Apple Gains Certification to Sell Brazilian-Assembled iPad 2, New iPad Certification Pending

[jonnyb]

Originally Posted by Mattie Num Nums

I'm sick of seeing this. Steves dead. Move on. Apple is in good hands.

I was mocking the meme. I'm heartily sick of it too. I just thought that someone had already said this about 'resolutionary' so I thought I'd better say it again now that it had been said again in a different language.

So, to sum up: I was being ironic.

[gkarris]

Must be nice to live in a country that cares enough to make companies make the product they plan on selling there IN that country...

Did I just say that?

[fruitycups]

Brasil!!! 2014

[MarcosSilva]

What about Iphone 16BG for US$ 1.117,00 and Ipad 2 US$ 899,00????

[educate9]

Originally Posted by Teste

I swear I still don't see the point in that factory. Apple isn't likely going to reduce the price of the iPads produced here, just as they haven't reduced the price of the iPhones, so for the consumer it doesn't really make a difference (actually, the only difference it could make is in quality, as I wouldn't be surprised if quality control is far worse here than in China). It's going to increase Apple's profit per unit sold, since the money the consumers paid that went to fuel taxes is now going to Apple, but the cost of building a new factory here was likely very high (and all our politicians ought to have asked for very high bribes in order to allow for Apple's factory to be build). All the security measures taken in China to prevent leaks simply don't exist here. And production is likely going to be limited to a few products, given the bureaucracy required in order to make stuff here.

Why did Apple even bother with that factory?

Brazil and the US have major long-standing issues regarding immigration and trade. It is very hard to obtain work permission in Brazil for US citizens, and likewise here for Brazilians. This is called "reciprocity", (principle that favours, benefits, or penalties that are granted by one state to the citizens or legal entities of another, should be returned in kind). Who started it? Not sure... And being in Brazil, you probably are aware of all this.

So in regard to trade between the US and Brazil, things are and have been quite tense. In order for Apple to access that market, and not have huge import taxes, they must create a plant there and make their products there.
Large populations such as China and Brazil can take this kind of stand, because they know they can. The US does the same thing, and in fact we most likely invented that attitude here.

So why does Apple even bother with Brazil?
Brazil has the fastest growing affluent population in our hemisphere, & is the 5th most populated country in the World, everyone there wants Apple products, - so Apple had to make a deal to access that market. As far as security goes? You won't find plants there creating new products..., only products that have been out for a while and torn apart by technicians already...

I sincerely hope that the price comes down for Brazil, as I have many Brazilian friends who are sick with the high prices there for many things. I think that it has to become reasonable over time. Apple is a very smart company in it's pricing strategies, and I don't think they want to risk looking like they are "gauging" the Brazil population.

[Mattie Num Nums]

Originally Posted by educate9

Brazil and the US have major long-standing issues regarding immigration and trade. It is very hard to obtain work permission in Brazil for US citizens, and likewise here for Brazilians. This is called "reciprocity", (principle that favours, benefits, or penalties that are granted by one state to the citizens or legal entities of another, should be returned in kind). Who started it? Not sure... And being in Brazil, you probably are aware of all this.

So in regard to trade between the US and Brazil, things are and have been quite tense. In order for Apple to access that market, and not have huge import taxes, they must create a plant there and make their products there.
Large populations such as China and Brazil can take this kind of stand, because they know they can. The US does the same thing, and in fact we most likely invented that attitude here.

So why does Apple even bother with Brazil?
Brazil has the fastest growing affluent population in our hemisphere, & is the 5th most populated country in the World, everyone there wants Apple products, - so Apple had to make a deal to access that market. As far as security goes? You won't find plants there creating new products..., only products that have been out for a while and torn apart by technicians already...

I sincerely hope that the price comes down for Brazil, as I have many Brazilian friends who are sick with the high prices there for many things. I think that it has to become reasonable over time. Apple is a very smart company in it's pricing strategies, and I don't think they want to risk looking like they are "gauging" the Brazil population.

Ironic Brazilians are drooling over iPhones when poverty is out of control. Looks like American priorities are moving to other countries.

[hushypushy]

Originally Posted by acslater017

I'd love to learn how all of Apple's various tag lines and puns work in different languages...Any of our international MacRumors members have any insights?

The Japanese one is quite boring IMO: 目を見えて革命的。新しいiPad.

Which means something like, A Revolution You Can See. The New iPad.

[GekkePrutser]

Here in the EU, it's all about 'open markets', free access, companies may move wherever they want. Protectionism is seen by the government as something bad because they have eternal faith in the holy competition. And what do we get? All jobs are moved to China and we're in a massive recession.

Brazil protects its economy by hassling international companies with large import taxes, and they get their jobs back.

Sounds like we're doing something wrong over here.

[hector4drake]

Originally Posted by hushypushy

The Japanese one is quite boring IMO: 目を見えて革命的。新しいiPad.

Which means something like, A Revolution You Can See. The New iPad.

It's actually "Revolutionary to the eyes" or something like that.... It's still boring though

[IJ Reilly]

Originally Posted by MarcosSilva

What about Iphone 16BG for US$ 1.117,00 and Ipad 2 US$ 899,00????

Because you don't spend or earn U.S. dollars. See this:

Originally Posted by IJ Reilly

Awhile back I got into a debate over why the cost of the iPhone in Brazil is "so much higher than in the U.S." It turns out that the Brazilian real is one of the world's most highly valued currencies today, and the U.S. dollar is very weak. As a result, virtually any item priced in U.S. dollars is going to look very cheap to Brazilians.

[hushypushy]

Originally Posted by hector4drake

It's actually "Revolutionary to the eyes" or something like that.... It's still boring though

Are you a native speaker? I'm asking because I want some clarification (I have a BA in Japanese but ads and slogans always elude me). My alternate translation would be "Visibly Revolutionary".

I wonder who writes their stuff...they need better puns.

[ChrisA]

Originally Posted by Gemütlichkeit

I could see apple building products here in the states. THe mid west has such a low cost of living it wouldn't be that hard.

yet battling with unions most likely kills that idea.

The only way to build an iPhone in the US is if the device were designed to be build using robots. But as designed the iPhone needs hundreds of hand assembly steps. It could be redesigned for automated assembly but I bet you end up with a bigger, clunkier phone.

Cost in China are going up. One day, maybe 30 years from now China will reach US standards and then there will be no advantage to building in China

[achtung!]

Originally Posted by acslater017

I'd love to learn how all of Apple's various tag lines and puns work in different languages...Any of our international MacRumors members have any insights?

In portuguese (from portugal) the word "resolutionário" works pretty bad. the english version sounds way better! but generally most headlines, leads or tags from apple are well adapted to portuguese. in my native language, this literal translation of two mixed words, lacks finess and sounds cheap!

cheers

[NumberNine]

I like Brazilians!

[LeandrodaFL]

It doesn't matter where its assembled, the ipad will be the same. It may be chinese/brasilian, but the build quality its the same, its foxcon quality, the same we're used to for the last years. They could have build the factory in the moon, it would be the exact same quality.

Regarding import taxes, the brasilian ipad will only make a difference for the brasilian market itself, where it will be cheaper. Apple can virtualy sell the brasilian ipad in any other country for the same price as the chinese.

And regarding ipods/iphones produced in brazil, the legal agreement terminates taxes only for ipads. So no cheap ipods/iphones for brasilian market. There has never been an agreement to do so. The fact that ipods and iphone are produced in the factoy is due to the fact that since its a foxcon factory, it ends up also producing stuff like that, and besides, was a nice warm up for the brasilian crew to get used to assemble touch units.

[entropys]

Originally Posted by GekkePrutser

Here in the EU, it's all about 'open markets', free access, companies may move wherever they want. Protectionism is seen by the government as something bad because they have eternal faith in the holy competition. And what do we get? All jobs are moved to China and we're in a massive recession.

Brazil protects its economy by hassling international companies with large import taxes, and they get their jobs back.

Sounds like we're doing something wrong over here.

Are you nuts? The EU wrote the book on protection. Just ask anyone trying to sell agricultural products to you. Anyway, the EU is most certainly not a poster child for economic policy, or democracy, come to that.

Because of this protection, Brazilian i-products will cost more and be last year's model. Locally made products will still cost more than the international price, with the economic rent generated from this higher price shared between Apple (lion's share) and the (very) few workers it employs to do final assembly of products largely made elsewhere.

[UnusedLoginID]

Originally Posted by IJ Reilly

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcosSilva
What about Iphone 16BG for US$ 1.117,00 and Ipad 2 US$ 899,00????

Because you don't spend or earn U.S. dollars. See this:

Originally Posted by IJ Reilly
Awhile back I got into a debate over why the cost of the iPhone in Brazil is "so much higher than in the U.S." It turns out that the Brazilian real is one of the world's most highly valued currencies today, and the U.S. dollar is very weak. As a result, virtually any item priced in U.S. dollars is going to look very cheap to Brazilians.

The affordability of a product is defined by the number of work-days, work-weeks and sometimes work-months a person in Brazil would have to work to afford that product. Converting to US $ is fallacious becuase, well, currency rates fluctuate. So I always look at the price in the local currency.
The iPad 2 starts at 1,399 Reais.
The min. wage in Brazil is 622 Reais. You do the math...

Min. wage in the US is $7.25/hr, i.e. $1,160 a month The iPad 2 starts at $399.

Tells the story...

[IJ Reilly]

Originally Posted by UnusedLoginID

The affordability of a product is defined by the number of work-days, work-weeks and sometimes work-months a person in Brazil would have to work to afford that product. Converting to US $ is fallacious becuase, well, currency rates fluctuate. So I always look at the price in the local currency.
The iPad 2 starts at 1,399 Reais.
The min. wage in Brazil is 622 Reais. You do the math...

Min. wage in the US is $7.25/hr, i.e. $1,160 a month The iPad 2 starts at $399.

Tells the story...

It can be defined in any number of ways, but the important thing to keep in mind is that products are priced for local markets. The currency converters are imagining some sort of world price, as if iPhones and iPads are priced like oil or some other commodity.

[jw2002]

Originally Posted by Teste

I swear I still don't see the point in that factory.

The point is to sell iPhones *IN* Brazil and get around the various trade restrictions and tax issues. Also to the person who mentioned poverty in Brazil: yes, that is a problem. However, in the past 10 years Brazil has greatly improved on the income inequality front and has grown their middle class by several 10s of millions. At least that's a step in the right direction.

[Teste]

Originally Posted by jw2002

The point is to sell iPhones *IN* Brazil and get around the various trade restrictions and tax issues.

What for? To lower the prices for consumers? For now there has been no sign that prices will be dropped. To increase the profit margin of Apple? The cost of making an entire new factory is going to take quite a while to be paid, so said increase in profit is going to take a while. Considering how it's not unlikely that Apple would only produce the lower end devices here (it's not surprising that the first device to be aproved is the 16GB iPad 2, instead of anything newer or more powerful), and that the quality of the products will be inferior to those from China, I don't see much future for Apple's factory in Brazil.

[MagnusVonMagnum]

And people say that import tariffs don't work. It got Brazil Apple manufacturing plants in their own country. Our lack of regulation gets us our Apple manufacturing moved FROM the U.S. to China. I guarantee if we had a tariff on US exports made in China (or any other 3rd world country with cheap labor) into the U.S. that Apple never would have moved assembly there in the first place.

And the only people that bad-mouth unions are the ones that aren't in one. Some of you have NO IDEA the crap management tries to get away with and all the BS you'd get screwed on if there wasn't someone watching your back and I don't mean wage increases, etc. I'm talking about firing someone for no (good) reason, favoritism for overtime or scheduling, unsafe working conditions, etc. Good luck taking that to court. Our court system is horrible (good for the lawyers to suck you dry over huge extended long red tape BS, though).

[felipe3d]

Ok, it's a factory, but not as most people think about factories.
It's just the most simple possible assembly process, something like the last 2 steps before putting the product in the box.
I see the place, it is small, actually is the same plant who does Samsung cheep cell phones. It's a small operation.

But why do that ? To avoid taxes.
importation taxes on final products are high an easy to enforce, taxes on parts are cheeper an difficult to enforce.

So i'm saying Apple will smuggle parts or fraud taxes ? Yes and no.
It's not Apple who gonna do it, it's a Brazilian company owned by one of the richest guys in the world Eike Batista.
This is a comum practice in Brazil, many companies do that and Apple is joining the group.

The price is gonna be the same, actually much higher then U.S.

The government s backing this up with a huge loan from Brazil development bank (BNDS) to score some points.

[hector4drake]

Originally Posted by hushypushy

Are you a native speaker? I'm asking because I want some clarification (I have a BA in Japanese but ads and slogans always elude me). My alternate translation would be "Visibly Revolutionary".

I wonder who writes their stuff...they need better puns.

Yes, I am! But your tranlastion is better though! (although I always find it difficult finding the best words when translating LOL)

[Discaciate]

CNet has published a very good article about the brazilian Foxconn factories:

Could Foxconn's factory in Brazil be a model for Apple production?

The same info also appears in the brazilian MacMagazine website. MacMagazine says that early reports point at an extremely good first production results, with high worker productivity.

MacMagazine article (in Portuguese)