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Old Oct 26, 2012, 07:19 AM   #1
max321
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Memory latency: cl = 11, 10 or 9 ? // HD4000

Hi, I bought a current late 2012 Mac mini (2.6 quad-core, non-server). I want to upgrade the memory to 16GB@1600MHz, but I don't know to what extend the mini will benefit from a better latency (CL). Can Mac mini use to full capacity CL better than 11? Because the Corsair's "Mac Memory Line" only offer CL=11.

If the mini benfits: Will the HD4000 benefit too? How much will CPU benefit?


I want to buy one of the following:
Kingston CL=9. Will they fit into the mini or are they to fat because of their heat sink?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820104317

Corsair CL=10
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820233265

Corsair CL=11
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820233370
Thanks in advance!
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 07:22 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by max321 View Post
Hi, I bought a current late 2012 Mac mini (2.6 quad-core, non-server). I want to upgrade the memory to 16GB@1600MHz, but I don't know to what extend the mini will benefit from a better latency (CL). Can Mac mini use to full capacity CL over 11? Because the Corsair's "Mac Memory Line" only offer CL=11.

If the mini benfits: Will the HD4000 benefit too? How much will CPU benefit?


I want to buy one of the following:
Kingston CL=9. Will they fit into the mini or are they to fat because of their heat sink?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820104317

Corsair CL=10
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820233265

Corsair CL=11
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820233370
Thanks in advance!
max321
man, it's a gamble getting a response on the specifics you require.

Best of luck!
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 07:31 AM   #3
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I don't think the difference in memory latency is worth the money. I got 16GB 1600 MHz CL11 for 70€, CL10 would have cost 90, CL9 110€ ...
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 08:30 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by needfx View Post
man, it's a gamble getting a response on the specifics you require.

Best of luck!
even apple support said that I should wait for tests on the internet
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 08:46 AM   #5
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I wonder if 1866MHz will benefit the iGPU...
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 08:46 AM   #6
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I wonder if 1866MHz will benefit the iGPU...
No, because the logic board only supports 1600 MHz.
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 10:12 AM   #7
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CL9 is best... lower number the better.

As for actual, noticeable difference? I have no idea. I opted to put CL9 into my MacBook Pro because it's my primary work computer (editing, animation) but I don't care what kind I put into my Mac Mini since I'm just using it for a home media server.
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 11:50 AM   #8
Westyfield2
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Yes, memory performance will make a difference to the HD 4000 IGP. Here’s a good test by Anandtech going from DDR3-1333MHz to DDR3-2400MHz on the desktop chip and benchmarking it. http://www.anandtech.com/show/6372/m...gp-with-gskill
As Anandtech point out however, it’s not just about MHz. Arguably the memory sub-timings are more important. Here’s a good article explaining memory for the uninitiated among us http://www.anandtech.com/show/3851/.

Unfortunately with our Macs we don’t have access to the BIOS to overclock the memory – we just have to use it how it comes out the box with its standard JEDEC timings.

I just had a quick look online, and I reckon these are the fastest decent sized DDR3 SO-DIMMS:

1600MHz – 9-9-9-24 latency – Corsair 8GB (2x4GB) CMSX8GX3M2A1600C9
1600MHz – 9-9-9 latency – Kingston 8GB (2x4GB) KHX1600C9S3P1K2/8G
1600MHz – 9-9-9 latency – Kingston 16GB (2x8GB) KHX16S9P1K2/16
1600MHz – 10-10-10-27 latency – Corsair 16GB (2x8GB) CMSX16GX3M2A1600C10
1866MHz – 10-10-10-27 latency – Corsair 8GB (2x4GB) CMSX8GX3M2A1866C10
1866MHz – 11-11-11 latency – Kingston 8GB (2x4GB) KHX1866C11S3P1K2/8G


However, one thing that could be a problem is if Apple’s designed the logic board to have the low voltage DDR3/L/-RS 1.35V RAM, rather than the standard 1.5V RAM. In 1.35V, I can only see the standard Crucial 1600MHz CL11 stuff.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Poki View Post
No, because the logic board only supports 1600 MHz.
That’s a shame, they worked in the 2011 Sandy Bridge Mac Minis, in the 2011 Sandy Bridge MacBook Pros. Intel only list the i7-3615QM processor in the 2012 2.3Ghz i7 Mac Mini as doing 1600MHz, but owners of a Samsung laptop with the same processor have found 1866MHz RAM to work.

Can I ask which of the 2012 Mac Minis it was you tried 1866MHz in (maybe they have different logic boards as they seem to be running different OS X builds?), and what speeds the RAM you tried was?
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 02:31 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westyfield2 View Post
Yes, memory performance will make a difference to the HD 4000 IGP. Here’s a good test by Anandtech going from DDR3-1333MHz to DDR3-2400MHz on the desktop chip and benchmarking it. http://www.anandtech.com/show/6372/m...gp-with-gskill
As Anandtech point out however, it’s not just about MHz. Arguably the memory sub-timings are more important. Here’s a good article explaining memory for the uninitiated among us http://www.anandtech.com/show/3851/.

Unfortunately with our Macs we don’t have access to the BIOS to overclock the memory – we just have to use it how it comes out the box with its standard JEDEC timings.

I just had a quick look online, and I reckon these are the fastest decent sized DDR3 SO-DIMMS:

1600MHz – 9-9-9-24 latency – Corsair 8GB (2x4GB) CMSX8GX3M2A1600C9
1600MHz – 9-9-9 latency – Kingston 8GB (2x4GB) KHX1600C9S3P1K2/8G
1600MHz – 9-9-9 latency – Kingston 16GB (2x8GB) KHX16S9P1K2/16
1600MHz – 10-10-10-27 latency – Corsair 16GB (2x8GB) CMSX16GX3M2A1600C10
1866MHz – 10-10-10-27 latency – Corsair 8GB (2x4GB) CMSX8GX3M2A1866C10
1866MHz – 11-11-11 latency – Kingston 8GB (2x4GB) KHX1866C11S3P1K2/8G


However, one thing that could be a problem is if Apple’s designed the logic board to have the low voltage DDR3/L/-RS 1.35V RAM, rather than the standard 1.5V RAM. In 1.35V, I can only see the standard Crucial 1600MHz CL11 stuff.




That’s a shame, they worked in the 2011 Sandy Bridge Mac Minis, in the 2011 Sandy Bridge MacBook Pros. Intel only list the i7-3615QM processor in the 2012 2.3Ghz i7 Mac Mini as doing 1600MHz, but owners of a Samsung laptop with the same processor have found 1866MHz RAM to work.

Can I ask which of the 2012 Mac Minis it was you tried 1866MHz in (maybe they have different logic boards as they seem to be running different OS X builds?), and what speeds the RAM you tried was?
your post rocked my world!!
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 03:00 PM   #10
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You really won't see a real world difference in the CL ratings when they're that close together. Just go with the least expensive option and call it a day.
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 03:08 PM   #11
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Crucial recommends 1.35v but according to most of the people who've replaced the memory from their Ivy Bridge machines are 1.5v.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1418405
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 03:16 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westyfield2 View Post
However, one thing that could be a problem is if Apple’s designed the logic board to have the low voltage DDR3/L/-RS 1.35V RAM, rather than the standard 1.5V RAM. In 1.35V, I can only see the standard Crucial 1600MHz CL11 stuff.
Just asked OWC, why they are offering 1.35V Memory for the current Mac mini. They will "send a request to our product development team and then email you if they can provide any additional information".


Quote:
Originally Posted by needfx
your post rocked my world!!
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Old Oct 26, 2012, 03:55 PM   #13
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Lets put this to bed. iFixit just did a teardown on the Late 2012 Mac Mini. There's a very clear picture from their site with the Crucial stick removed under step 3. http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Mac+M...ardown/11262/1

When googling this part number, mt8jtf25664hz-1g6m1, it comes up on Crucials Data Sheet as 1.5v, I've imbedded a copy.
http://www.digchip.com/datasheets/pa...64HZ-1G6M1.php
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Last edited by kdoug; Oct 26, 2012 at 04:00 PM.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 12:38 PM   #14
LinuxDoc
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Quote:
Originally Posted by max321 View Post
...
I want to buy one of the following:
Kingston CL=9. Will they fit into the mini or are they to fat because of their heat sink?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820104317
...
I have this RAM installed in my mac mini 2012, works great!
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Old Nov 7, 2012, 12:31 AM   #15
MacOSXuser
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so which ram to get 1.35 or 1.5V?
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Old Nov 7, 2012, 12:52 AM   #16
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Lower latency is better, but avoid the ones with heat sinks. Just buy a standard form factor. If you have the option, go with 1.35v. Whatever you buy, test it for errors as soon as you install it.
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Old Nov 7, 2012, 01:08 AM   #17
tears2040
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My question now is the faster ram at 8gb or slightly slower at 16gb.


When editing I can go up to 12gb when converting files, but I know if I only had 8gb I could manage it better.

Decisions, opinions.....?
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Old Nov 7, 2012, 02:16 AM   #18
Oujmik
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I was browsing this thread and now I'm worried that my RAM won't fit in my new mini. I've got 8gb of Corsair Vengeance RAM waiting for when the mini arrives. Will the heat sinks on this prevent it from fitting?
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Old Nov 7, 2012, 02:29 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by Oujmik View Post
I was browsing this thread and now I'm worried that my RAM won't fit in my new mini. I've got 8gb of Corsair Vengeance RAM waiting for when the mini arrives. Will the heat sinks on this prevent it from fitting?
I used 16 gigs of Corsair Vengeance RAM in mine, and it fit just fine.
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