Poor journalism? Not posting news that reflects Apple in a poor light.

[Sodner]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but does not Foxconn make electronic devices for MANY companies? And are ANY of them other than Apple EVER in the discussion about conditions at Foxconn?

I think Apple gets criticized more due to their standing as apposed to less.

[wonderspark]

Originally Posted by jlgolson

Just to head this off, I have been extremely skeptical that Google Maps had some rapid effect on an iOS 6 adoption rate and thought that the MoPub data showing a 29% increase was absurd.

http://www.macrumors.com/2012/12/20/...t-google-maps/

I do not know any "normal" iOS users (who make up 95% of the user base) who held off on the iOS 6 upgrade because of Maps. Plenty of them complained, but in the end, they have gotten over it.

Much like Antennagate, I think much of the fuss on this was from the media and tech elite, not the actual user base. The Maps controversy is well on its way to blowing over.

I personally held out on 5.1.1 until they brought out Google Maps. So did my girlfriend. I just updated tonight to 6.0.1, and she's still on 5.1.1, waiting to hear what I think of iOS6. Third, as I mentioned a few posts up, I met a guy who was extremely displeased with the new Maps, and was complaining about it in the waiting area of a car dealership a couple days ago. I told him about the new Google Maps, and he downloaded it immediately, and was thrilled.

So, I present you with three examples of people who stayed on iOS5 (or wished they had) directly related to Maps. The rest of my close friends are on Android now, so that's all I know. The reason it will blow over is because Google Maps has returned.

*Note: I have two phones, and the other line is an Android phone. I prefer the Android, however I do still enjoy the iPhone. It makes a good overseas travel phone with prepaid SIM cards, and serves as my iPod as well.

[Eriden]

Originally Posted by wonderspark

So, I present you with three examples of people who stayed on iOS5 (or wished they had) directly related to Maps. The rest of my close friends are on Android now, so that's all I know. The reason it will blow over is because Google Maps has returned.

I held off upgrading my iPhone 4S to iOS6 until the Google Maps app was approved. When iOS6 was first available, I updated my 3rd gen iPad to test out the maps app and to get access to Siri. Had problems with Apple Maps and decided against updating until Google was again available.

As to creeping bias at Macrumors, it's far worse at other sites. Try going to the comments section of AppleInsider. Until management at MR does something really stupid, like hiring Tallest Skil as a forum mod or randomly banning people who criticize Apple, I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt.

[Mr. Retrofire]

Originally Posted by MacNut

This site has goten away from rumors, and turned into an Apple PR site.

Really? Should every article on MR end with the words “Apple is our worst enemy!”? Is that what you want!?

Btw, i see a lot of Windows 8 ads on MR. Is that typical for a “Apple PR site”?

[snberk103]

Just to provide an alternative opinion... I've had no issues with the news reporting. Of course, I never read any of the patent stories. I just can't fathom how knowing whether a judge thinks Samsung, Apple, or the Dalai Lama invented something is going to make my life better. If Samsung is paying Apple, or Apple is paying the Dalai Lama - I just use the technology.

And... While I certainly don't want MR to become a PR mouthpiece for Apple, I also like that MR is intended for people who enjoy using Apple products. This isn't Consumer Reports.... this is a site for people who generally like Apple products. In that capacity I find MR works very well. If there is a new product, or an upgrade - it is posted here. I don't know if they are first with the news. But they post it quickly enough to be useful.

And when there are serious issues with an Apple product, I find out about it here in time to avoid the upgrade, or the download, or to unplug the hardware.

Basically.... I have no complaints. MR may not be perfect, but then who is?

Signed

Happy Camper....

[MacNut]

Originally Posted by Mr. Retrofire

Really? Should every article on MR end with the words “Apple is our worst enemy!”? Is that what you want!?

Btw, i see a lot of Windows 8 ads on MR. Is that typical for a “Apple PR site”?

How are you enjoying the Steve Job's yacht story?

[roadbloc]

Originally Posted by rmwebs

<snipperty snip>

This is a rumour site. For rumours about Apple's future products. Not a news site.

[rdowns]

Originally Posted by roadbloc

This is a rumour site. For rumours about Apple's future products. Not a news site.

I beg to differ. The tag line even mentions news before rumors.

[AnonMac50]

I used to read AppleInsider and MacRumors a lot, but AppleInsider became so biased I stopped reading that. MacRumors is becoming the same thing.

[na1577]

Originally Posted by WildCowboy

Point noted.

I'll also mention that we are currently breaking in two new writers. That's not to throw them under the bus or anything, as we think they're doing excellent work, but it's taking all of us a little bit of time to adjust.

For the record, I didn't even notice there was two new writers... which shows how well they have integrated with the MacRumors style. I can still tell which articles were written by Golson without looking at the header, and that is not a compliment.

But that's more for another topic. While I do read Apple news on other sites, MacRumors is the one that I pay the most attention to, so when MR doesn't post the "full story" it's not really obvious to me. While it's obvious that there is going to be some degree of Apple favoritism here, deliberately hiding facts is a completely different story. But again, it's not something that I have noticed.

[phuocsandiego]

Originally Posted by snberk103

Just to provide an alternative opinion... I've had no issues with the news reporting. Of course, I never read any of the patent stories. I just can't fathom how knowing whether a judge thinks Samsung, Apple, or the Dalai Lama invented something is going to make my life better. If Samsung is paying Apple, or Apple is paying the Dalai Lama - I just use the technology.

Maybe you should care just a little. You're right in the sense that it doesn't matter who pays who but if someone's being paid, guess who's ultimately paying? That's right... you and me as the end users. Any patent licensing is paid for directly by us.

And that's why I care and think that software patents are stupid to begin with without an actual implementation.

[bradl]

Originally Posted by wonderspark

How other news sites handled the same news:

CNN
Reuters video and text version.
Los Angeles Times
Wall Street Journal
The Verge

I saw this news EVERYWHERE before MacRumors as well, meaning MR had more time to get it right, but failed to do so.

We all know that the people who run a website can and will do as they see fit, but what's being pointed out here is that people are noticing a difference in how things are handled. I'm sure most people love it, don't care or don't notice, but I think the point of this thread is to draw some attention to the accountability factor, and question the integrity of the way "news" is reported.

This will be my only post in this thread, and hopefully something everyone will think about.

Not for nothing, but journalism is not and should not ever be about "fresh, fast, and first." A Huge case in point, where journalists got everything wrong the first 2 days of an event: Sandy Hook. most "journalists" in today's world of the 24-hour news cycle have been sacrificing accuracy and integrity for getting the news out first to have the claim that "they were first on the scene to report it." That may well be true, but that doesn't mean that what they reported was correct; hence all the backtracking people have to do, calling those reports under scrutiny.

I'd rather have a site that, if it can be done, be fast, first, and ACCURATE, and if the first two can't be done, make sure we have the right info than not, otherwise you have more rumour, and more noise than signal.

BL.

[theSeb]

Originally Posted by Sodner

Correct me if I'm wrong, but does not Foxconn make electronic devices for MANY companies? And are ANY of them other than Apple EVER in the discussion about conditions at Foxconn?

I think Apple gets criticized more due to their standing as apposed to less.

You're correct. Foxconn makes a lot of products that have nothing to do with Apple, like PS3, Kindle, Xbox 360 and Nintendo Wii U.

Originally Posted by Wikipedia

Major customers of Foxconn include or have included:

Acer Inc. (Taiwan)[39]
Amazon.com (United States)[7]
Apple Inc. (United States)[40]
Cisco (United States)[41]
Dell (United States)[42]
Hewlett-Packard (United States)[43]
Microsoft (United States)[44]
Motorola Mobility (United States)[42]
Nintendo (Japan)[45]
Nokia (Finland)[40] [46]
Sony (Japan)[8]
Toshiba (Japan) [47]
Vizio (United States)[48]

[Confuzzzed]

Working conditions in mines of yesteryear were not great, yet people felt no remorse heating their houses with what came out of them. The same argument can be made for working conditions in kitchens in most exotic places people like to take their holidays at, yet nobody chooses their next destination on the back of ethical rankings. That way we'd all end up holidaying in Scarborough and it's wet there 300 days of the year (probably, sorry don't want to get sued).

[Digital Skunk]

Originally Posted by tobefirst

I hadn't thought of MR's articles as overly pro-Apple. Of course, I used to read MacDailyNews. If you want to see ridiculously pro-Apple articles, you can find them there.

MacLife is even more so. They waist time doing comparisons of Apple's competitor's products and of course pat it with opinions and such.

Originally Posted by WildCowboy

I agree with that...probably the latter, since as I said we try to limit lawsuit coverage where we can.

This is of course not true, but I do find it interesting to hear considering that there hasn't been an intentional shift in anything we've been doing.

There isn't any intentional pro-Apple spin put on things, and we in fact try to be balanced in our reporting. That's exactly what we did with the Google Maps story...10 million is a great number, and yet still it's a small fraction of all iOS 6 users.

There is an intentional pro-Apple spin, otherwise there wouldn't be anyone mentioning it. Not trying to be a jerk or anything.

I tend to think the people that run this site are in fact biased, and are slow to take even constructive criticism even. Or even make any necessary changes to reporting or moderation.

Originally Posted by Hellhammer

...EDIT: Just noticed your post above. It definitely takes time to adjust, I can speak from experience. I hope people can provide constructive criticism (like in this thread) because ultimately that's what helps you the most (well, at least it helped me, the point being that it's constructive and not bashing).

For the uninitiated it does. Anyone with any respectable training in writing and journalism would be fine.

Originally Posted by jlgolson

...Much like Antennagate, I think much of the fuss on this was from the media and tech elite, not the actual user base. The Maps controversy is well on its way to blowing over.

More of it has to do with the common user and his/her ability to just move on. Updating to iOS 6 is something most users are just going to do regardless or Maps or lack of working features. The option will come to update, and even the tech savvy among us are just going to hit the update button.

Any issues that come will just have to be dealt with until the fix comes. Most won't notice any issues, and the rest that do either won't use the feature, or will find alternatives. I agree though, most of it and other controversies with other companies as well as Apple are really just blown out of proportion.

Originally Posted by Sodner

I think Apple gets criticized more due to their standing as apposed to less.

Apple gets criticized more because it's a hit magnet for most sites. At the same time, Dell or some other company could do something fantastic and they'd either get no coverage, or MacRumors would spin the story to read that Dell is following Apple's led, or that other tech companies were slow to move on _________ initiative.

[macsmurf]

Another example:

There was a story recently about Apple Maps reporting the wrong location of a town in Australia. Since the misdirection was potentially dangerous the police decided to warn against using Apple Maps.

MacRumors digs out this article in The Register claiming that the source material was in fact faulty. That turned out to be untrue. It also was easy to check. MacRumors obviously had not.

I and many others commented on the thread asking them to change the article to reflect this. They didn't.

The next day another article appears, again claiming that the source material, not Apple Maps, was faulty.

I and others again point out that this is not true and ask them to edit the article. They don't.

I realize that MacRumors probably don't read the comments that an article generates but this is another example of MacRumors automatically reporting news that puts Apple in a good light without actually checking the validity of the claims. It seems that news putting Apple in a bad light is scrutinized more carefully.

[arn]

Originally Posted by macsmurf

I realize that MacRumors probably don't read the comments that an article generates but this is another example of MacRumors automatically reporting news that puts Apple in a good light without actually checking the validity of the claims. It seems that news putting Apple in a bad light is scrutinized more carefully.

We don't read all the comments. "Telling us" in a deep comment is almost as effective as walking outside and shouting it at the top of your lungs.

Email us at tips@macrumors.com if you want the writers to see it.

arn

[Mr. Retrofire]

@ the OP:
If you can count, then this is not the first Apple critical article on MacRumors. Your whole argument is non-existent.

Have a nice day!

[rmwebs]

Sorry be revisiting this thread again but why is it once again Eric sensationalising, and poorly reporting nothing, as news?

http://www.macrumors.com/2013/05/16/...reveal-little/

Every time one of these 'non news' articles appears it seems that its always on the homepage, and its always posted by Eric

I dont get it. What's going to be accomplished by putting a non-news item on the homepage like that? All it's done so far is created a 2 page thread on how it was a stupid idea to put it on the homepage.

[adnbek]

Are you kidding me? In the past 2 yes, no other company has received as much media scrutiny as Apple. And without denying that Apple has deserved such scrutiny, I can name several companies that get away with A LOT worse (to the point it makes Apple look like an angel in comparison) than what Apple has or is doing, without drawing anywhere near the same media attention.

[the8thark]

Originally Posted by rdowns

I beg to differ. The tag line even mentions news before rumors.

Image

The news part and the rumours part is not the issue here. They are working intended. It's the "Mac" and the "you care about" parts that I have issues with.

I do understand that breaking in new writers to fit in with how writing is expected to be done here can take time. Every publication, be it online or print has it's own bias/spin on things. And it can take a while to get in tune with the particular bias/spin the publication/online website you write for does. In that respect, good luck to the new writers here.

Mac - As many others have mentioned Mac rumours/news are a tiny fraction of the total news and rumours here. Read a good cross section of the rumours/news here without knowing the website name and you'd think it was a general tech rumour website and not a Mac one. I think this website's name needs to reflect this.

"you care about" - If people are complaining about the articles here then obviously there is an issue here. Is the issue widespread enough to warrant action being taken on it? That's the question the staff here need to decide. I seriously would change this part of the name to "best on the internet or something" I don't know, you'll think of something good. As I would assume do matter who you talk to, they will have a type of rumour posted on this website they don't care about. Many don't care for the patent rumours. I personally don't care for all the google stuff on the front page.

This website has evolved far beyond simple Mac rumours. And the website name should reflect this.

[WildCowboy]

Originally Posted by rmwebs

Sorry be revisiting this thread again but why is it once again Eric sensationalising, and poorly reporting nothing, as news?

http://www.macrumors.com/2013/05/16/...reveal-little/

Every time one of these 'non news' articles appears it seems that its always on the homepage, and its always posted by Eric

I dont get it. What's going to be accomplished by putting a non-news item on the homepage like that? All it's done so far is created a 2 page thread on how it was a stupid idea to put it on the homepage.

Sensationalizing? I think it's BGR who did the sensationalizing by saying these photos are evidence of a "big internal overhaul". I took a more realistic approach.

The fact is, they're nice, detailed photos and they're getting broad coverage. People are indeed interested in them, so we're sharing them while also noting they don't reveal much. If these photos are from where I think they're from, we previously declined to offer compensation for them...so they're nice, but not that nice.

Some people want to see them. If you don't, feel free to move on to the next article.

[Renzatic]

Originally Posted by adnbek

Are you kidding me? In the past 2 yes, no other company has received as much media scrutiny as Apple. And without denying that Apple has deserved such scrutiny, I can name several companies that get away with A LOT worse (to the point it makes Apple look like an angel in comparison) than what Apple has or is doing, without drawing anywhere near the same media attention.

In this regard, Apple is the new Microsoft. Tech journalists tend to love bashing the entrenched giants of the industry, while heaping adoration and praise on the scrappy underdogs. What Apple is going through now is exactly what MS went through during the late '90's, mid '00's.

If history continues repeating, in about 5 years, we'll have tons of sites calling Apple an irrelevant has-been in the throes of a slow death cycle, even while they continue making billions in profit a year.

[AppleScruff1]

Originally Posted by bradl

This will be my only post in this thread, and hopefully something everyone will think about.

Not for nothing, but journalism is not and should not ever be about "fresh, fast, and first." A Huge case in point, where journalists got everything wrong the first 2 days of an event: Sandy Hook. most "journalists" in today's world of the 24-hour news cycle have been sacrificing accuracy and integrity for getting the news out first to have the claim that "they were first on the scene to report it." That may well be true, but that doesn't mean that what they reported was correct; hence all the backtracking people have to do, calling those reports under scrutiny.

I'd rather have a site that, if it can be done, be fast, first, and ACCURATE, and if the first two can't be done, make sure we have the right info than not, otherwise you have more rumour, and more noise than signal.

BL.

Ditto for the Boston bombing. Lots of incorrect information reported early on.