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Old Jun 14, 2012, 06:09 PM   #1
Tanjecterly
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Civ IV or Civ V on new 2012 MBA or Retina Pro

I am on the verge of purchasing a new Apple laptop after the WWDC, but I am uncertain as to which is best for me.

I game lightly. When I do, it is games like Civilization IV. I have not yet played Civilization V. I have two related (if you want, inverse) questions that I hope you can help me with.

I was wondering about the new MBA. Would it be able to handle Civ V? From what I have seen, the 2011 MBAs couldn't handle the graphics for Civ V. Would the new Intel 4000 combined with the 8MB memory of the upgraded 2012 MBA be able to handle Civ V?

My next question is about Civ V and the Retina Pro. Do you think that Aspyr will upgrade Civ V to Retina standard?

I am assuming that if I game with Civ IV on the Retina Pro, there will be a lot of graphical disparities that make it unattractive to game with. But if it's just like Civ II, I really don't mind. But was wondering if there were some thoughts on that?

Also, I'm guessing that Aspyr will not have any motivation to make Civ IV into Retina version?

Thanks in advance.
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Old Jun 14, 2012, 06:27 PM   #2
load97
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I'd like to know too!
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 05:32 AM   #3
AtticusRyan
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The game appears to want to play fine -- it is perfectly fast and no lag, however there are artefacts all over the screen, probably a result of the upscaling.
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 05:45 AM   #4
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Also, I'm guessing that Aspyr will not have any motivation to make Civ IV into Retina version?
Safe bet.

Quote:
I was wondering about the new MBA. Would it be able to handle Civ V?
Up to a point. All Civ games bog down depending on how much of the map you've revealed, how many opponents, etc.
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 06:36 AM   #5
Tanjecterly
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The game appears to want to play fine -- it is perfectly fast and no lag, however there are artefacts all over the screen, probably a result of the upscaling.
Which game is this and which laptop are you using? Retina Pro with Civ V?

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Safe bet.



Up to a point. All Civ games bog down depending on how much of the map you've revealed, how many opponents, etc.
The MBA should be able to handle Civ V with 8MB memory and a fast SSD on medium?
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 08:36 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by AtticusRyan View Post
The game appears to want to play fine -- it is perfectly fast and no lag, however there are artefacts all over the screen, probably a result of the upscaling.
Even on an iMac w HD5670 there are artifacts. I think it's more to do with the graphics being originally designed for DirectX then ported over.

Playing on a standard map seems to help, although even then you'll find units are sometimes shown a few hexes away from their actual location, and the checkerboard effect is very pronounced on huge maps.
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 09:26 AM   #7
AtticusRyan
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Originally Posted by Tanjecterly View Post
Which game is this and which laptop are you using? Retina Pro with Civ V?
Yes Retina Pro 8GB / 2.6 and Civ V.

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Originally Posted by Queso View Post
Even on an iMac w HD5670 there are artifacts.
Are these artefacts more pronounced than usual? http://imgur.com/xLy3u
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 09:32 AM   #8
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Even running under windows, without a top-notch graphics card, that corruption still rears its ugly head eventually. The DirectX to openGL conversion means that the issue is more pronounced for Mac users, though.

It helps to play on lower graphics settings and use windowed mode, in my experience. There's also a tweak that can be applied to one of the files that allows more textures to be preloaded, as long as your card has plenty of VRAM. The file is:

~/Documents/Aspyr/Sid Meier's Civilization 5/GraphicsSettingsDX9.ini

and there are 4 edits to make so that the "Terrain Page in" sections look like this:

Code:
; Terrain Page in Rate
Terrain64Chunks = 4096

; Terrain Page in Rate
Terrain128Chunks = 4096

; Terrain Page in Rate
Terrain256Chunks = 4096

; Terrain Page in Rate
Terrain512Chunks = 4096
Even with this tweak (on my 1st gen Mac Pro 8 core 2.66 with radeon 5770HD) I still find myself having to set low-graphics, 1650x1080 windowed mode towards the end of huge maps.
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 03:34 PM   #9
The "Dude"
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I'm sure it will run great on the rMBP, but I would recommend playing it via Windows and Bootcamp (when Apple releases the drivers). I doubt they will release a retina version of a two year old game that has a TON of graphics. I also believe that the Windows version will have immediate access to the Gods & Kings expansion, which from what I've seen will turn a somewhat lackluster Civ 5 into possibly the best one yet.
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 04:24 PM   #10
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I also believe that the Windows version will have immediate access to the Gods & Kings expansion, which from what I've seen will turn a somewhat lackluster Civ 5 into possibly the best one yet.
It will be available on the same day as PC for the Mac.

As for support, we've got a bit of testing to do before we can say that the new video cards are supported.
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 04:45 PM   #11
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It will be available on the same day as PC for the Mac.

As for support, we've got a bit of testing to do before we can say that the new video cards are supported.
Hey, there, any comments on upgrading Civ IV?? For the Retina Pro?
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 05:30 PM   #12
AspyrRyan
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I don't know of any plans to update Civ IV at this time, and I haven't had the opportunity to see how it behaves right now.
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 06:36 PM   #13
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It will be available on the same day as PC for the Mac.
That's awesome. Will that inlcude the patch windows just had too? Sorry if this is thread hijack real quick.
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 06:48 PM   #14
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That's awesome. Will that inlcude the patch windows just had too? Sorry if this is thread hijack real quick.
That patch is required for the expansion, so yes.
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 07:12 PM   #15
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That patch is required for the expansion, so yes.
You guys rock. Keep up the good work on mac gaming front.
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Old Jun 19, 2012, 12:35 PM   #16
Jensen G
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Has anyone here tried playing Civ 5 on the new Macbook Air with HD 4000 graphics? I've already heard that Asypr is not yet supporting them since they don't yet have a new Air to test with, but has anyone played successfully with the new machines anyway?
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Old Jun 21, 2012, 12:58 PM   #17
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No but am wondering as well. Have you?
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Old Jun 21, 2012, 01:05 PM   #18
Jensen G
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No but am wondering as well. Have you?
OK, I got my Macbook Air 2012 i5 w/ 8GB RAM, 256GB SSD and HD 4000 graphics. Civ 5 is definitely playable. I am playing a game on a medium map and at default settings (where all whiz-bang effects are basically set to lowest) it's smooth when zoomed in, can get a bit jerky zoomed out but perfectly playable. Yay!!
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Old Jun 21, 2012, 01:22 PM   #19
AspyrRyan
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So, all you folks with fancy Retina MBPs, I could use some information.

If you're crashing, please let me know what settings (map size, map type, and video settings) you are using. Also, it would be useful to know what you have the desktop resolution set to (Scaled, Best for Retina, etc).

Please let me know about any other problems as well.
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Old Jul 2, 2012, 08:44 AM   #20
tarjan
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Ryan, Civ 5 is crashing for me. 2.6/8gb store purchase. Scaled one to the right of best for retina.

Settings in game are full 2880 and everything set high. The game works for about 20 minutes then crashes without warning. Standard world, no other options changed from box stock.

No editing of any config file.
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Old Jul 2, 2012, 10:10 AM   #21
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I'm pretty sure that everything set as high as it can go leads to bad times. I'd recommend dropping down a few settings, particularly Fog of War and Overlay detail.
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Old Jul 2, 2012, 11:47 PM   #22
tarjan
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Will do, other than the crashing it runs just fine If you can work with apple to fix these crashes, it should be pretty amazing for mac gaming.
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Old Jul 4, 2012, 11:16 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by AspyrRyan View Post
So, all you folks with fancy Retina MBPs, I could use some information.

If you're crashing, please let me know what settings (map size, map type, and video settings) you are using. Also, it would be useful to know what you have the desktop resolution set to (Scaled, Best for Retina, etc).

Please let me know about any other problems as well.
I just downloaded CIV V to my new 2.6/8GB/512GB Retina MBP last night and so far I haven't gotten it to do anything but crash at the resolutions and settings I'm wanting to play at. For reference my desktop on the retina MBP is set to Scaled mode with "More Space" selected which sets the resolution to 1920x1200.

In Civ V I've tried the max 2880x1800 in full screen and 1920x1200 in windowed and both crash with the settings all as high as they go or with the settings all on medium. I was only able to get it to load a game and play through several turns if I leave the settings on defaults which puts everything on low.

1920x1200 also doesn't work at all in full screen mode. When you select 1920x1200 in full screen the cursor has to be moved about an inch above what you want to select in order for it to highlight it. It's strange that 1920x1200 won't work in full screen but 2880x1800 or lower resolutions will.

Also when I try to set all the graphics details to max settings there's three of them that default back to low from high/medium after I exit Civ V and load it back up to apply the new settings. Those three are Shadow Quality, Terrain Tessellation Level, and Terrain Shadow Quality.

I was really looking forward to purchasing the new Gods and Kings Expansion pack and maxing out Civ V on my new retina MacBook Pro because the hardware should have no trouble in handling it but obviously there are a number of bugs to be worked out before that can happen.

Last edited by burningrave101; Jul 4, 2012 at 03:19 PM.
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Old Jul 4, 2012, 11:48 AM   #24
tarjan
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I have the same issue with the inch off issue at some resolutions. Really weird.

I've played around with the settings and it actually works best and the longest with everything set on high at 2880. Kooky, but...
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Old Jul 4, 2012, 04:53 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by burningrave101 View Post
I just downloaded CIV V to my new 2.6/8GB/512GB Retina MBP last night and so far I haven't gotten it to do anything but crash at the resolutions and settings I'm wanting to play at. For reference my desktop on the retina MBP is set to Scaled mode with "More Space" selected which sets the resolution to 1920x1200.
I'm sorry to hear about your problems with the game. Did you buy it on Steam or the Mac App Store? If you bought it on Steam, I'd recommend trying boot camp and playing it in Windows.

While more games are becoming available for Macs now, OS X seems to be far behind the curve for gaming/3D rendering compared to Windows where Nvidia can release driver updates as frequently as they like, rather than relying on OS updates from Apple.
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