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Old Nov 27, 2012, 07:23 PM   #276
iGrip
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Configure that!

As always the thing that makes the most sense is to really load up when first buying a Mac. The hardware lasts forever with no need for any repairs, so you are limited only by the raw ability of the machine.

Get the highest available amount of RAM. That is a no-brainer.
Get the highest available amount of speed in the CPU. Every time.

Then you will have a reliable machine that will handle anything you throw at it for seven or eight years. And then you'll be able to sell it for pretty much what you paid for it anyways.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by nrose101 View Post
Looks likes I will be getting the 27" since I need more than 16 megs of RAM
Nobody needs more than 16 Megs of RAM. Back in my day, if you got 128k you were happy.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by drumrobot View Post
$600 ? That's not just ridiculous. That's absolutely LUDICROUS.

You can get 32 GB from Newegg for prices as low as ~$160.

This is just utterly ridiculous (or ludicrous. Either one works.). Charging $300 would not be unexpected, and I wouldn't be surprised at $400, but SIX HUNDRED DOLLARS? They should be ashamed of such a blatant ripoff, and this is coming from a big Apple fan.
But when you consider that you will be using the machine for many years to come, and that when you sell it you;'ll get back almost all of your money, it doesn't seem so bad.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 07:26 PM   #277
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ademordna View Post
I wish that I knew more about this, because I keep wondering if I can run photoshop cs6 efficiently (for painting, layer work but no photo or vid or RAW) on the base model 5400rpmwith 16gb ram. This is all that I would use the machine for, but feel pressured to purchase the Fusion drive.
And I know the Fusion would make sense, but I guess I'm feeling stubborn
I think you'd be more than fine. If it was really an issue and you didn't want to tinker much, you could always add an SSD drive in a USB 3 enclosure. You'd still get much faster read/write speeds than an internal 7200 RPM HDD. You could set that up as your scratch disk to improve performance at the very least I'd imagine.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 07:26 PM   #278
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Originally Posted by gagaliya View Post
can someone please tell me if the hard drive is upgradable by user? i want to order the 27" imac on day 1, but dont want to pay $1300 for that stupid ssd if i can buy one and install it myself.
I don't think anyone knows for sure yet, but my advice: Expect upgrading the hard drive to be pretty difficult or impossible. Expect it to void the warranty as well as you'll need to take the computer apart. The hard drive is not meant to be user serviceable. I wish it were otherwise, but it is what it is.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 07:27 PM   #279
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Originally Posted by faroZ06 View Post
Good, let it be delayed indefinitely so I'm not forced to update my iTunes to make it work with the newest iOS. Once the iTunes required for the latest iOS doesn't work in Snow Leopard (watch it still work in Windows XP), I'm hosed.

Looks like everyone finally has all of that iMac news they've been whining about on iPad articles.

Not my fault that is not to your liking and not wanting to upgrade.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 07:30 PM   #280
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flindet View Post
I don't think anyone knows for sure yet, but my advice: Expect upgrading the hard drive to be pretty difficult or impossible. Expect it to void the warranty as well as you'll need to take the computer apart. The hard drive is not meant to be user serviceable. I wish it were otherwise, but it is what it is.
This, except I have no doubt that they'll find a way to do it fairly quickly. But yes, you'll void your warranty and it's not something to tackle if you aren't fairly well-versed with computers. While I don't think the internals of an iMac are as difficult to deal with as some suggest, it's absolutely not something to tinker with if you're not already very, very confident working inside a computer.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 07:32 PM   #281
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Quote:
Originally Posted by profets View Post
$1300 for 768GB SSD? Hahahaha. Oh man, I know we need to deal with the Apple tax but that is a bit much.

Thanks Apple, the base iMac price went up by $100, and to add a fusion drive (read: throw in 128GB SSD which retailed on black friday for as low as $50) requires one to choose the $1500 iMac and then add the $250 option. $1750 for the cheapest iMac with a tiny SSD.

Also, could they not have had some simple SSD options like 256GB or 512GB? Jump right to 768GB for $1300?
Exactly why All-in-One systems are impractical for some. Aside from very few BTO options that are over priced, owners can only modify the RAM. Everything else is built in, rendering simple updates such as graphics cards impossible. The prices have increased tremendously since the PPC years, 27" base iMac's cost what a PowerMac G5 cost, in fact MORE than (I paid ~$1500 for a PowerMac G5 before the Mac Pro with Xeon Intel processors replaced it). Spending $2000+ for a 27" model that will lose AppleCare coverage in three years with little room for upgrades is ludicrous (so is daisy chaining numerous external devices, which many photographers are forced to do, defeating the purpose of a "clean and simple" all-in-one desktop).

Someone mentioned iMac's in businesses are fine as they can be repaired in 1-2 hours, B**LS**T. I work in communications and IT, if an iMac fails you better have a backup and hope Apple will fast track it as they need to diagnose the issue, order the parts (Apple DOES NOT carry stock parts), then repair. No on-site repairs unless you are using a third party, which negates AppleCare and is a risk should they further damage your system.

A tower such as a Mac Pro can be upgraded, individual components swapped on-site with little to no down time, and can last longer. My 12-Core Mac Pro, which is almost three years old but is still the current model, has lasted me longer than my MacBook Pro's. I added a USB 3 CalDigit PCIe card, replaced my ATI Radeon with a newer model, added a SSD and LG Blu-Ray burner (OS X can play Blu-Ray's with third party app's), four SATA II HDD's, etc. If one of my drives fails, power down, swap it out, done. Less than a few minutes. For an iMac, you're looking at days.

As well, my 12-Core system renders my work much faster than my MacBook Pro. Time=money, I need a power system and there is no way a Core i7 would satisfy my work needs.

Sorry, iMac's and MacBook Pro's are great for the average consumer/prosumer, but are not the desktop/professional "killer" many seem to believe. The thinner displays will be even more arduous for repairs; having worked on iMac's many times, removing the glass, LED LCD panel and other components requires a "clean room", time and patience. Businesses don't have that luxury, which is why many who have 3 year old iMac's and need to upgrade are thinking twice for many reasons.

Last edited by bedifferent; Nov 27, 2012 at 07:39 PM.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 07:56 PM   #282
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I wonder how many consumers obsessed with product thinness have ever burgeoning waistlines.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 07:56 PM   #283
Aluminum213
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So $2000 for 21.5" iMac with 16gb ram and fusion drive, yikes
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 07:57 PM   #284
Ademordna
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Originally Posted by AgentElliot007 View Post
I think you'd be more than fine. If it was really an issue and you didn't want to tinker much, you could always add an SSD drive in a USB 3 enclosure. You'd still get much faster read/write speeds than an internal 7200 RPM HDD. You could set that up as your scratch disk to improve performance at the very least I'd imagine.
I was thinking of using an external SSD to write the files to - is this what you mean? I also have no idea how to set up a scratch disk......and I have been working with ps for 10 yrs
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:01 PM   #285
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Originally Posted by bedifferent View Post
Exactly why All-in-One systems are impractical for some. Aside from very few BTO options that are over priced, owners can only modify the RAM. Everything else is built in, rendering simple updates such as graphics cards impossible. The prices have increased tremendously since the PPC years, 27" base iMac's cost what a PowerMac G5 cost, in fact MORE than (I paid ~$1500 for a PowerMac G5 before the Mac Pro with Xeon Intel processors replaced it). Spending $2000+ for a 27" model that will lose AppleCare coverage in three years with little room for upgrades is ludicrous (so is daisy chaining numerous external devices, which many photographers are forced to do, defeating the purpose of a "clean and simple" all-in-one desktop).

Someone mentioned iMac's in businesses are fine as they can be repaired in 1-2 hours, B**LS**T. I work in communications and IT, if an iMac fails you better have a backup and hope Apple will fast track it as they need to diagnose the issue, order the parts (Apple DOES NOT carry stock parts), then repair. No on-site repairs unless you are using a third party, which negates AppleCare and is a risk should they further damage your system.

A tower such as a Mac Pro can be upgraded, individual components swapped on-site with little to no down time, and can last longer. My 12-Core Mac Pro, which is almost three years old but is still the current model, has lasted me longer than my MacBook Pro's. I added a USB 3 CalDigit PCIe card, replaced my ATI Radeon with a newer model, added a SSD and LG Blu-Ray burner (OS X can play Blu-Ray's with third party app's), four SATA II HDD's, etc. If one of my drives fails, power down, swap it out, done. Less than a few minutes. For an iMac, you're looking at days.

As well, my 12-Core system renders my work much faster than my MacBook Pro. Time=money, I need a power system and there is no way a Core i7 would satisfy my work needs.

Sorry, iMac's and MacBook Pro's are great for the average consumer/prosumer, but are not the desktop/professional "killer" many seem to believe. The thinner displays will be even more arduous for repairs; having worked on iMac's many times, removing the glass, LED LCD panel and other components requires a "clean room", time and patience. Businesses don't have that luxury, which is why many who have 3 year old iMac's and need to upgrade are thinking twice for many reasons.
For casual use, iMacs are the most consumer friendly desktop you can buy
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:06 PM   #286
namethisfile
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this new imac looks great. the beefy gpu is very consoling. none of my macs can handle Motion X

i feel like the apple pro X apps likes more cores.

but i am not sure. i don't want to buy another mac and be slow.

it's just head scratching that my mac mini 2011 model with core i7 & 6630m gpu can't handle a little Motion X. nor, my mid-2010 MBP w/ 2.66 i7 & 330m. all modern computers that look old real fast when i take it for a spin around the Motion X track.....

whatever....
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:09 PM   #287
Tinyluph
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A little disappointed you can't configure the base 27" to get the 680MX for better gaming performance in a cheaper model, but I suppose I was sorta expecting that.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:28 PM   #288
bretm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jessica. View Post
That would be nice for sure.

I can't believe that we've come to the point where a high end iMac model is as much as my MacPro was in 2008. Ah well, such is life.
You are out of your mind. Fr one, the price hasn't changed from 2011. And, I don't think your MacPro came with a $1000 Cinema Display.

Not to mention, it was a down and dirty low end MacPro that was $2500.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by bedifferent View Post
Exactly why All-in-One systems are impractical for some. Aside from very few BTO options that are over priced, owners can only modify the RAM. Everything else is built in, rendering simple updates such as graphics cards impossible. The prices have increased tremendously since the PPC years, 27" base iMac's cost what a PowerMac G5 cost, in fact MORE than (I paid ~$1500 for a PowerMac G5 before the Mac Pro with Xeon Intel processors replaced it). Spending $2000+ for a 27" model that will lose AppleCare coverage in three years with little room for upgrades is ludicrous (so is daisy chaining numerous external devices, which many photographers are forced to do, defeating the purpose of a "clean and simple" all-in-one desktop).

Someone mentioned iMac's in businesses are fine as they can be repaired in 1-2 hours, B**LS**T. I work in communications and IT, if an iMac fails you better have a backup and hope Apple will fast track it as they need to diagnose the issue, order the parts (Apple DOES NOT carry stock parts), then repair. No on-site repairs unless you are using a third party, which negates AppleCare and is a risk should they further damage your system.

A tower such as a Mac Pro can be upgraded, individual components swapped on-site with little to no down time, and can last longer. My 12-Core Mac Pro, which is almost three years old but is still the current model, has lasted me longer than my MacBook Pro's. I added a USB 3 CalDigit PCIe card, replaced my ATI Radeon with a newer model, added a SSD and LG Blu-Ray burner (OS X can play Blu-Ray's with third party app's), four SATA II HDD's, etc. If one of my drives fails, power down, swap it out, done. Less than a few minutes. For an iMac, you're looking at days.

As well, my 12-Core system renders my work much faster than my MacBook Pro. Time=money, I need a power system and there is no way a Core i7 would satisfy my work needs.

Sorry, iMac's and MacBook Pro's are great for the average consumer/prosumer, but are not the desktop/professional "killer" many seem to believe. The thinner displays will be even more arduous for repairs; having worked on iMac's many times, removing the glass, LED LCD panel and other components requires a "clean room", time and patience. Businesses don't have that luxury, which is why many who have 3 year old iMac's and need to upgrade are thinking twice for many reasons.
No, they don't have that kind of time. They'd just go buy another one while waiting for repairs. That's what I'd do. If you have paying work to do, you get it done however you have to. I'd have one fedexed to my door the next morning or walk into the store and get a new one. Sell it for a small discount after the other is repaired. Definitely don't pay the Apple tax for support.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by iChrist View Post
This is a lie.


Depends on the bus. FW800? Yeah, pretty much the same. eSata or TB? You'd tell.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:29 PM   #289
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Any word on official UK and European BTO prices from vendors outside the United States?
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:31 PM   #290
Lancer
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Why do threads like this always degrade into the age old debate PC v Mac?

You buy what you want, if you're a PC fan so be it but why come here complaining about something you clearly have no intention on EVER buying?

FYI I have both a PC and Mac and the only upgrade I've done with the PCs I've owned is the RAM and maybe a bigger HDD, same goes for the current G5 Tower I have. My previous G4 Tower I upgraded just about everything including 2x CPUs, RAM, HDD, Video, added USB2 and of course the Monitor several times. I even replace the power supply fan once when it died so don't tell me Mac's can't be upgraded.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:36 PM   #291
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Originally Posted by Aluminum213 View Post
So $2000 for 21.5" iMac with 16gb ram and fusion drive, yikes
Or you could quit being the fusion early adopter, get a maxed out 27" for less than $2500 and buy your RAM on amazon or 1/10th the price.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lancer View Post
Why do threads like this always degrade into the age old debate PC v Mac?

You buy what you want, if you're a PC fan so be it but why come here complaining about something you clearly have no intention on EVER buying?
I don't get the PC argument. Vision is offering a i3, with 500gigs, 4 gigs of ram, in a big crappy 1980s case, with some useless Gfx card for $599. THAT'S A DEAL??? That's a piece of garbage by comparison. I didn't even know you could buy an i3 anymore. A Mac mini would be a better choice easy.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:52 PM   #292
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Originally Posted by Ademordna View Post
I was thinking of using an external SSD to write the files to - is this what you mean? I also have no idea how to set up a scratch disk......and I have been working with ps for 10 yrs
http://blogs.adobe.com/crawlspace/20...e.html#storage
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:53 PM   #293
Lancer
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Originally Posted by bretm View Post
I don't get the PC argument. Vision is offering a i3, with 500gigs, 4 gigs of ram, in a big crappy 1980s case, with some useless Gfx card for $599. THAT'S A DEAL??? That's a piece of garbage by comparison. I didn't even know you could buy an i3 anymore. A Mac mini would be a better choice easy.
ITA - you don't compare (on price) a BMW v KIA which could have the same basic 'spec', so why compare a cheaply built PC to a Mac, if you're going to do that compare it to a top price PC with at least a small amount of design style?
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:54 PM   #294
joelhinch
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I dont know if I'm ready to pay $250 ($300 AU) for a 128GB SSD, c'mon Apple. and the price of the RAM is horrendous.. 32GB of 1600MHz (4x 8GB NB DIMMS) costs about $200 aftermarket. $400 premium? No thanks!
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:56 PM   #295
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Originally Posted by TsMkLg068426 View Post
Not my fault that is not to your liking and not wanting to upgrade.
I didn't say it was. It's Apple's fault that the latest iTunes works in Windows XP but not Leopard and that (Mountain) Lion doesn't support Rosetta, which makes it a no-go for me.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:58 PM   #296
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Originally Posted by bretm View Post
Or you could quit being the fusion early adopter, get a maxed out 27" for less than $2500 and buy your RAM on amazon or 1/10th the price.[COLOR="#808080"]

----------sy.
What if I don't want a 27"? I don't really have a choice
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 08:59 PM   #297
lilo777
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iGrip View Post
As always the thing that makes the most sense is to really load up when first buying a Mac. The hardware lasts forever with no need for any repairs, so you are limited only by the raw ability of the machine.

Get the highest available amount of RAM. That is a no-brainer.
Get the highest available amount of speed in the CPU. Every time.

Then you will have a reliable machine that will handle anything you throw at it for seven or eight years. And then you'll be able to sell it for pretty much what you paid for it anyways.

----------



Nobody needs more than 16 Megs of RAM. Back in my day, if you got 128k you were happy.

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But when you consider that you will be using the machine for many years to come, and that when you sell it you;'ll get back almost all of your money, it doesn't seem so bad.

I am not sure everyone can appreciate your humor. Let's see, iMac G5 2005 right now on eBay goes for $190. Is that what it cost to buy it back then? Yeah, gobble up that Apple RAM! ANother claim - this iMac will serve you 7 years... Really? How does that 17" monitor from 2005 G5 sound today? Ridiculous? Not to mention the fact that Apple will make sure that you have to upgrade in two years by releasing a new OS that will not support your two year old computer.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 09:12 PM   #298
faroZ06
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Originally Posted by bretm View Post
Or you could quit being the fusion early adopter, get a maxed out 27" for less than $2500 and buy your RAM on amazon or 1/10th the price.[COLOR="#808080"]
You won't even be able to put your own RAM in the 27" iMac soon. All desktop PCs should allow you to upgrade the RAM! I'm disappointed in the new iMac design because of how they just made it thinner on the edges, made the back bulge more, and sacrificed RAM upgradeability. I really like it best when it's simple, square, and can be opened very easily like the iMac G5.

Also, I'd like to see a "Hyper Fusion Drive" option that stripes a partition of the HDD with the SSD and uses that as the quick-access part of the Fusion setup.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by lilo777 View Post
I am not sure everyone can appreciate your humor. Let's see, iMac G5 2005 right now on eBay goes for $190. Is that what it cost to buy it back then? Yeah, gobble up that Apple RAM! ANother claim - this iMac will serve you 7 years... Really? How does that 17" monitor from 2005 G5 sound today? Ridiculous? Not to mention the fact that Apple will make sure that you have to upgrade in two years by releasing a new OS that will not support your two year old computer.
You don't have to upgrade your computer just because a new OS is out. A G5 can run Leopard, which doesn't feel old at all especially when compared to anything Microsoft makes. It's basically Snow Leopard but a little slower and more outdated, which is Lion without some iOS features, which is Mountain Lion without some other iOS features. The main reason I even updated my 2008 Mac Pro to Snow Leopard from Leopard was because Leopard didn't run properly on it, probably due to the fact that I completely screwed up my Leopard installation while I had it on my iMac.

Also, a 17" screen is bigger than any MacBook screen. It's not ridiculous to use a 17" screen. A 2GHz processor is not bad as long as you're not playing high-end computer games on it or doing 3D modeling or something like that. 1GB of RAM is not bad for typical use, but it just won't be a big multitasker. It can still do word processing, spreadsheets, amateur video editing, Garageband, video playback, Photoshop, and iTunes with ease.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lancer View Post
Why do threads like this always degrade into the age old debate PC v Mac?

You buy what you want, if you're a PC fan so be it but why come here complaining about something you clearly have no intention on EVER buying?

FYI I have both a PC and Mac and the only upgrade I've done with the PCs I've owned is the RAM and maybe a bigger HDD, same goes for the current G5 Tower I have. My previous G4 Tower I upgraded just about everything including 2x CPUs, RAM, HDD, Video, added USB2 and of course the Monitor several times. I even replace the power supply fan once when it died so don't tell me Mac's can't be upgraded.
The MacBook Air, MBPR, and some of the newest iMac models cannot be upgraded whatsoever. The Mac towers can, a lot. I am very, very satisfied with the upgradeability of my Mac Pro. It's wonderful.

Last edited by faroZ06; Nov 27, 2012 at 09:11 PM.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 09:15 PM   #299
Ademordna
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Originally Posted by AgentElliot007 View Post
Thanks, that's really helpful.
I still can't ascertain whether the external would suffice for data and scratch disk use though. It also seems to suggest that it will be imperative to purchase a faster drive - which brings me back to my concerns about the 5400.

I need to do a bit more reading, methinks!
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 09:21 PM   #300
uptownnyc
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Originally Posted by bigcat318 View Post
The 27" 2560 x 1440 IPS Dell monitor is more comparable. I believe the price is around $800 bucks. I use one at work.
How do you like it?

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Quote:
Originally Posted by iChrist View Post
So, is this a pro machine, or very expensive consumer toy? Might as well get mac mini with a REAL screen.
What screen would you recommend?
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