External Thunderbolt GPU for Mac Mini...

What cards would fit in there, in terms of providing a substantial performance increase I wonder. Does TB provide enough bandwidth for these cards to be pretty effective.

Read up more:
OWC Michael
September 24, 2012 at 11:18 am
Currently there are no graphics cards in the compatibility list: http://eshop.macsales.com/tech_center/Thunderbolt/PCIe_Compatibility/

Guess not

With the low spec on the mini graphics card I'm sure it won't be long until there is a viable solution. There could be a huge market for such a solution. It could take a huge chunk out of the imac and mac pro market.

This was being discussed elsewhere, although I don't remember which thread. There are two problems:

1. External GPUs in Thunderbolt enclosures work in Windows, but not OS X, because there are no drivers, and Apple are not going to provide any or allow development.

2. Even if it did work, by the time you buy a Mac mini, an enclosure, and a card to go in it, the cost is huge - so much so that you may as well have bought a PC with a big kick-ass graphics card in it, which would give you much better performance anyway.

It's a nice idea - I'd love a Mac mini with a top-line graphics card! - but I think this is a dead end, unfortunately.

The performance is great! Toms Hardware did a test with such a setup a while ago and came out with only about 8% performance drop on a high-end card (HD 6970) compared to connecting it via PCIe. I don't know, but if anyone would care making drivers for those things, it could be a HUGE performance increase.

As for size -- you can hide it under your desk and everybody thinks your Mini is the most powerful computer in the world.

zen said:

1. External GPUs in Thunderbolt enclosures work in Windows, but not OS X, because there are no drivers, and Apple are not going to provide any or allow development.

Click to expand...

Of course not, why would they allow that, then they couldnt sell you a Mac Pro for all your gaming needs!

belltree said:

Well sadly the new Mac Mini has not delivered on our hopes for a descent discrete GPU. This being the case are there any options out there yet for an external thunderbolt connected GPU?

IIRC there were a couple of vendors with such a product in the works earlier this year but I have yet to see anything on the market.

Edit. I just found the below and boy are they expensive. Almost $400 without any video card, just the expansion bay:

http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/Thunderbolt/PCIe_Chassis/Mercury_Helios/
https://secure1.sonnettech.com/index.php?cPath=139_141&osCsid=20a60556b1703af06b910e638d2f564b


Anyone used either of the above with a Mac Mini?

Click to expand...

Here is one for $140
http://www.hwtools.net/Adapter/TH05.html

It would be interesting to see if a Mac Pro GPU would work as OSX already has the drivers built in. The only other constraint is power output, a lot of these Thunderbolt to PCI houses can only output at 100W, well below most high end GPUs.

R.Youden said:

It would be interesting to see if a Mac Pro GPU would work as OSX already has the drivers built in. The only other constraint is power output, a lot of these Thunderbolt to PCI houses can only output at 100W, well below most high end GPUs.

Click to expand...

With 100W, you can get many notebook CPUs right up to the top end iMacs GTX 680MX, so it still would be a great upgrade.

I don't think these drivers will work 'cos they're written for PCIe, not for Thunderbolt. Maybe someone could modify these to make them work with TB?

Poki said:

I don't think these drivers will work 'cos they're written for PCIe, not for Thunderbolt. Maybe someone could modify these to make them work with TB?

Click to expand...

I have seen them working on Windows PC so the Thunderboth shouldn't be an issue, it's just the drivers.

R.Youden said:

I have seen them working on Windows PC so the Thunderboth shouldn't be an issue, it's just the drivers.

Click to expand...

At least it's sure it can work, now only a company needs to build a solid, "cheap" adapter. Maybe it's AMDs turn to get some money again?

Outstanding

Poki said:

At least it's sure it can work, now only a company needs to build a solid, "cheap" adapter. Maybe it's AMDs turn to get some money again?

Click to expand...

What is wrong with TH05? It is quite solid and cheap -
full kit costs just $180, with Thunderbolt cable included!

http://www.hwtools.net/Adapter/TH05.html

System requirements:

Apple Products:
Hardware:
Apple: iMac, Mac mini, MacBook air, MacBook Pro with Thunderbolt Ports
Operating System: Mac OS 10.6.8 or later

Click to expand...

What a fantastic value!

Recently, I have discovered this excellent product; going to get it while it is still available,
so I could use my spare desktop GPU (AMD HD6670) to boost the graphic performance of my Macbook Pro!

Isn't the problem more that there are no graphics cards that can be used in such a device that have Mac drivers?

zen said:

Isn't the problem more that there are no graphics cards that can be used in such a device that have Mac drivers?

Click to expand...

OSX 10.8.3 brought drivers for AMD Radeon 7xxx series:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1496925/

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1505726/

As I said in the other thread, once the cost of the enclosures drop, this will become a more attractive and common upgrade for the mini owner wanting more GPU performance.

53x12 said:

As I said in the other thread, once the cost of the enclosures drop, this will become a more attractive and common upgrade for the mini owner wanting more GPU performance.

Click to expand...

I thought that $180 for adapter+cable is already cheap
That is much cheaper than some "pro" solutions like Sonnet, which costs almost $1000!

if that 180 dollar adapter allows this card

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202002


or this fanless version

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131475


the mini would be very nice. this is what I consider to be the beginning of okay it is a lot better then the hd4000 from intel. it is also a lot better then any graphics card a mini has ever had

philipma1957 said:

if that 180 dollar adapter allows this card

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202002


or this fanless version

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131475


the mini would be very nice. this is what I consider to be the beginning of okay it is a lot better then the hd4000 from intel. it is also a lot better then any graphics card a mini has ever had

Click to expand...

Mini with this GPU would be BEASt, who the heck would even think about buying imac?

majkom said:

Mini with this GPU would be BEASt, who the heck would even think about buying imac?

Click to expand...

i use this card for quiet pc builds it is really good for 1080p.

AppleMacFinder said:

I thought that $180 for adapter+cable is already cheap
That is much cheaper than some "pro" solutions like Sonnet, which costs almost $1000!

Click to expand...

I am referring to a Sonnet Echo Express rather than some cheapish looking Chinese knockoff. I like the quality and design of the Somnet but wouldn't want to pay $600 for it. Cut that down to $200-250 and it would be a much more tempting purchase.


http://www.sonnettech.com/product/echoexpresschassis.html

I'll be getting a mini early in the new year and would be very interested in something like this if someone were able to get it functioning.

So who's feeling brave and has a bit of expendable cash?

fig said:

I'll be getting a mini early in the new year and would be very interested in something like this if someone were able to get it functioning.

So who's feeling brave and has a bit of expendable cash?

Click to expand...

1) find a GPU suppprted by OSX 10.8.3
2) Mac Pro section would probably be of the most help
3) Find an enclosure to fit your GPU or find a GPU and then an enclosure that fits that.
4) Plug it into your monitor and you are good to go
5) download any new firmware updates you might need

Would this work with OSX? Or would I have to run bootcamp/windows 7?

53x12 said:

I am referring to a Sonnet Echo Express rather than some cheapish looking Chinese knockoff. I like the quality and design of the Somnet but wouldn't want to pay $600 for it. Cut that down to $200-250 and it would be a much more tempting purchase.


http://www.sonnettech.com/product/echoexpresschassis.html

Click to expand...

It is not a "noname Chinese knockoff" - BPlus is an official member of Thunderbolt group.
Attended Intel Thunderbolt Technology Plugfest this year. That means some reputation.

If Sonnet will cost $250 with cable, I would prefer Sonnet like you - because of nice Mac-style external design.
However, I cannot justify spending more. Probably because Sonnet solution is universal, it costs that much.
It was designed for other purposes - professional audio & video, not with eGPU in mind.
In their PCIe Card Thunderbolt Compatibility Chart, there is no mention of eGPU at all.

Meanwhile, TH05 was created specifically for eGPU enthusiasts.

Please take a look on this thread: http://forum.techinferno.com/diy-e-gpu-projects/2513-how-we-measure-rank-describe-our-systems-no-more-%401-2opt.html

oripash, prominent eGPU enthusiast, has tested both TH05 and Sonnet.
And while results are in favor of Sonnet (+12.3% performance) because of more advanced hardware design,
the current price difference does not justify it at all.

----------

VanCleef2012 said:

Would this work with OSX? Or would I have to run bootcamp/windows 7?

Click to expand...

That is what I am trying to find out in this thread:

http://forum.techinferno.com/diy-e-gpu-projects/2597-th05-mac-os-x-possible.html

----------

EDIT: Just discovered that it is possible to buy a nice crystal DIY box ($60) for this adapter:

It would be pretty funny to have that kind of transparent box, with all the graphics stuff on display, like that on your desk!

Assuming you put in one of the AMD 7xxx cards that 10.8.3 now supports, how does OS X control switching between the card and say the in-built HD4000 on a Mac mini?

AppleMacFinder said:

It is not a "noname Chinese knockoff" - BPlus is an official member of Thunderbolt group.

Click to expand...

Taiwanese component vendor to knockoff case/system vendors is perhaps more accurate.

Attended Intel Thunderbolt Technology Plugfest this year. That means some reputation.

Click to expand...

No. Although it likely means they are looking to pass the Thunderbolt licensing tests.

However, I cannot justify spending more. Probably because Sonnet solution is universal, it costs that much.

Click to expand...

Not so much universal but a complete system solution. There is no power supply in the TH05. No case. No second Thunderbolt Port to daisy chain. It looks likely might have snagged the lowest end TB Controller ( PortRidge with 1 TB channel ) that is meant for dongles/end cap solutions.

This board is a subcomponent in a solution.

There is additional overhead with Sonnet because they have actually tested complete systems and worked on certification with card vendors. That takes time and money because selling a verified solution as opposed to a subcomponent.

The prices will probably drop as the 'copycats' flow into the TB market after others have developer a proven set of reliable designs and worked through all of the major issues.

Meanwhile, TH05 was created specifically for eGPU enthusiasts.

Click to expand...

That is a highly dubious assertion since it apparently artificially limits the PCI-e connection to x2. There is a x4 PCI-e connection on a standard TB controller. There are no other slots or connectors here so where is the other x2 PCI-e worth of bandwidth connected to here ?

Most GPUs want at least x8 of connectivity. Going from x4 to x2 is going in the opposite direction of optimization. What is being optimized here is inexpensive, not affinity to GPUs. "enthusiasts" is really "people on a limited budget".

oripash, prominent eGPU enthusiast, has tested both TH05 and Sonnet.
And while results are in favor of Sonnet (+12.3% performance) because of more advanced hardware design,
the current price difference does not justify it at all.

Click to expand...

If need to hook another TB device downstream it may. Whatever "box" cobbled together using the board would end-cap that TB daisy chain. For systems that have only one TB port that is a real issue. With two not so much. So for the mini doesn't have two.