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How much RAM are you going with on the new 2012 27-inch iMac?
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I got this: http://www.crucial.com/store/mpartspecs.aspx?mtbpoid=06ED3C48A5CA7304
Part Description Price ea. Qty Total
CT3650282 16GB kit (8GBx2), 204-pin SODIMM Upgrade for a Apple iMac 3.4GHz Quad-Core Intel Core i7 (27-inch, Late 2012) System $79.99 2 $159.98
Line item subtotal:
$159.98
Estimated tax:
$10.56
(Free shipping (5-9 business days.)) Shipping charges:
$0
Estimated order subtotal:
$170.54
I don't disagree because I don't understand, I disagree because you're wrong.
"Basic consumer applications", that means nothing. Your basic consumer applications may not be mine or some other person.
And the argument about the app leaking is as good as the "you're not holding it right" argument for the phone.
It's not my decision whether or not the apps I need to use are leaking or not. The fact is, I have a couple of apps that quickly take a couple of gigs each, and if I don't want the beach ball, I just need to either close my apps frequently or upgrade to more RAM.
Oh and btw, you're conceding that you don't see any slowdown UNLESS you're doing specific things. Well, there you go... some people don't want to spent over $2k on a new machine and have slowdowns here and there. You might think an occasional slowdown is fine, and that's where you're coming from when saying 8Gb is enough, but some people like myself are willing to spend another $100 or so to prevent that beach ball to show, even if its only 10 seconds a day.
I'm actually buying the 27 because I needed 32 gigabytes of RAM. While I could have gotten by with the 21.5 screen, I want Mac, but I also need to develop for the SharePoint 2010/2013 platform. 2013 has a minimum requirement of 24 gigs not to mention other apps such as SQL Server or Visual Studio. I've been a Mac user since 1984 and will always find a way.
I'm not conceding anything. I said from the outset unless you are doing video, hi-res photo work etc., you don't need more than 8GB, otherwise you do. That us still my contention.
Most consumers have Office or iWorks, iLife, and browsers. None of those use a ton of RAM. But don't believe me, check Activity Monitor. There are tons of bottlenecks other than RAM that can cause beach balls. If consumers are looking for speed then there is the Fusion or, better, SSDs. Its a better way to specd $200+. Your basic mom, pop, & kid Mac use would waste 16GB of RAM unless they were doing the kinds of things I noted in my original post.
I'm sure you'll disagree. We'll just have to agree we don't see eye to eye.
You're right on one thing, is that we disagree.
Your statement is that unless you do video or hi res photo, you don't need more than 8Gb.
I am not doing video, I am not doing hi res photo, and believe me, I do need 16Gb or more, and I didn't wait for you to check the activity monitor. Actually that is one of my always open apps so I can always monitor what needs to be killed, whether it is an iTunes instance that went out of control or something else.
The problem I have with these statements is that at no time do you bother to know what a specific user's needs could be. You just classify users in a couple of buckets 'most consumers' and 'video/photo professionals' and think that's enough to define the best configuration for each.
I can tell you that I know a LOT of 'consumers' that definitely need more than 8Gb, and I also know a lot of professional that don't, so this classification is what makes no sense.
Your configuration should not be based on whether or not you're a 'basic consumer' or not, it should be based on what apps you use or need, what you are doing with them, etc, etc... If you are already a mac user, it should be based on a careful analysis of your usage pattern and your current bottlenecks.
Well, that's not my statement, but not going to beat the dead horse. My original comment wasn't based on your personal use. It's not about you. Don't take my comments so personally. 8GB is what the "basic family household" use can live with. Yes, there is such a thing. Obviously, every user's needs are different, but generally, user's clump up into what marketers call "demographics."
I'm a champion of more RAM if it's inexpensive. $200 for an additional 8GB isn't a worthwhile upgrade unless you can actually use it. You can, or at least you think you can. I don't know your setup. Beachballs are caused by lots of factors. But, again, 90% of the people milling about in the Apple Store will do just fine with 8GB.
If you max it from Apple, it's $600.
It's trivial to open the back door.
It's trivial to use the Activity Monitor to find out if you need more RAM.
For me, by the time I need more RAM, 32GB might be $70.
That's exactly what I did. I'm upgrading from a 3 GB iMac (where I'm often out of memory), so I expect 8 GB to be fine at first. I'll wait a while to upgrade to 24 GB, and maybe RAM will be even cheaper by then.
Well, since you talk about your original comment, let me quote you again:
And I maintain, that it's not as simple as saying, oh well I don' do any of those 3 things, therefore I will be fine. It's based on a more careful analysis of individual needs.
It's never been about me, I certainly don't fit in your 'general use' category anyway, I am an iOS/MacOS app developer and I am on my Mac 18 hours a day, so that was never about me, but warning others that your comment about finding out whether or not you need ram based on whether or not you do one of 3 specific tasks was a little simplistic and misguided.
Here is the core of the problem. In the same sentence you tell us we can put users in a 'general use' bucket, but that obviously every user need is different. Well that's two opposite things. Because if every user's needs are different, then let's look at that user's needs and find out if they need that ram or not!
First let's not forget we talk about a $170 upgrade on a $2,000+ computer.
And second, we agree, even $1 spent is ridiculous if you don't use it. The point is, deciding whether or not you use it is more complicated than just saying "You're not using VMWare and you don't do video editing? then you don't need it"
Thanks for the patronizing comments, but again it's kinda my job so don't worry about my abilities to assess my needs.
I guess I just don't like the way you express your opinions as facts. Some people come here to get answers, and I don't think it's good ideas to tell them 'you don't need this', or '90% don't need this' (based on what analysis?) with such confidence, without even asking how they plan on using their machine.
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Oh, and I give you the last word if you wish, tired of this thread. Enjoy your 8Gb and occasional slowdowns.
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Me too. Thanks, but don't presume you know how my computers run. They run just great. Haven't had a beach ball since I went SSD.
App development, XCode is using a stupid amount of memory on large projects.
Source control software like Github
Safari alone is often using 1Gb+ just having 8 tabs or so open.
I am having real time backup with Crashplan, that takes up to 1Gb as well
Dropbox is always synchronizing as well
Mail+Finder... uses a 1Gb or so
iTunes 11 seems better, but previous version would easily take 0.5Gb or more.
Microsoft Office..
Text Editor like Textwrangler opening large files
Preview with multiple PDFs open
Task List (Wunderkit)
When all that is open, I always get in the danger zone with very little free memory if any. I usually always have some inactive memory, some would tell you that MacOs is intelligent enough to recycle that inactive memory, but I just have to say, that beach ball is showing as soon as the free memory is gone..
So again, not saying that everybody is using their Mac that way, but that stating that "if you're not using vmware, don't do hi res photo editing or video editing, you don't need >8Gb ram" is too simplistic
Are you talking about ordering 8GB from Crucial now, or is that the 8GB from Apple?
Apple's.
I've never had more than 4GB; I upped my 2007 to 4GB last year. I will wait to see what my actual usage is before I decide if I need more than stock.
Yea, definitely makes sense to check first, unless of course your already know you've been maxing out 8GB before.
I am rather surprised at how cheap the RAM is now, but I'm eager to see how far these prices will drop further in a year or two.