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Old Dec 17, 2012, 02:51 PM   #1
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Remember, Movie Purchases Can Be Pulled From the Cloud

Just because you bought a movie doesn't mean it will stay in the cloud forever.

If the movie isn't for sale in the iTunes store, it will be pulled from your purchases as well and you won't be able to download it again.

An example is Poltergeist 2. I bought it probably a year ago when it was a $4.99 movie. It got deleted from my computer sometime over the year and I went to download it again. It's not there. I look in the store and it's only for rent so I can't download it from the cloud.
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Old Dec 17, 2012, 03:12 PM   #2
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Just because you bought a movie doesn't mean it will stay in the cloud forever.

If the movie isn't for sale in the iTunes store, it will be pulled from your purchases as well and you won't be able to download it again.

An example is Poltergeist 2. I bought it probably a year ago when it was a $4.99 movie. It got deleted from my computer sometime over the year and I went to download it again. It's not there. I look in the store and it's only for rent so I can't download it from the cloud.
Yes. I think people are starting to realize, at least I hope they are, that you are buying the rights to watch cloud stored movies while on their servers, not the movies themselves. And I think, Apple should be stating that in nice big font right next to the purchase button.
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Old Dec 17, 2012, 03:25 PM   #3
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Yes. I think people are starting to realize, at least I hope they are, that you are buying the rights to watch cloud stored movies while on their servers, not the movies themselves. And I think, Apple should be stating that in nice big font right next to the purchase button.
I'm hoping this movie will return to the cloud once it is available for sale again.
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Old Dec 17, 2012, 03:30 PM   #4
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Do you think it's theoretically safer to purchase movies that are Ultraviolet because of this? A studio is a lot less likely to pull a movie from UV as the studios *are* UV. APple on the other hand will always have to negotiate terms with studios and I'm willing to bet the studios make more on an UV purchase than an iTunes purchase where they make 30%, so they'd certainly have an incentive to water down the iTunes selection to make purchasing from them the better option...

Edit to add that as a side note: Poltergeist 2 is available to purchase in UV. Hmmmmmm...

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Old Dec 17, 2012, 04:39 PM   #5
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This is one of the (many) reasons I prefer purchasing physical BD discs from Amazon and grabbing / converting them myself...
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Old Dec 17, 2012, 05:16 PM   #6
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This is one of the (many) reasons I prefer purchasing physical BD discs from Amazon and grabbing / converting them myself...
Or just backup your content, as you should be doing with everything else.
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Old Dec 17, 2012, 05:18 PM   #7
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Or just backup your content, as you should be doing with everything else.
Sure I do. Nevertheless, I trust a physical medium far more than a hard disk backup on the long run.
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Old Dec 17, 2012, 05:51 PM   #8
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i use a mybook studio II in raid 0 to make it a 4tb drive but i backup at the moment to a 1.5tb need to get a bigger drive for the backup but i also have the mirror of my itunes on a 1tb and 750tb for my macbook pro 13in just to have a backup and i backup everything individually also to a 3tb drive but its not a complete itunes backup
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Old Dec 17, 2012, 05:58 PM   #9
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Or just backup your content, as you should be doing with everything else.
Of course, that is an option that most of us "tech-savy" people that hang on this forum know exists, and we have the technical skills to do it. However, I am thinking more about all those non-tech savy aTV owners/buyers that when they hit the "Buy" button in iTunes think that they are actually buying permanent access, just like if they went to Best Buy and bought it. The fact is, iTunes sales are different and Apple should make that clear to those less technical savy customers.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 01:30 AM   #10
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If the movie isn't for sale in the iTunes store, it will be pulled from your purchases as well and you won't be able to download it again.
That may be the case in your example (I can't confirm because I don't have this one), but it is not generally true. I've had several cases where movies were pulled from the store but are still available in my Purchased section. So far not one of my ~100 movies has been removed from it.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 05:21 AM   #11
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Is it not even available in 'purchases' in your account?

I've seen many a film disappear and reappear due to 'rights windows'. I download all my stuff anyway but it would be good to know if you can still access it under your purchases tab. I cant see how they can take it away from you when you have paid for it (the rights to watch it).

EDIT: On reflection the OP is only seeing 'rent' as they have already bought the film. Im pretty certain it will be available under purchases.

Last edited by MacBoobsPro; Dec 18, 2012 at 05:27 AM.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 05:48 AM   #12
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When you download from iTunes, you aren't buying the filming. You are paying for a license to watch the film. If Apple pull the film and you haven't downloaded it, you have no rights in terms of access to that film through iTunes.

This is why I always buy DVDs and rip myself. I know I own the DVD and can watch whenever I like. Also acts as a backup for the film. Same with music, I still buy CDs.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 06:22 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by spykthomas View Post
When you download from iTunes, you aren't buying the filming. You are paying for a license to watch the film. If Apple pull the film and you haven't downloaded it, you have no rights in terms of access to that film through iTunes.

This is why I always buy DVDs and rip myself. I know I own the DVD and can watch whenever I like. Also acts as a backup for the film. Same with music, I still buy CDs.
But if they remove the file from 'purchases' they should give you your money because as they have reneged on your right to watch the film.

So we need to find out if they still remain in our purchased items, which im pretty sure they do but I cant confirm it as I'm at work.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 06:58 AM   #14
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If Apple lose the licences to sell the film, it stands to reason they may also lose their right to host the file, thus it must be removed from purchases.

I'm sure somewhere in the T&Cs it will say that if they are unable to provide it, you can't redownload it. I will check when I have time.

EDIT: From Apple Store T&Cs

Some iTunes Eligible Content that you previously purchased may not be available for subsequent download at any given time, and iTunes shall have no liability to you in such event. As you may not be able to subsequently download certain previously-purchased iTunes Eligible Content, once you download an item of iTunes Eligible Content, it is your responsibility not to lose, destroy, or damage it, and you may want to back it up.
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Last edited by spykthomas; Dec 18, 2012 at 07:06 AM. Reason: More information
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 07:05 AM   #15
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That may be the case in your example (I can't confirm because I don't have this one), but it is not generally true. I've had several cases where movies were pulled from the store but are still available in my Purchased section. So far not one of my ~100 movies has been removed from it.
But if its pulled from the store, how are you going to stream/download it?
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 08:41 AM   #16
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But if its pulled from the store, how are you going to stream/download it?
From his purchased items list. Purchases and the 'store front' are two different entities.

Reading the excerpt from the T&Cs is a (little) bit of an eye opener but then thinking about it I suppose it sort of makes sense (to stupid movie studios).

I'll just keep downloading as before. I've paid to watch the film so I'll watch it when I want to, not when the movie studio tells me I can.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 08:45 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by spykthomas View Post
If Apple lose the licences to sell the film, it stands to reason they may also lose their right to host the file, thus it must be removed from purchases.

I'm sure somewhere in the T&Cs it will say that if they are unable to provide it, you can't redownload it. I will check when I have time.

EDIT: From Apple Store T&Cs

Some iTunes Eligible Content that you previously purchased may not be available for subsequent download at any given time, and iTunes shall have no liability to you in such event. As you may not be able to subsequently download certain previously-purchased iTunes Eligible Content, once you download an item of iTunes Eligible Content, it is your responsibility not to lose, destroy, or damage it, and you may want to back it up.
This is the hole basis behind this thread. Purchases can and do get pulled from a users past purchases list in iTunes so that it can not be downloaded again in the future.

I normally copy everything to a second computer, iTunes does it automatically for me but this one got lost somewhere though it was still listed in my iTunes movie list, the file just got deleted.

I have 210 movie purchases over the past five years and have only lost two, both of which I can't download at the present time.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 09:13 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by MacBoobsPro View Post
From his purchased items list. Purchases and the 'store front' are two different entities.

Reading the excerpt from the T&Cs is a (little) bit of an eye opener but then thinking about it I suppose it sort of makes sense (to stupid movie studios).

I'll just keep downloading as before. I've paid to watch the film so I'll watch it when I want to, not when the movie studio tells me I can.
From what I understood was that if it no longer exists on Apples servers/iTunes how will he watch it?
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 09:37 AM   #19
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From what I understood was that if it no longer exists on Apples servers/iTunes how will he watch it?
If it has been downloaded to a device (computer or iPad) then it can be watched, or streamed to Apple TV from there. But if he doesn't have a copy stored on a device then it cannot be downloaded again.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 09:45 AM   #20
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If it has been downloaded to a device (computer or iPad) then it can be watched, or streamed to Apple TV from there. But if he doesn't have a copy stored on a device then it cannot be downloaded again.
I don't think we're talking about downloaded content. Just purchases sitting in the cloud.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 09:50 AM   #21
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I don't think we're talking about downloaded content. Just purchases sitting in the cloud.
Yes, but following the topic of this thread, if it has been pulled from the cloud and you don't have it on your computer, you can't download it.

I have two movies that are no longer available in the cloud.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 09:53 AM   #22
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From what I understood was that if it no longer exists on Apples servers/iTunes how will he watch it?
It doesnt necessarily mean that its been deleted from the servers. Days of Thunder for example goes on and off the store all the time. It always seems to coincide with when it is appearing on TV. I cant imagine Apple deleting the files if they know by next week or so they will need to reupload because the blackout window has ended. They will most likely just break the link removing the movie in the store. But it would still be possible to download it from purchased items. I'm just guessing here and I maybe wrong but if you have paid for the right to watch a film and the studio reneges on that (Apple is just the middle man) then the studio should give you your money back or allow it to be downloaded from previous purchases.

If Apple and the studio have a huge barney and the studio takes all its films off iTunes and you've paid to view them then you would obviously demand your money back from the studio right? I know I would. Thats like George Lucas busting down your bedroom door and taking all your Star Wars DVDs away because he felt like it.

Thats being said all this is avoidable if you download and backup (making streaming pointless in my view) hence why I still run a 1st Gen hacked AppleTV with 1TB HD.

The thing that worries me is if you only have an AppleTV 2 or above (no hardrive). What happens when you buy films and the studio takes them away? Cloud computing is bad. Eventually it will go full circle and we will end up downloading everything again.

Last edited by MacBoobsPro; Dec 18, 2012 at 10:01 AM.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 10:06 AM   #23
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Yes, but following the topic of this thread, if it has been pulled from the cloud and you don't have it on your computer, you can't download it.

I have two movies that are no longer available in the cloud.
yeah that was my point.

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It doesnt necessarily mean that its been deleted from the servers. Days of Thunder for example goes on and off the store all the time. It always seems to coincide with when it is appearing on TV. I cant imagine Apple deleting the files if they know by next week or so they will need to reupload because the blackout window has ended. They will most likely just break the link removing the movie in the store. But it would still be possible to download it from purchased items. I'm just guessing here and I maybe wrong but if you have paid for the right to watch a film and the studio reneges on that (Apple is just the middle man) then the studio should give you your money back or allow it to be downloaded from previous purchases.

If Apple and the studio have a huge barney and the studio takes all its films off iTunes and you've paid to view them then you would obviously demand your money back from the studio right? I know I would. Thats like George Lucas busting down your bedroom door and taking all your Star Wars DVDs away because he felt like it.

Thats being said all this is avoidable if you download and backup (making streaming pointless in my view) hence why I still run a 1st Gen hacked AppleTV with 1TB HD.

The thing that worries me is if you only have an AppleTV 2 or above (no hardrive). What happens when you buy films and the studio takes them away? Cloud computing is bad. Eventually it will go full circle and we will end up downloading everything again.
There is a thread somewhere on here where a guy does just that. Buys content via apple tv and when the films distributor changes its taken off.

He called Apple and they advised him to download everything. lol
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 10:51 AM   #24
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But if its pulled from the store, how are you going to stream/download it?
Just because they don't offer it for sale anymore doesn't mean they remove the files from their servers.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 10:52 AM   #25
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If Apple and the studio have a huge barney and the studio takes all its films off iTunes and you've paid to view them then you would obviously demand your money back from the studio right? I know I would. Thats like George Lucas busting down your bedroom door and taking all your Star Wars DVDs away because he felt like it.
It's not like that at all. This is what people misunderstand about buying from iTunes. You only "own" the copy you download, you don't own the copy iTunes hosts to allow you to download your own copy.
If the studio demands Apple stop making their films available and you don't have your own copy then, i'm afraid, it's tough luck. Neither Apple, nor the Studio, are liable to refund you.

The thing to remember with anything that resides online, if don't have a copy of your own, on a device or backup, you could be out of pocket if anything happens to the online service providing it to you.
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