My opinion, that is really BAD IR. I'd take it back right away. I had a 13" that showed IR that bad doing that test and it showed up immediately after I bought it too. I took it back and got a 15", which also has a LG panel, which fortunately shows 0 IR. It appears you can get a LG with no IR but when they do have it, it seems to be pretty horrible and obvious.
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Do all RMBP with LG Display have Image Retention
- Thread starter bsen4961
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My opinion, that is really BAD IR. I'd take it back right away. I had a 13" that showed IR that bad doing that test and it showed up immediately after I bought it too. I took it back and got a 15", which also has a LG panel, which fortunately shows 0 IR. It appears you can get a LG with no IR but when they do have it, it seems to be pretty horrible and obvious.
Two of my Dell IPS display has IR when using the test. But under normal usage, not a problem. My usage is mostly surfing, word processing, photoshop, and gaming.
My take is if you don't experience it during normal usage, leave it. If it happens even during normal usage, then get it replaced since warranty covers it.
Specifically replicating the problem does not count. There are so many other kinds of test for displays and IR is only one of them. No one making comparisons of the two displays for color gamut, gamma curve, gradient and uniformity? Contrast ratio?
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My take is if you don't experience it during normal usage, leave it. If it happens even during normal usage, then get it replaced since warranty covers it.
Specifically replicating the problem does not count. There are so many other kinds of test for displays and IR is only one of them. No one making comparisons of the two displays for color gamut, gamma curve, gradient and uniformity? Contrast ratio?
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mattopotamus
macrumors Pentium
I very much agree with this. If you only notice it when doing silly test that are not relevant to real life usage, what does it matter? If you never saw thread about it, would you even notice the retention?
This is bad advice in my opinion. You should stress test a newly purchased computer precisely to expose faults that you may not notice during normal use which, left undiagnosed, may get worse and require an expensive fix down the line. Far better to spot it early and get it resolved.
mattopotamus
macrumors Pentium
That is why things come with a 1 year warranty and can be extended to 3 years for a small price considering the price of a retina laptop. All of those issues would be covered.
I do understand what you are saying though, but most users will not notice the image retention unless they try unusual test. It reminds me of that grey background with lines on an iphone test. People who were perfectly ok with their phones put this background on their phone and suddenly thought there was an issue.
N19h7m4r3
macrumors 65816
Did you know that Dell uses a lot of LG panels? Their U2711 used the same LG panel as found in iMacs.
Even so I somewhat agree with you.
I have Hazro H27WC IPS with an LG panel and well over a year I have not seen any IR. If it does show up on the rMBP I'd say replace it.
Although in Ireland that's a bit harder as we don't have any Apple stores and only a few resellers.
No worries, you do get people becoming a little obsessive over these issues, I can see you were addressing that segment now.
It's true Applecare covers you, but if you pick up issues in the initial 14 day period you are more likely to get uninterrupted use of your new apple toy.
My Mrs recently bought an Air and had been using it happily for 3 weeks until I noticed a whole line of dead pixels. When she first phoned Apple some genius told her (after half an hour of being transferred around and hold music) that the best thing to do would be to send the computer in or bring it in store for a repair under Applecare.
She feared the worst - dark, unending winter days separated from her beloved machine while it underwent surgery at the hands of an anonymous, masked technician. Would there be data loss? Superficial scratches? Do MacBooks dream of electric sheep? Worrying times indeed.
I got her to phone back and say the magic words Holiday Return Policy and a complete change of tune ensued - they agreed to ship out a new machine and arrange collection of the faulty unit after it was received, so she could seamlessly transfer data over and keep on computing.
The famous excellent customer service, then, but only after we'd prodded them a bit, and probably wouldn't have been quite so awesome later in the day, backed solely by Applecare.
treyjustice
macrumors 65816
Do I just call apple? How difficult is it to get replaced? Any idea how long they will need my laptop?
My rMBP arrived today with an LG screen.
I couldn't resist running the checkerboard test. After a full 10 minutes there wasn't a hint of image retention (not even in a darkened room with my face mere millimetres from the screen).
I'm going to try to avoid running any more artificial tests now and try to enjoy what really is a beautiful machine.
I couldn't resist running the checkerboard test. After a full 10 minutes there wasn't a hint of image retention (not even in a darkened room with my face mere millimetres from the screen).
I'm going to try to avoid running any more artificial tests now and try to enjoy what really is a beautiful machine.
Since you did the initial test which was good, I think you are doing the smart thing by not continuing to do artificial testing.
Jedi
macrumors regular
if you are close to an apple store, you can set up an appt with one of the Geniuses to test your computer. This can be done from the Apple website.
If the Apple store has the part (screen) in stock at the store, they can replace the screen in a couple of hours -- I turned mine in at 3:00 and got it back at 5:30. However, if they don't have the part, then it can take 2-3 days to get it back since they have to order the screen.
treyjustice
macrumors 65816
What test do they run on it? It is 6 months old but I've only had it a week. Guess I'm just wondering if they are going to hassle me about wanting a new screen or do it no problem.
It's a prebuilt test. With mine, they first ran a general diagnostic (which it passed).
They then ran a test specifically called Image Retention. The test displays a checkerboard pattern for 2 minutes, then goes to gray and asks you to wait 30 seconds and then asks if you see a pattern. In my case it was still clearly there.
With both tests they ran them from a bootable usb key.
PS: The repair on mine was quick. Dropped it off in the morning and had it back that evening.
treyjustice
macrumors 65816
Okay thanks for the info. I'm going to run the test again when I get home. I'll leave the checkerboard for 2 minutes then gray for 30 seconds and see if it is still there. I'm guessing if it goes away within 30 seconds I don't qualify for a replacement. Thanks again!
treyjustice
macrumors 65816
Just tried the two minute test and then waited 30 seconds. I could definitely still see it. It wasn't as bad but still there faintly. I'll be calling tomorrow and seeing what they say.
I used this test
http://www.marco.org/rmbp-irtest.html
And how precisely are you going to differentiate between a faulty device and a correctly functioning device? As far as I am concerned, a display which exhibits some minor IR after a prolonged torture test is still operating well within its design specs. If I run that checkerboard test for 10 minutes, my display also has some afterimages for around 6-10 seconds or so. I don't see how this makes my display faulty - after all, my usage of the computer does not consist of staring at extremely high-contrast squares all day long. I work with static UIs (like editors), which can remain on screen for as long as multiple hours, and I have never even seen even a hint of afterimages during my normal work.
I think by now it is pretty obvious that IR is inherent problem of all LG panels (probably due to the way they are manufactured). But usually the IR is extremely minor and unnoticeable, and only becomes obvious when running an artificial stress test for a prolonged period of time. A small fraction of the LG panels is indeed faulty and exhibits extreme IR. These are the computers that should be returned/repaired whatever. But returning a perfectly normal computer simply because some artificial test with no real life relevance shows a problem under extreme conditions - this is really beyond me.
A properly functional display should not show any IR at all under any condition.
No. If a display exhibits any IR at all, then it's out of specs. Image retention is not a feature of the display... It's just like dead pixels. Dead pixels are not a part of the display.
Static editors have the same effect. As long as you have something on the screen that's displaying the same thing for multiple hours, you run the risk of IR. I know because I have induced IR on my LG display as well.
It showed IR after 3 months of perfect operation, and then it got worse. During all that time, the only intensive thing I ever did was writing codes multiple hours a day.
You don't have to return the computer. Just bring it in and politely ask Apple to replace the display. They'll give you a brand new display panel that doesn't have image retention.
reery
macrumors regular
I've got a LG screen and IR as well.
It developed slowly. When I bought the laptop is was not recognizable during work, just some special IR-tests over a grey background revealed the problem. But after 3 months the IR got worse, now easily seen during usual work no matter which color the background has.
It takes about 2 minutes for the IR to disappear.
I've also 2 quite cheap HP IPS screens here and they don't show any kind of IR, even when testing with a grey background.
It developed slowly. When I bought the laptop is was not recognizable during work, just some special IR-tests over a grey background revealed the problem. But after 3 months the IR got worse, now easily seen during usual work no matter which color the background has.
It takes about 2 minutes for the IR to disappear.
I've also 2 quite cheap HP IPS screens here and they don't show any kind of IR, even when testing with a grey background.
I believe this claim is too strong. By the same logic, a properly functional display should have a perfectly uniform backlight, perfectly uniform tint and so on - but they don't. I am also sure that any display has IR if you reduce the observation time far enough.
And I would never call something like that a feature, its more a limitation of the technology.
I own a rMBp with a LG display since the beginning of September. When I received it, the first thing I did was the IR test. It did show IR after a prolonged run, but since I couldn't see during the normal use, I didn't considered it to be any problem. Now, after four months, it didn't got any worse - it still takes same 5-8 seconds for the afterimages to dissipate after 6 minutes of the stress test.
Or they could say that the level of the IR is within the specs of the display. Its the same with dead pixels - a low number is considered within the tolerance limits. I think someone in the forums actually described a test Apple service uses to determine whether the IR is severe - I forgot the details - but my laptop surely would have passed that test.
No, it's not a strong claim. And yes, a properly functional display should have perfectly uniform backlight, and perfectly uniform tint.
I have owned displays with non-uniform backlight and non-uniform tint. I always replaced them, and Apple always gave me a perfectly good one afterward.
You're paying 2 grand for the computer. You shouldn't expect anything less.
I have owned mine for far longer than you have. I replaced the screen about 2 weeks ago. And I have had the same gray background as my wallpaper since then.
There's no problem at all. And that's considering I work in Xcode in excess of 4-5 hours continuously every day.
I brought my computer in and mentioned image retention, and I was offered a free display replacement. No test done.
Practically all LG displays have the IR issue.
I've personally replaced my LG for IR (all of which were demonstrated to store manager) 7 times before I won the Samsung lottery.
There are also reports of several people getting 13+ LG panels in a row, all with IR.
The law of probabilities say that most LG panels have this issue or there are an inordinate amount of people who are unlucky.
Anyways, all repair parts are now Samsung (although the laptops are still shipping with LG screens....).
I've personally replaced my LG for IR (all of which were demonstrated to store manager) 7 times before I won the Samsung lottery.
There are also reports of several people getting 13+ LG panels in a row, all with IR.
The law of probabilities say that most LG panels have this issue or there are an inordinate amount of people who are unlucky.
Anyways, all repair parts are now Samsung (although the laptops are still shipping with LG screens....).
