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Old Sep 30, 2012, 09:46 PM   #1
patent10021
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Need a new logo. How much do you charge?

Helping someone design a new WP site for their small interior design business. A completely new design for mobile devices. Ditching Flash.

Business Name: Creatif Design Resource
Domain: creatifdesign.com

Will probably be using this WP theme.

The logo can incorporate the entire name or just the domain name. The idea of the logo being incorporated in the name i.e. the TechCrunch logo with the missing pixel together with TC is interesting. Open to any ideas really.

This is just a small operation so the job would probably suit a designer who would be willing to toss around a few ideas and we could pay for your services if we like a particular logo. So how would that work? We would be paying the designer for the AI/PS files?

Please reply on this thread so it's easier to keep track and have a discussion going with other members.



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Old Oct 1, 2012, 12:50 AM   #2
12dylan34
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I think that you haven't gotten any replies because you implied that people would only be paid if you like one of their designs. Generally, designers work by the hour, so you're paying them for their time. A custom logo isn't really like a part for a car that you can just return if you don't like it and the store can sell it to someone else. I realize that you called specifically for someone who would be ok with this, but it's sort of tough to get into something when you don't know if it'll be a waste of your time or not in the end. Same thing goes for designers who charge a flat rate for logos. You tell them what you want, they make something, you go through a set number of revisions if necessary, then you pay them whether you like the logo or not. If not, you start paying them by the hour for additional revisions.

Not insulting you or saying that it's your fault, just saying why I think this has gone unanswered. My bad if somebody has PM'd you. In my opinion, however, it would be in bad practice for you to do business on these terms.

Also, I like the simple text logo that's already on the site that you linked to. I wouldn't see it in bad taste just to stick with that.
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Old Oct 1, 2012, 02:05 AM   #3
patent10021
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Originally Posted by 12dylan34 View Post
I think that you haven't gotten any replies because you implied that people would only be paid if you like one of their designs. Generally, designers work by the hour, so you're paying them for their time. A custom logo isn't really like a part for a car that you can just return if you don't like it and the store can sell it to someone else. I realize that you called specifically for someone who would be ok with this, but it's sort of tough to get into something when you don't know if it'll be a waste of your time or not in the end. Same thing goes for designers who charge a flat rate for logos. You tell them what you want, they make something, you go through a set number of revisions if necessary, then you pay them whether you like the logo or not. If not, you start paying them by the hour for additional revisions.

Not insulting you or saying that it's your fault, just saying why I think this has gone unanswered. My bad if somebody has PM'd you. In my opinion, however, it would be in bad practice for you to do business on these terms.

Also, I like the simple text logo that's already on the site that you linked to. I wouldn't see it in bad taste just to stick with that.
Thanks for replying. Yeah I sorta figured that might be a problem. So clients pay/hr even though they might not like any designs offered over 10 hrs? I guess it's like buying a dinner at a restaurant. You might not like it, but you gotta pay Don't some designers accept something upfront then go from there?

You know what. I do like the text only logo. I remember looking for a long time to find that font too.



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Old Oct 1, 2012, 04:57 AM   #4
12dylan34
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Originally Posted by patent10021 View Post
Thanks for replying. Yeah I sorta figured that might be a problem. So clients pay/hr even though they might not like any designs offered over 10 hrs? I guess it's like buying a dinner at a restaurant. You might not like it, but you gotta pay Don't some designers accept something upfront then go from there?

You know what. I do like the text only logo. I remember looking for a long time to find that font too.

.
Yeah, I'd probably stick with the text logo. I like it. And I think the idea is that you say you want something, the designer comes back with some options for you, you choose one of them to improve upon, then they do some revisions to it until it's what you want. I don't think that I've heard of a designer just giving up when the client says that they don't like a round of logos; you almost always end up with a product that at least the client is happy with. It's not always a take it or leave it kind of thing, revisions and suggestions are definitely involved.

Since its all part of the design process, I think it makes sense to pay hourly along the way.

I thought that this was pertinent: http://theoatmeal.com/comics/design_changes
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Old Oct 1, 2012, 07:25 AM   #5
960design
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$500

Process:
1) You pay
2) We design
3) You pick the one you like
4) We turn over everything, including the rights
5) You're happy or we give your money back

Probably best to work with someone in your area, and hourly is common practice. $500/gets you about 10 hours work, anywhere between 10 - 30 logos to choose from, depending on how well you answer the prep sheet.
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Old Oct 1, 2012, 07:48 AM   #6
GoCubsGo
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^ What he said.

And aside from losing flash, can't you re-design the site the same way without the flash? I like the site very much, flash excluded. One small change would be a slight increase in font. It is quite small when viewed on a 20" and 30" display.
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Old Oct 1, 2012, 09:12 AM   #7
lucasgladding
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To the OP:

What you're describing is spec work.

I agree with everything 960 design said except #5. If you have a money-back guarantee, you're already doing spec work.

In some ways, the dinner analogy works. When you choose a restaurant, you look to see how clean the restaurant is, read the menu, check the prices, see what waiters/waitresses are delivering, watch the reactions of people leaving the restaurant, etc. Of course, some of this is subconscious. Once you're confident that the restaurant is somewhere you want to eat, you place your order. If you order something you realize you didn't want halfway through the meal, you go again and order something different. Conversely, if your waitress is rude and unknowledgeable, you might leave before ordering anything.
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Old Oct 1, 2012, 11:34 AM   #8
fig
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Originally Posted by lucasgladding View Post
To the OP:

What you're describing is spec work.

I agree with everything 960 design said except #5. If you have a money-back guarantee, you're already doing spec work.

In some ways, the dinner analogy works. When you choose a restaurant, you look to see how clean the restaurant is, read the menu, check the prices, see what waiters/waitresses are delivering, watch the reactions of people leaving the restaurant, etc. Of course, some of this is subconscious. Once you're confident that the restaurant is somewhere you want to eat, you place your order. If you order something you realize you didn't want halfway through the meal, you go again and order something different. Conversely, if your waitress is rude and unknowledgeable, you might leave before ordering anything.
That's a decent analogy. Ideally you're reading reviews beforehand or talking with other folks who have been there to see if they liked their meal.

In extreme cases you might demand a refund or ask to have something comped because your meal was terrible, but generally speaking if you've done your homework you'll be pretty satisfied.
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Old Oct 1, 2012, 05:42 PM   #9
R1PPER
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I normally charge friends £250 - £350 for an ID this is generally more than just a logo. But for commercial work your looking at about £350 a day.
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Old Oct 1, 2012, 07:41 PM   #10
lucidmedia
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Originally Posted by 960design View Post
$500

5) You're happy or we give your money back
I agree with the above list with the exception of #5...

If you are not happy with the way the project is going, you pay a kill fee to end the project early, but the designer gets paid for labor to date.
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 10:54 AM   #11
definitive
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 960design View Post
$500

Process:
1) You pay
2) We design
3) You pick the one you like
4) We turn over everything, including the rights
5) You're happy or we give your money back

Probably best to work with someone in your area, and hourly is common practice. $500/gets you about 10 hours work, anywhere between 10 - 30 logos to choose from, depending on how well you answer the prep sheet.

can you please go more into the detail about number 4? how do you turn the rights over to the client?
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Old Oct 25, 2012, 07:08 AM   #12
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4) We turn over everything, including the rights
§ 201 . Ownership of copyright

(a) Initial Ownership. — Copyright in a work protected under this title vests initially in the author or authors of the work. The authors of a joint work are coowners of copyright in the work.

(b) Works Made for Hire. — In the case of a work made for hire, the employer or other person for whom the work was prepared is considered the author for purposes of this title, and, unless the parties have expressly agreed otherwise in a written instrument signed by them, owns all of the rights comprised in the copyright.

(c) Contributions to Collective Works. — Copyright in each separate contribution to a collective work is distinct from copyright in the collective work as a whole, and vests initially in the author of the contribution. In the absence of an express transfer of the copyright or of any rights under it, the owner of copyright in the collective work is presumed to have acquired only the privilege of reproducing and distributing the contribution as part of that particular collective work, any revision of that collective work, and any later collective work in the same series.

(d) Transfer of Ownership. —

(1) The ownership of a copyright may be transferred in whole or in part by any means of conveyance or by operation of law, and may be bequeathed by will or pass as personal property by the applicable laws of intestate succession.

(2) Any of the exclusive rights comprised in a copyright, including any subdivision of any of the rights specified by section 106, may be transferred as provided by clause (1) and owned separately. The owner of any particular exclusive right is entitled, to the extent of that right, to all of the protection and remedies accorded to the copyright owner by this title.

(e) Involuntary Transfer. — When an individual author's ownership of a copyright, or of any of the exclusive rights under a copyright, has not previously been transferred voluntarily by that individual author, no action by any governmental body or other official or organization purporting to seize, expropriate, transfer, or exercise rights of ownership with respect to the copyright, or any of the exclusive rights under a copyright, shall be given effect under this title, except as provided under title 11.2

...

§ 204 . Execution of transfers of copyright ownership

(a) A transfer of copyright ownership, other than by operation of law, is not valid unless an instrument of conveyance, or a note or memorandum of the transfer, is in writing and signed by the owner of the rights conveyed or such owner's duly authorized agent.

(b) A certificate of acknowledgment is not required for the validity of a transfer, but is prima facie evidence of the execution of the transfer if —

(1) in the case of a transfer executed in the United States, the certificate is issued by a person authorized to administer oaths within the United States; or

(2) in the case of a transfer executed in a foreign country, the certificate is issued by a diplomatic or consular officer of the United States, or by a person authorized to administer oaths whose authority is proved by a certificate of such an officer.


google us copyright laws AND speak to your lawyer!

hoping this helps
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