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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:12 PM   #1
Quixotic3
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I just returned my Mini and here is why

I so wanted to love the Mini. I pictured myself casually pulling the mini out of a coat pocket at some coffee bar and surfing the web or maybe playing some angry birds. In reality the mini is too big and I had all of the same problems toting it around that I did with the normal size iPad ***but that is Not why I returned it. The screen... well I can honestly say that not having the retina was not a huge deal at first... I am old my eyes aren't what they used to be... but it kept bothering me for some reason... oh yeah, no... I got it ... the price. The reason I buy the best is... to... get... the best and I feel that my MBP retina is hands down the best laptop out there, and I feel that if I called apple support they will have an answer for me ( a company so far that isn't trying to do more with less...) so why Apple did you cheap out on the mini? It could have been the best thing ever just like all of your other products and at the premium that I paid over it's competitors it should have been. It should have had a better screen, better camera that did at least what the iPhone 5 camera does, more ram, and if you couldn't fit it in the size you released then you shouldn't have released it, Steve would not have...
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:17 PM   #2
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I so wanted to love the Mini. I pictured myself casually pulling the mini out of a coat pocket at some coffee bar and surfing the web or maybe playing some angry birds. In reality the mini is too big and I had all of the same problems toting it around that I did with the normal size iPad ***but that is Not why I returned it. The screen... well I can honestly say that not having the retina was not a huge deal at first... I am old my eyes aren't what they used to be... but it kept bothering me for some reason... oh yeah, no... I got it ... the price. The reason I buy the best is... to... get... the best and I feel that my MBP retina is hands down the best laptop out there, and I feel that if I called apple support they will have an answer for me ( a company so far that isn't trying to do more with less...) so why Apple did you cheap out on the mini? It could have been the best thing ever just like all of your other products and at the premium that I paid over it's competitors it should have been. It should have had a better screen, better camera that did at least what the iPhone 5 camera does, more ram, and if you couldn't fit it in the size you released then you shouldn't have released it, Steve would not have...
Screen technology, and Apple testing the waters.

If the mini does well, they won't 'off' it and will make a retina version next year hopefully.

I'll be buying it again for sure if it has a retina screen (without any screen issues). It's really the perfect size for typing with my thumbs, and just carrying from place to place.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:17 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Quixotic3 View Post
I so wanted to love the Mini. I pictured myself casually pulling the mini out of a coat pocket at some coffee bar and surfing the web or maybe playing some angry birds. In reality the mini is too big and I had all of the same problems toting it around that I did with the normal size iPad ***but that is Not why I returned it. The screen... well I can honestly say that not having the retina was not a huge deal at first... I am old my eyes aren't what they used to be... but it kept bothering me for some reason... oh yeah, no... I got it ... the price. The reason I buy the best is... to... get... the best and I feel that my MBP retina is hands down the best laptop out there, and I feel that if I called apple support they will have an answer for me ( a company so far that isn't trying to do more with less...) so why Apple did you cheap out on the mini? It could have been the best thing ever just like all of your other products and at the premium that I paid over it's competitors it should have been. It should have had a better screen, better camera that did at least what the iPhone 5 camera does, more ram, and if you couldn't fit it in the size you released then you shouldn't have released it, Steve would not have...
You're right he wouldn't have. The device probably wouldn't even exist if it was up to him. Considering all the crap he talked about 7 inch tablet.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:18 PM   #4
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I presume you bought it blind then? You didn't read the specs before buying? I bet you buy houses and cars the same way? Shish!
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:24 PM   #5
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:26 PM   #6
AppleRobert
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Op,

If the Mini was not cheapened out and the price was more as a result, you going to buy it or the iPad 4 instead?

HHhhhuuuummmmm!
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:38 PM   #7
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I presume you bought it blind then? You didn't read the specs before buying? I bet you buy houses and cars the same way? Shish!
No, I did not buy it blind. But I do have buyers remorse though... I feel that since the much smaller iPhone 5 has a better screen, camera, processor, gps, etc they could have fit those things into the mini. I am disappointed that it did not match up to their other products and it could have. I am worried that this is a big misstep for Apple as I am a stock owner. I have been a long time fan of Apple and I am worried that they are heading in the wrong direction. Do I as a customer have to wait for the second iteration of each product to get what should have been in the first and let early adopters beta test an inferior product for me? Shish, right back at you
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:41 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Quixotic3 View Post
No, I did not buy it blind. But I do have buyers remorse though... I feel that since the much smaller iPhone 5 has a better screen, camera, processor, gps, etc they could have fit those things into the mini. I am disappointed that it did not match up to their other products and it could have. I am worried that this is a big misstep for Apple as I am a stock owner. I have been a long time fan of Apple and I am worried that they are heading in the wrong direction. Do I as a customer have to wait for the second iteration of each product to get what should have been in the first and let early adopters beta test an inferior product for me? Shish, right back at you
There is no way that using an iphone 5 has a better experience than using a mini, in anything but making and receiving calls.

For on the go data uses like myself, the best size device so far that I have used that is also cellular enabled and portable is the Samsung Note II. It's in between the Mini and iPhone, is extremely portable, and has fantastic screen space.

Using my thumbs and all that is not an issue, as I prefer to hold a device with one hand and use the other hand to operate it - for stability - anyway.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:43 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Quixotic3 View Post
I so wanted to love the Mini. I pictured myself casually pulling the mini out of a coat pocket at some coffee bar and surfing the web or maybe playing some angry birds. In reality the mini is too big and I had all of the same problems toting it around that I did with the normal size iPad ***but that is Not why I returned it. The screen... well I can honestly say that not having the retina was not a huge deal at first... I am old my eyes aren't what they used to be... but it kept bothering me for some reason... oh yeah, no... I got it ... the price. The reason I buy the best is... to... get... the best and I feel that my MBP retina is hands down the best laptop out there, and I feel that if I called apple support they will have an answer for me ( a company so far that isn't trying to do more with less...) so why Apple did you cheap out on the mini? It could have been the best thing ever just like all of your other products and at the premium that I paid over it's competitors it should have been. It should have had a better screen, better camera that did at least what the iPhone 5 camera does, more ram, and if you couldn't fit it in the size you released then you shouldn't have released it, Steve would not have...
You know, back when the iPad 1 and then the iPad 2 were released they were the greatest thing since sliced bread, so thin, so light, beautiful screen yada yada yada. They sold millions, not thousands, but millions. Then last year the "resolutionary" iPad comes out with a retina display. The screen has gotten even better. Now Apple, trying compete in the smaller tablet arena, comes out with the iPad Mini. The screen has the same resolution as it's iPad 2 cousin, which is still selling quite well even though there is a Retina ipad being sold along side it. Since the resolution is the same and the screen is smaller the pixels are closer together and it looks even better than it's larger counterparts so they release it with the non-retina display. It uses less power and weighs less than it's retina cousin. This will make the new mini iPad very light. So they release this brand new little iPad with it's nice screen and stuff.

Now all the Apple fanboys are crying because it doesn't have retina and that makes their eyes bleed. Oh my God how vcan I even look at that screen I can pinpoint every little pixel now. Oh my God, I'm getting a migraine looking at it. Before March of 2012 though, this screen reslution on an iPad device was like the sweetest thing since sliced bread. Now listening to them it's like the world is going to stop spinning because it's not Retina. I just don't know how I will be able to live the rest of my life now. Get over it people. The iPad mini screen is beautiful. Looking at my iPad mini and my iPad 3 (with it's resolutionary retina display) side by side with the same retina enhanced photo, and you know what - can't tell the difference. Now if I zoom in as far as it will let me then yes I can see the difference, but in it's original size, not at all. Now with the same websites up, they look the same, zoom in, they both get fuzzy.

Bottom line people is that you are all crying over the fact that the iPad mini does not have retina. There is NOTHING wrong with the display. apple will no doubt add retina next year or the following year. I absolutely love the mini and quite frankly after upgrading from the iPad 1 to the iPad 3 I couldn't tell the difference in the retina display vs the iPad. Actually took both to my local Apple store to make sure the iPad 3 was actually an iPad 3 over the 2. I won the iPad 3, and was told it was a 3, but not seeing that much of a difference between the iPad 1's screen I had to be sure it wan't a 2 because if I recall they really didn't change the outer packaging.

Just my rant. Enjoy your iPad mini's, the screen is really quite remarkable.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:43 PM   #10
Quixotic3
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Originally Posted by AppleRobert View Post
Op,

If the Mini was not cheapened out and the price was more as a result, you going to buy it or the iPad 4 instead?

HHhhhuuuummmmm!
I would have paid more. That being said the size did not work for me... I will purchase the iPad 4 as soon as the refund clears I am frustrated that the Mini was not just a smaller iPad 4 which it could have and should have been.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:44 PM   #11
Binarymix
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Originally Posted by Quixotic3 View Post
No, I did not buy it blind. But I do have buyers remorse though... I feel that since the much smaller iPhone 5 has a better screen, camera, processor, gps, etc they could have fit those things into the mini. I am disappointed that it did not match up to their other products and it could have. I am worried that this is a big misstep for Apple as I am a stock owner. I have been a long time fan of Apple and I am worried that they are heading in the wrong direction. Do I as a customer have to wait for the second iteration of each product to get what should have been in the first and let early adopters beta test an inferior product for me? Shish, right back at you
And the mini is about 4x larger than the iPhone 5, and would have many more pixels to drive. This means it would need a better GPU, and battery. All of which could no longer fit into the same size enclosure, or be the same weight. ATM anyways.

There seem to be a few bottlenecks holding a retina mini back atm. That'd be waiting for smaller die chips (20nm), and thinner panel sizes, and power consumption (IGZO).
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:48 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Quixotic3 View Post
No, I did not buy it blind. But I do have buyers remorse though... I feel that since the much smaller iPhone 5 has a better screen, camera, processor, gps, etc they could have fit those things into the mini. I am disappointed that it did not match up to their other products and it could have. I am worried that this is a big misstep for Apple as I am a stock owner. I have been a long time fan of Apple and I am worried that they are heading in the wrong direction. Do I as a customer have to wait for the second iteration of each product to get what should have been in the first and let early adopters beta test an inferior product for me? Shish, right back at you
Sure, they could have done all of that. But then the iPad mini would be bigger, more expensive, and get less battery life. Design is about trade offs!
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:51 PM   #13
Quixotic3
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Originally Posted by ScottNWDW View Post
You know, back when the iPad 1 and then the iPad 2 were released they were the greatest thing since sliced bread, so thin, so light, beautiful screen yada yada yada. They sold millions, not thousands, but millions. Then last year the "resolutionary" iPad comes out with a retina display. The screen has gotten even better. Now Apple, trying compete in the smaller tablet arena, comes out with the iPad Mini. The screen has the same resolution as it's iPad 2 cousin, which is still selling quite well even though there is a Retina ipad being sold along side it. Since the resolution is the same and the screen is smaller the pixels are closer together and it looks even better than it's larger counterparts so they release it with the non-retina display. It uses less power and weighs less than it's retina cousin. This will make the new mini iPad very light. So they release this brand new little iPad with it's nice screen and stuff.

Now all the Apple fanboys are crying because it doesn't have retina and that makes their eyes bleed. Oh my God how vcan I even look at that screen I can pinpoint every little pixel now. Oh my God, I'm getting a migraine looking at it. Before March of 2012 though, this screen reslution on an iPad device was like the sweetest thing since sliced bread. Now listening to them it's like the world is going to stop spinning because it's not Retina. I just don't know how I will be able to live the rest of my life now. Get over it people. The iPad mini screen is beautiful. Looking at my iPad mini and my iPad 3 (with it's resolutionary retina display) side by side with the same retina enhanced photo, and you know what - can't tell the difference. Now if I zoom in as far as it will let me then yes I can see the difference, but in it's original size, not at all. Now with the same websites up, they look the same, zoom in, they both get fuzzy.

Bottom line people is that you are all crying over the fact that the iPad mini does not have retina. There is NOTHING wrong with the display. apple will no doubt add retina next year or the following year. I absolutely love the mini and quite frankly after upgrading from the iPad 1 to the iPad 3 I couldn't tell the difference in the retina display vs the iPad. Actually took both to my local Apple store to make sure the iPad 3 was actually an iPad 3 over the 2. I won the iPad 3, and was told it was a 3, but not seeing that much of a difference between the iPad 1's screen I had to be sure it wan't a 2 because if I recall they really didn't change the outer packaging.

Just my rant. Enjoy your iPad mini's, the screen is really quite remarkable.
Retina screen aside it should have had a better camera, more memory and a faster processor like the iPhone 5. Would you buy a a computer with two year old technology pay more and be happy with it because it has an apple emblem on it? that is what a fanboy would do.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:52 PM   #14
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I've been using mine since launch and after using an iPhone 4, 4S, 5, and the new iPad, the non-retina screen doesn't even bother me. I haven't touched my 3rd gen iPad since the 2nd. To each, their own, I guess.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:54 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by ScottNWDW View Post
Looking at my iPad mini and my iPad 3 (with it's resolutionary retina display) side by side with the same retina enhanced photo, and you know what - can't tell the difference. Now if I zoom in as far as it will let me then yes I can see the difference, but in it's original size, not at all. Now with the same websites up, they look the same, zoom in, they both get fuzzy.

Bottom line people is that you are all crying over the fact that the iPad mini does not have retina. There is NOTHING wrong with the display. apple will no doubt add retina next year or the following year. I absolutely love the mini and quite frankly after upgrading from the iPad 1 to the iPad 3 I couldn't tell the difference in the retina display vs the iPad. Actually took both to my local Apple store to make sure the iPad 3 was actually an iPad 3 over the 2.
Spot on. I found that the mini was awesome compared to the ipad 3 next to it. Unless you anally looked for the difference and zoomed in and in, the difference was negligible in real world use.

----------

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Retina screen aside it should have had a better camera, more memory and a faster processor like the iPhone 5. Would you buy a a computer with two year old technology pay more and be happy with it because it has an apple emblem on it? that is what a fanboy would do.
Cannot fault you here. The mini should have had the same processor and GPU as the iphone 5 - end of story.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 01:54 PM   #16
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And the mini is about 4x larger than the iPhone 5, and would have many more pixels to drive. This means it would need a better GPU, and battery. All of which could no longer fit into the same size enclosure, or be the same weight. ATM anyways.

There seem to be a few bottlenecks holding a retina mini back atm. That'd be waiting for smaller die chips (20nm), and thinner panel sizes, and power consumption (IGZO).
I believe that the iPhone 5 has a dual core a6 where as the mini has a dual a5 and other competitors have released better screens than the mini in similar sized screens
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 02:05 PM   #17
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I believe that the iPhone 5 has a dual core a6 where as the mini has a dual a5 and other competitors have released better screens than the mini in similar sized screens
Except we know that a retina display iPad would require an A5X or A6X as evidenced by the 3rd and 4th generation iPads. Remember the complaints about how hot the iPad 3 got? It would also require a much larger battery.

Yes, Apple could have gone for an interim resolution like the Nexus 7 or Kindle Fire HD, but then those 275,000 apps designed for an iPad would need to be redesigned to work with the iPad mini.

Apple decided the compatibility with these apps was more important the the interim bump in resolution. They have a better track record than you do in these decisions.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 02:21 PM   #18
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I so wanted to love the Mini. I pictured myself casually pulling the mini out of a coat pocket at some coffee bar and surfing the web or maybe playing some angry birds. In reality the mini is too big and I had all of the same problems toting it around that I did with the normal size iPad ***but that is Not why I returned it. The screen... well I can honestly say that not having the retina was not a huge deal at first... I am old my eyes aren't what they used to be... but it kept bothering me for some reason... oh yeah, no... I got it ... the price. The reason I buy the best is... to... get... the best and I feel that my MBP retina is hands down the best laptop out there, and I feel that if I called apple support they will have an answer for me ( a company so far that isn't trying to do more with less...) so why Apple did you cheap out on the mini? It could have been the best thing ever just like all of your other products and at the premium that I paid over it's competitors it should have been. It should have had a better screen, better camera that did at least what the iPhone 5 camera does, more ram, and if you couldn't fit it in the size you released then you shouldn't have released it, Steve would not have...
The only point I agree with here is regarding the size. I think it's too big. The other things, well...Apple isn't a one and done company, this is a first generation and all the things you wish for will come to the mini over time, not to worry there. For some, given the specs, it fills a gap. For others that want more ram, faster chip, better screen, etc. will have to wait for gen2/gen3, no big deal. It's a journey with Apple products. The one thing they won't change is the size / ratio, and that saddens me.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 02:35 PM   #19
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I believe that the iPhone 5 has a dual core a6 where as the mini has a dual a5 and other competitors have released better screens than the mini in similar sized screens
Yeah, and both the iPhone and iPad 4 get hot. The iPhone doesn't have the A6X which would most likely turn the mini into a hotplate if they jammed it in it's current form factor.

And the better screens you mention are not 497 ppi, now are they? Which the mini would have to be to keep all iPad apps working properly.

The tech. isn't there yet. Not for this form factor, which is awesome.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 02:38 PM   #20
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I had the mini and must say I loved the form factor but the screen started causing my eyes problems. I don't know what caused it and before I start getting ripped on, I could care less if anyone believes me or not. I returned it and got a 4 and have had no issues since. I also have an iPhone 5 and use it regularly(right now) and have no issues with my eyes on it. I will be the first in line when an updated mini becomes available as like I said I love everything else about it.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 02:41 PM   #21
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Returned mine too

After a week and a half, using it all the time, I just couldn't stand the screen. It seemed worse every time I used it, and I started dreading having to work with it. Got a Nexus 7 yesterday -- the screen is much better even though it has calibration problems. No, I don't think the Mini with the present screen would have gotten past Jobs. It's horrible.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 02:44 PM   #22
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I had the mini and must say I loved the form factor but the screen started causing my eyes problems. I don't know what caused it and before I start getting ripped on, I could care less if anyone believes me or not. I returned it and got a 4 and have had no issues since. I also have an iPhone 5 and use it regularly(right now) and have no issues with my eyes on it. I will be the first in line when an updated mini becomes available as like I said I love everything else about it.
I also returned the mini after I found that the screen was a sacrifice that I just couldnt make. I would have paid a little bit more for retina. The screen is not terrible, but once you are accustomed to the retina it is very hard to go back.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 02:44 PM   #23
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I absolutely love my Mini. I love how thin and light it is and yet I love the size. I love how the device is not super small and crammed like most 7" tablets. The Mini truly is an iPad. Yes the screen on the 4 is beautiful but it comes at a thicker, heavier, larger, and more expensive cost.
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 03:08 PM   #24
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And the better screens you mention are not 497 ppi, now are they? Which the mini would have to be to keep all iPad apps working properly.
If the iPad mini had the same resolution as the 3rd and 4th gen iPad, it would be the same pixel density as the iPhone 4, 4S, and 5 (326 ppi).
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Old Nov 13, 2012, 03:14 PM   #25
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I would have paid more. That being said the size did not work for me... I will purchase the iPad 4 as soon as the refund clears I am frustrated that the Mini was not just a smaller iPad 4 which it could have and should have been.
Oh for gods sake... no it couldn't have been a smaller iPad 4! Do people not realise how ridiculous that statement is from an engineering point of view?

This has been talked about so much over the last couple of weeks it's ridiculous but really it's simple:

iPad Mini: 200mm x 134.7mm x 7.6mm, 308g, 16.3-watt-hour battery.
iPad 4: 241.2mm x 185.7mm x 9.4mm, 652g, 42.5-watt-hour battery.

See the bit in bold? That's how much power you need to run a retina-equipped iPad with an A6X SoC. You'd save a tiny bit with a smaller screen but nowhere near enough to make a significant difference. The iPad 4 has a volume of 421,034 cubic mm in which to fit the necessary components and battery pack, the iPad mini has 204,744 cubic mm. Half the volume. Or, to put it another way, you'd need an iPad Mini 15.63mm thick to give the same volume. Of course it isn't that simple but it gives you an idea of the scale of the problem. Plus, of course, it'd weigh twice as much as well.

If you want a retina display in a mini you're going to have to wait for new screen tech and, almost certainly, a new SoC. Oh, and a new battery tech wouldn't hurt either. This may, note MAY, be available next year it may take a little longer. If you want a mini this year then this is the compromise you make to get this form factor. Simple isn't it?

Edit - Just wanted to put that battery figure in some context. An 11" Macbook Air only has a 35wH battery, the 13" MBA a 50wH and the 13" MBP a 63.5wH unit. So right now the battery requirements for a retina-equipped iPad come in about 20% higher than the Intel-powered 11" Macbook Air and not that far away from the 13"...

Last edited by smiddlehurst; Nov 13, 2012 at 09:11 PM.
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