PPC better than Intel for PPC apps?

Woodcrest64 · Nov 14, 2012, 11:29 PM

My wife is using an old program report card program from 2000 designed around the PPC architecture on her 2011 intel Macbook Pro. On both a Core 2 Duo Mac Mini running Snow Leopard and her 2011 Intel i7 Macbook Pro running Snow Leopard through VM fusion the program is EXTREMELY slow. Hitting back space to delete a word can take forever at times. The processor usage hits 90% or higher all the time.

I have made two separate bids on two Apple G4 iBooks running Tiger. I'm just wondering if buying a PPC base laptop is going to get better results vs running the program on an intel machine.

Jessica Lares · Nov 14, 2012, 11:43 PM

I have the Skyrocket too!

And yes, running the apps natively vs in an emulator is going to be much, much, much better. Make sure the hard drive is in good shape as it makes all the difference.

dukebound85 · Nov 14, 2012, 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jessica Lares

I have the Skyrocket too!

And yes, running the apps natively vs in an emulator is going to be much, much, much better. Make sure the hard drive is in good shape as it makes all the difference.

not unless the emulator is running better than native. I would imagine any modern 10.6 capable mac is loads faster emulating ppc via rosetta than a g4 ibook running ppc natively

wobegong · Nov 15, 2012, 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dukebound85

not unless the emulator is running better than native. I would imagine any modern 10.6 capable mac is loads faster emulating ppc via rosetta than a g4 ibook running ppc natively

Yes I think the newer Intel processors will be faster even with Rosetta than a native PowerPC, even at release they were not as slow emulating as you might expect and they have improved very dramatically since then. Against an older Core Solo or even CoreDuo though PowerPC would definately be better.

throAU · Nov 15, 2012, 12:32 AM

How much ram is in the machine?

If you're running Snow Leopard in a VM, you will need enough RAM to hold both copies of OS X before you even consider running applications.

If you're running with 4gb of RAM or less, it will probably be slow.

A modern intel CPU with Fusion should be able to run non-3d applications almost as fast as natively - if you have enough RAM.

As far as rosetta goes - I've run Diablo 2 in rosetta on my mac mini without issue. I didn't even realize it was a PPC only app (i installed from CD i bought for my PC - it had both OS9 and Windows versions on it)

The way rosetta works, it caches translated instructions so performance isn't horrible...

Woodcrest64 · Nov 15, 2012, 08:56 AM

The Mac mini running snow leopard as its main OS has 2gb of ram. The MacBook pro from 2011 running snow leopard via vm fusion has 4gb of memory .

I'm not sure why the Mini with a core 2 duo with snow leopard and 2gb is running an old PPC app from 2000 soooooo slowly. It's pretty much unbearable at times. Like I said the processor hits 90% on both machines.

Quote:

Originally Posted by throAU

How much ram is in the machine?

If you're running Snow Leopard in a VM, you will need enough RAM to hold both copies of OS X before you even consider running applications.

If you're running with 4gb of RAM or less, it will probably be slow.

A modern intel CPU with Fusion should be able to run non-3d applications almost as fast as natively - if you have enough RAM.

As far as rosetta goes - I've run Diablo 2 in rosetta on my mac mini without issue. I didn't even realize it was a PPC only app (i installed from CD i bought for my PC - it had both OS9 and Windows versions on it)

The way rosetta works, it caches translated instructions so performance isn't horrible...

Woodcrest64 · Nov 15, 2012, 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wobegong

Yes I think the newer Intel processors will be faster even with Rosetta than a native PowerPC, even at release they were not as slow emulating as you might expect and they have improved very dramatically since then. Against an older Core Solo or even CoreDuo though PowerPC would definately be better.

So I found out the PPC app was written back in 2000 for OS8 using File Maker I think.

I changed VM Fusion to use 1 core out of the 4 on the processor and only 1gb of memory instead of the 2gb out of 4gb on the macbook. It does seem snappier but I will need my wife to verify that.

Ariii · Nov 15, 2012, 06:18 PM

MacOS 8 runs incredibly fast on most G3's or newer. The only problem I could think of you having would be how the app runs through emulation. And many apps aren't nearly as good through emulation as they are natively. Get something that can boot MacOS 9 natively (MacOS 9 is newer but is much, much more compatible with MacOS 8) so that you are able to run the app more quickly. In fact, a PowerPC emulating MacOS 8 through Classic Environment might be even slower than your MBP. Later iBooks cannot boot MacOS 9 natively, only older ones. You will likely have better performance if you get a machine that can boot MacOS 9 natively for a cheaper price.

Jethryn Freyman · Nov 16, 2012, 01:14 AM

I wasn't aware that Fusion can run PPC applications on an Intel Mac... it simply translates the x86 calls and turns them into PPC ones. Are you referring to Rosetta on Intel?

Woodcrest64 · Nov 16, 2012, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jethryn Freyman

I wasn't aware that Fusion can run PPC applications on an Intel Mac... it simply translates the x86 calls and turns them into PPC ones. Are you referring to Rosetta on Intel?

I was running Snow Leopard in VM Fusion. SL supports PPC apps via Rosetta I believe. I wish Lion and ML had Rosetta.

Jethryn Freyman · Nov 16, 2012, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodcrest64

I was running Snow Leopard in VM Fusion. SL supports PPC apps via Rosetta I believe. I wish Lion and ML had Rosetta.

Ah OK, I guess Rosetta would then take an affinity for single-core performance/clock speed.

If it's never been on an Intel Mac you can be nearly totally sure it's not able to take advantage of more than one CPU core.

Colpeas · Nov 16, 2012, 02:43 AM

My G5 tower runs PPC applications much fast than my old 13" C2D MBP ever did. I am yet to find an app which would run better in Rosetta than native.

spoonie1972 · Nov 16, 2012, 09:06 AM

have you considered trying sheepshaver?

Woodcrest64 · Nov 16, 2012, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spoonie1972

have you considered trying sheepshaver?

Sheepshaver? Do tell me

spoonie1972 · Nov 16, 2012, 01:04 PM

it's an os9 emulator. i've found it very effective for really, really old software.

but i do agree with above - some of those apps should be zipping along via rosetta in a parallels environment.

Nov 14, 2012, 11:29 PM	#1
Woodcrest64 macrumors 6502a Join Date: Aug 2006	PPC better than Intel for PPC apps? My wife is using an old program report card program from 2000 designed around the PPC architecture on her 2011 intel Macbook Pro. On both a Core 2 Duo Mac Mini running Snow Leopard and her 2011 Intel i7 Macbook Pro running Snow Leopard through VM fusion the program is EXTREMELY slow. Hitting back space to delete a word can take forever at times. The processor usage hits 90% or higher all the time. I have made two separate bids on two Apple G4 iBooks running Tiger. I'm just wondering if buying a PPC base laptop is going to get better results vs running the program on an intel machine. __________________ MacBookPro with Retina display 10,1 \| iPad 1 \| Apple TV Gen 1 \| Skyrocket S2 LTE
	0

Nov 14, 2012, 11:43 PM	#2
Jessica Lares macrumors 68030 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Near Dallas, Texas, USA	I have the Skyrocket too! And yes, running the apps natively vs in an emulator is going to be much, much, much better. Make sure the hard drive is in good shape as it makes all the difference. __________________  Have You Hugged Your Mac Today? Daily Expressions \| Power Mac G5 \| Late 2011 13" MacBook Pro \| iPod Nano (7G) \| iPod Shuffle (2012) \| iPad Mini
	0

Nov 15, 2012, 12:32 AM	#5
throAU macrumors 68020 Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Perth, Western Australia	How much ram is in the machine? If you're running Snow Leopard in a VM, you will need enough RAM to hold both copies of OS X before you even consider running applications. If you're running with 4gb of RAM or less, it will probably be slow. A modern intel CPU with Fusion should be able to run non-3d applications almost as fast as natively - if you have enough RAM. As far as rosetta goes - I've run Diablo 2 in rosetta on my mac mini without issue. I didn't even realize it was a PPC only app (i installed from CD i bought for my PC - it had both OS9 and Windows versions on it) The way rosetta works, it caches translated instructions so performance isn't horrible... __________________ MBP (early 2011) - Core i7 2720 2.2ghz, Hires Glossy, 16GB, Seagate Momentus XT 750GB Mac Mini (mid 2007) - Core2 Duo 1.8, 2gb, 320gb 7200 rpm iPhone 4S, iPad 4
	0

Nov 15, 2012, 06:18 PM	#8
Ariii macrumors 6502a Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Chicago	MacOS 8 runs incredibly fast on most G3's or newer. The only problem I could think of you having would be how the app runs through emulation. And many apps aren't nearly as good through emulation as they are natively. Get something that can boot MacOS 9 natively (MacOS 9 is newer but is much, much more compatible with MacOS 8) so that you are able to run the app more quickly. In fact, a PowerPC emulating MacOS 8 through Classic Environment might be even slower than your MBP. Later iBooks cannot boot MacOS 9 natively, only older ones. You will likely have better performance if you get a machine that can boot MacOS 9 natively for a cheaper price. __________________ •Indigo iBook Clamshell, MacOS 9; Lime iBook Clamshell, Panther; MacOS 9 users: Use Classilla \| MacOS 9 Lives I'm on IRC at #macrumors on irc.krono.net Tumblr
	0

Nov 16, 2012, 01:14 AM	#9
Jethryn Freyman macrumors 68020 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Australia	I wasn't aware that Fusion can run PPC applications on an Intel Mac... it simply translates the x86 calls and turns them into PPC ones. Are you referring to Rosetta on Intel? __________________ Power Mac G5 - 2x 1.8GHz - 4GB - ATI Fire GL X3 256MB - 10.5.8 Macbook Pro 3,1 - 6GB - 240GB OWC SSD - 10.6.8 www.michaelanthonyralph.com/blog/
	0

Nov 16, 2012, 02:43 AM	#12
Colpeas macrumors 6502 Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Prague, Czech Rep.	My G5 tower runs PPC applications much fast than my old 13" C2D MBP ever did. I am yet to find an app which would run better in Rosetta than native.
	0

Nov 16, 2012, 09:06 AM	#13
spoonie1972 macrumors 6502 Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Toronto	have you considered trying sheepshaver? __________________ 2012 MPB 15, 16GB, 512SSD, Geek 11941 - Logic Audio 2009 Mac Pro, 64GB, 5,1 Firmware, X5570 swap x2. Geek 18185 - VEP5, Kontakt, etc.
	0

Nov 16, 2012, 01:04 PM	#15
spoonie1972 macrumors 6502 Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Toronto	it's an os9 emulator. i've found it very effective for really, really old software. but i do agree with above - some of those apps should be zipping along via rosetta in a parallels environment. __________________ 2012 MPB 15, 16GB, 512SSD, Geek 11941 - Logic Audio 2009 Mac Pro, 64GB, 5,1 Firmware, X5570 swap x2. Geek 18185 - VEP5, Kontakt, etc.
	0

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