Apple Announces Management Changes: Scott Forstall and John Browett Out, Ive and Others Add Responsibilities

[Amarth]

Originally Posted by gmanist1000

I'm curious where iOS will head.

Not sure where iOS will be heading, but this is where OSX will be heading :

[jncoanalog]

Originally Posted by slimbek

(...)
ie: Ive is overseeing what you look at on the screens and how it relates to the object you're holding.

I think this fact is really really exciting! It's possible that for the first time we will REALLY experience the fusion between hardware and software...
I always thought Steve should have done this (ie: put Ive overseeing human interface AND hardware)... software can never blend seamlessly with hardware without someone who really really understand this philosophy (preferably a designer, definitely not an engineer) in charge of both divisions.

Now let's see who was actually right(er)

[ChristianJapan]

Originally Posted by Amarth

Not sure where iOS will be heading, but this is where OSX will be heading :

this is for iOS 8 ... In 2014 ...

[RenoG]

Originally Posted by ChristianJapan

this is for iOS 8 ... In 2014 ...

....and depending on compatibility this may be the next time I update all things Apple in my house. I'm currently on ios 5.1.1 on the ipad and totally not budging (ios6 is the worst ever)

I currently have my old 3g because I sold my 4 in hopes to get the 5 but very hesitant now because of ios6.

[theanimaster]

Originally Posted by Small White Car

Wow, and I just made a long post last week about how Scott is behind everything I don't currently like at Apple.

Glad to see Tim is reading my posts and taking my advice!

And I just emailed him the other day saying I could do the job better than most of the current idiots they hire.

Maybe he really _does_ read his email :3 I'll keep updating my list of "things Apple should implement" ...

----------

Originally Posted by Amarth

Not sure where iOS will be heading, but this is where OSX will be heading :

That is a terrible, terrible joke. That wasn't even funny. It was insulting.


A pox on you.

[ixodes]

While undoubtedly these changes will be felt internally most immediately, it will be interesting to see when & how they reveal themselves to customers.

In the two decades I've been an Apple customer, this is the single most encouraging change I've witnessed. A change that if executed properly, could truly have a major impact in many areas of Apple operations.

If ever there was a chance that Apple will rid itself of the current highly variable quality control, it's now as this change takes effect. It's a terrific opportunity for Apple to slash returns by shipping products that look like new, as they used to do for years & years.

[rmcchooardl]

Not that I know the guy personally, but John Browett was in charge of a retail chain in UK called Dixons Stores Group (DSG). Whilst at uni I worked at PC World (a DSG store chain), man that company sucked so bad. People didn't know what they were selling (one guy I worked with knew nothing about computers and had experience selling washing machines....) All the management cared about was selling the after-sales products. When I heard that John Browett was hired I wondered who the hell thought that was a good idea? Not surprised he's out at all. Apple is about service, care and a long term customer relationship- DSG was about up-selling, volume and couldn't care about seeing repeat business.

[oliversl]

I assume you know this guy? Or you just read rumors from an author that praises Windows 8 design?

http://www.fastcodesign.com/1670760/...cause-a-revolt
http://www.fastcodesign.com/1670705/...ign-strategy#1

Originally Posted by TRMC13

That guy was an *******

[TRMC13]

Originally Posted by oliversl

I assume you know this guy? Or you just read rumors from an author that praises Windows 8 design?

http://www.fastcodesign.com/1670760/...cause-a-revolt
http://www.fastcodesign.com/1670705/...ign-strategy#1

Actually I know the guy. But thanks for your input.

[hchung]

Originally Posted by iphoneclassic

You are taking my original point and arguing with me. My point was Apple should have continued to use the Google Data they were getting and integrate with TeleAtlas/NAVTEQ. Rather than dumping Google with the premise Google was not giving Voice Navigation feature.

Just because there is a published algorithm doesn't mean every one can develop the software. Only two successful companies in this area are NAVTEQ and TeleAtlas.

If any one could develop navigation software NOKIA wouldn't have paid 8 Billion for NAVTEQ, when they had their own product Ovi Maps.

No. I'm saying what you are literally saying makes no sense because you don't actually understand what each vendor is providing and where the value is.

1) If Apple had Google's map data, there's no point in integrating with TeleAtlas/Navteq because Google's map data included TeleAtlas/Navteq data already.
2) Google stipulates that their map data may not be used for turn-by-turn navigation (probably what you refer to as voice navigation). Trying to get around that by "integrating" their data is not a solution as it'd be a breach of contract.
3) Google also only provided map tiles to Apple, not vector data. Trying to do a turn-by-turn navigation system using just tiles over cellular would be a really bad experience because we don't have unlimited data plans.
4) Developing the software is not the hard part. Getting the data is.
Nokia paid for the data. Not the software.

I'm not sure how many different ways I need to say it for you to understand. A* can be implemented by students in undergrad projects. It isn't that hard. I even have an old implementation somewhere in my code archives tied to US Census bureau TIGER map data. I ran it and it literally routed a path from my house to my work. The problem? TIGER maps doesn't include one-way streets, so it'll route me the shortest path it knows of even against oncoming traffic.

Yes, I actually made a lame attempt at my own in-car nav software back in 2005 for kicks. I consulted for friends who also tried and failed at a startup trying to do maps.

What you've suggested was never an option.

[iphoneclassic]

Originally Posted by hchung

No. I'm saying what you are literally saying makes no sense because you don't actually understand what each vendor is providing and where the value is.

1) If Apple had Google's map data, there's no point in integrating with TeleAtlas/Navteq because Google's map data included TeleAtlas/Navteq data already.
2) Google stipulates that their map data may not be used for turn-by-turn navigation (probably what you refer to as voice navigation). Trying to get around that by "integrating" their data is not a solution as it'd be a breach of contract.
3) Google also only provided map tiles to Apple, not vector data. Trying to do a turn-by-turn navigation system using just tiles over cellular would be a really bad experience because we don't have unlimited data plans.
4) Developing the software is not the hard part. Getting the data is.
Nokia paid for the data. Not the software.

I'm not sure how many different ways I need to say it for you to understand. A* can be implemented by students in undergrad projects. It isn't that hard. I even have an old implementation somewhere in my code archives tied to US Census bureau TIGER map data. I ran it and it literally routed a path from my house to my work. The problem? TIGER maps doesn't include one-way streets, so it'll route me the shortest path it knows of even against oncoming traffic.

Yes, I actually made a lame attempt at my own in-car nav software back in 2005 for kicks. I consulted for friends who also tried and failed at a startup trying to do maps.

What you've suggested was never an option.

I take you are an academician. I have to politely say you are missing few neurons.

What you do in a university lab or give as an assignment to students doesn't apply in real world.

Your stipulation is Google want to cutoff Apple completely. That is never the case in high visibility partnerships. Any company will be happy to do whatever possible to have presence on iPhone. Only exception is Apple inflicting enormous pain where a partner sees no value. Same story with Google or Samsung.

There are several sources where you can get data. It won't even cost 1 cent per data point. Thats what Forstall tried to do. Maps data you can get from Digital Globe. Digital Globe buys mostly from Indian Remote Sensing Agency because they are cheap. There are lot of schools process raw satellite data and produce useable maps. There are cities in US sell digital aerial images. There is Dun & Bradstreet for commercial data.

I am an Artificial Intelligence major with 20 years IT experience. You can never build everything on your own. Thats where your negotiation skills come into picture. What Apple is doing wrong fighting with every trading partner.

Data availability is least of the problems. Data Integration is the problem. Let me repeat again there are only two companies with successful commercial navigation software.

[WeegieMac]

Originally Posted by dermeister

Siri is bad because it's not real AI, it's just basic pattern recognition. And there aren't THAT many patterns programmed in. There isn't even a real context system, other than a pre-programmed run-through of certain scripts. Siri is the definition of a gimmick.

Googles new voice search app update makes a mockery of Siri. Understands me every single time. Impressive.

[Lankyman]

Originally Posted by rmcchooardl

Not that I know the guy personally, but John Browett was in charge of a retail chain in UK called Dixons Stores Group (DSG). Whilst at uni I worked at PC World (a DSG store chain), man that company sucked so bad. People didn't know what they were selling (one guy I worked with knew nothing about computers and had experience selling washing machines....) All the management cared about was selling the after-sales products. When I heard that John Browett was hired I wondered who the hell thought that was a good idea? Not surprised he's out at all. Apple is about service, care and a long term customer relationship- DSG was about up-selling, volume and couldn't care about seeing repeat business.

Worryingly he was a Tim Cook high profile appointee. Pity Mr Cook didn't ask his UK customers for advice first as we could have given him chapter and verse on the Browett philosophy to customer service.

[Lankyman]

Originally Posted by theanimaster

That is a terrible, terrible joke. That wasn't even funny. It was insulting.


A pox on you.

Personally, like it or not I do think the poster is correct with his assertion. Apple have already started down this road with iOS 6 and Mountain Lion and with the arrival of Windows 8 Apple won't leave it there.

I have just installed Windows 8 as a VM and don't find it as way out there as many claim. In fact the Desktop is very much Windows 7.

[hchung]

Originally Posted by iphoneclassic

I take you are an academician. I have to politely say you are missing few neurons.

What you do in a university lab or give as an assignment to students doesn't apply in real world.

Sorry, but no. Not in academia, and never had plans for that route. I do have a CompSci undergrad degree though.

Originally Posted by iphoneclassic

Your stipulation is Google want to cutoff Apple completely. That is never the case in high visibility partnerships. Any company will be happy to do whatever possible to have presence on iPhone. Only exception is Apple inflicting enormous pain where a partner sees no value. Same story with Google or Samsung.

I did not claim that Google wanted to cut off Apple.
I do assert that Google demands certain terms for usage of their map data, which is a completely normal and expected thing to do.
I also assert that it is expected that Apple would evaluate those terms and decide if they're worth pursuing, and obviously they decided against it.

When two parties can't work out the terms of the deal, then they don't partner up. That's pretty logical, right? Afterall, you do agree that negotiation skills are key right? Nobody should take a deal they don't agree with.

Somehow you think Google would do anything to have a presence on iPhone? Really? Anything?
Somehow you think Apple's trying to inflict "enormous pain" on Google? What? How do you reason this?

Originally Posted by iphoneclassic

There are several sources where you can get data. It won't even cost 1 cent per data point. Thats what Forstall tried to do. Maps data you can get from Digital Globe. Digital Globe buys mostly from Indian Remote Sensing Agency because they are cheap. There are lot of schools process raw satellite data and produce useable maps. There are cities in US sell digital aerial images. There is Dun & Bradstreet for commercial data.

I am an Artificial Intelligence major with 20 years IT experience. You can never build everything on your own. Thats where your negotiation skills come into picture. What Apple is doing wrong fighting with every trading partner.

Data availability is least of the problems. Data Integration is the problem. Let me repeat again there are only two companies with successful commercial navigation software.

I don't know what two companies you're talking about. But I can safely say that Navteq's and Teleatlas' primary realm of business is not navigation software. They're both in the business of selling map data.

Apple integrated Teleatlas' maps into iOS6 maps already.

[FieldingMellish]

I'm glad Scott is out. That roving big eyeball of his was unsettling whenever he was interviewed for whatever new product came out.

[Gallion]

Originally Posted by ECUpirate44

Federighi will lead iOS and OSX development...... The merge of the two has just begun.

With ARM processors gaining in popularity and performance, with Windows 8 getting support for ARM, with Android Ubuntu and how it turns a cellphone into a desktop computer when docked, with convertibles tablets that can be turned into laptops with a snap-on keyboard and touchpad, with Apple pushing for external devices like hard drives, optical drives and monitors through Thunderbolt, I think the future is pretty clear.

I could see the MacBook Air becoming so thin that it can be turned into a 13" tablet with a snapping keyboard and touchpad. Add a Thunderbolt port to it and you get a full computer with a monitor, a full hard drive, a printer, an optical drive, a keyboard and a mouse.

They could even make iMac-style docking stations, but it wouldn't be like Apple to make a product like that.

[Cod3rror]

Originally Posted by Gallion

With ARM processors gaining in popularity and performance, with Windows 8 getting support for ARM, with Android Ubuntu and how it turns a cellphone into a desktop computer when docked, with convertibles tablets that can be turned into laptops with a snap-on keyboard and touchpad, with Apple pushing for external devices like hard drives, optical drives and monitors through Thunderbolt, I think the future is pretty clear.

I could see the MacBook Air becoming so thin that it can be turned into a 13" tablet with a snapping keyboard and touchpad. Add a Thunderbolt port to it and you get a full computer with a monitor, a full hard drive, a printer, an optical drive, a keyboard and a mouse.

They could even make iMac-style docking stations, but it wouldn't be like Apple to make a product like that.

Thanks for that link. That's awesome and definitely the future of computing.

Desktops -> Laptops -> Tablets -> Phones.

Microsoft is definitely headed that way. I don't like their execution(Metro) but it's a great idea and a concept.

I'd say by about 2025 this concept will be fully realized.

[k2k koos]

I think from this there's only one Positive, Browett is gone.

I don't think he fully understood Apple, and you do not impress Apple if you try to make cuts to improve margins. The Apple stores are a succesful formula, and in large because of it's excellent customer service. For that you need people, not less people.
Hopefully who-ever takes over, will return the stores to the way they were, and build up from there, not 'strip down' on staff but find other ways to improve the experience and increase the income stream.

Forestall, I think it's a shame he leaves, he's a smart guy and I think he has a lot to bring to Apple. Ok there is an issue currently over the 'design, look ' of certain apps, but that surely can't be a show stopper, and he's been getting some flack about the mapping software and Siri. It's surely not all his fault. Perhaps they were pushing it too quickly, and should have waited a generation to add these features, but there's competition so they took a risk..

[gto55]

http://www.randsinrepose.com/archive...s_a_fight.html

Innovation is a Fight: Apple Placing a premium on volatility

[76ShovelHead]

Does this mean change is coming to the horrible log in screen?

[oliversl]

No prob

Originally Posted by TRMC13

Actually I know the guy. But thanks for your input.