies because it makes other companies look better.

They don't want Dell leaching off Apple's marketing, especially in since Dell could use that to sell Windows tablets and Android phones to people they sell computers to. They want to make Dell associated with low quality hardware running crappy Windows. Allowing Dell (or any other company) to make machines running OS X makes that more... complicated. If Apple is willing to put their name behind a Dell box running OS X, well that's just one degree of separation past Apple putting their name behind the exact same hardware running Windows. It puts them in a very awkward spot of trying to sell the iMac against bland PC boxes, while supplying the software for bland PC boxes.

No where did I say it makes monetary sense or that it would be a bad move like you seem to be assuming. I'm just saying it's what Apple does, and from what I've heard, there are absolutely no plans to change that.

You do have to admit the clones were partly killed because Jobs loves controlling Apple's image as well.
If Apple did license OSX to a third part PC maker it would only be for work station class models with Xeon processors. They wouldn't compete with the iMac's price point. They could even be an Apple product but made by a Chinese company for Apple. Pretty much like they do right now except Apple would farm out the engineering and design with final product approval and a cut of the profits.
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Old Apr 1, 2012, 11:28 PM   #119
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Oracle would be a horrible partner as a hardware "subcontractor". Who ever made that up needs to cut back on the drugs. Oracle hardware is oriented around selling Oracle software. Not Apple software. It is about as likely as Apple starting to sell Windows boxes. The model that Oracle is implementing is to copy Apple's systems model, but in the enterprise (i.e., $100K-10M) system space.

Neither Dell nor HP would not work either, but at least they don't have a complete competing software stack to sell. They do have a "Unix" alternative to sell already though and extremely deep dependencies on Windows. The "clone wars" are over. Done. Apple isn't going back there.
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Apple doesn't need a partner here (other than Intel). And having worked at Oracle for several years and knowing Larry, this assertion makes little sense to me.
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Za-wha?

Since when was Oracle in the desktop PC business?

More on topic: If Apple doesn't care about the Mac Pro, there is nothing to suggest they would care enough to give the pro line to another company.

I would hope they license OS X to Dell or something, but I just don't see it ever happening. It violates the holy directive from his Jobsness about licensing OS X, and again, it assumes they care.
I have been looking for the article but I can't seem to find it.

It was written around the time Apple discontinued the Xserve. The author suggested that Oracle was well-positioned to offer OSX enterprise alternatives and made a few points about why it could work. One of them was Jobs and Ellison being best buds, Oracle had bought Sun, and some more stuff I can't remember.

He never mentioned the MacPro as its demise was not an yet an issue then.
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Old Apr 2, 2012, 01:39 PM   #120
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The tone tone of the new Mac pro threads is going to start getting worse every week until they release something or cancel the line.
Rumors of the new iMac indicate a drastically thinner case. Everything is getting smaller and more mobile. I wonder what is in store for the mp? It sure would be nice to see some sort of love thrown this way. We certainly can imagine a nice package. That said, even Nividia is saying that Tablets will replace pc's. Maybe, but they are no where near powerfull enough yet or in the beast future for Amy heavy lifting.
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Old Apr 2, 2012, 02:18 PM   #121
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The tone tone of the new Mac pro threads is going to start getting worse every week until they release something or cancel the line.
Rumors of the new iMac indicate a drastically thinner case. Everything is getting smaller and more mobile. I wonder what is in store for the mp? It sure would be nice to see some sort of love thrown this way. We certainly can imagine a nice package. That said, even Nividia is saying that Tablets will replace pc's. Maybe, but they are no where near powerfull enough yet or in the beast future for Amy heavy lifting.
Hey if the rumor is true at least we can look forward to an anti-glare iMac again right? Anyone?
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Old Apr 2, 2012, 02:24 PM   #122
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Hey if the rumor is true at least we can look forward to an anti-glare iMac again right? Anyone?
Apparently - yes... according to rumours. It was just posted to the front page, ironically.
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Old Apr 2, 2012, 06:23 PM   #123
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Yeah I think Dell and Lenovo have also abandoned workstations cause they haven't announced anything either.
Dell is currently shipping E5-based machines. They are in the server line, I haven't seen any in the workstation lineup yet.

E5-2620's up to E5-2690's are available now.

Last edited by MatthewAMEL; Apr 2, 2012 at 06:29 PM.
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Old Apr 2, 2012, 07:05 PM   #124
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Dell is currently shipping E5-based machines. They are in the server line, I haven't seen any in the workstation lineup yet.

E5-2620's up to E5-2690's are available now.
Yeah I'm being sarcastic. 2 of the biggest companies who make X86 workstations (HP, Fujitsu) have announced E5 workstations, the other 3 (Apple, Dell, Lenovo) haven't. Dell and HP have 2 week ship times still on their servers. The notion that Apple's silence means anything is daft to me.
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Old Apr 2, 2012, 08:42 PM   #125
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If PCIe Thunderbolt boxes actually work, that could be the stake in the heart of the Mac Pro.
Good luck expanding to 512-1024gb of ECC RAM via thunderbolt.
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