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Old Jan 9, 2013, 11:17 PM   #101
2IS
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Originally Posted by jclardy View Post
AT&T is thinking, "We can end subsidies AND keep plan prices exactly the same! Win/win!"
Exactly, which means unless Apple delivers so,etching truly revolutionary with their iPhones if this happens to take hold, my upgrade timeline will be a long one. My phone upgrades as it is are more "wants" than "needs" which I can do without if need be.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 11:38 PM   #102
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Originally Posted by kaltsasa View Post
Yea but after 2 years, I'm not getting screwed (as bad) just because I think my iPhone 4 is still perfectly serviceable but ATT still gets my subsidy money through the full price of the plan.

I'm milling about switching to T-Mobile, but their coverage here in Iowa is spotty. Though I don't know that it's any more spotty than my ATT coverage right now.
This kind of sums the issue up nicely. T-Mobile's way of doing it is more honest. First, I can get a better plan then AT&T or Verizon offers for far less money. For instance, for fifty dollars on T-Mobile I can get unlimited everything. AT&T doesn't offer unlimited anymore, and the closest comparable plan costs $130.

The catch is you need to either bring your own phone, or have T-Mobile buy it for you. If T-Mobile buys it for you, you will have to make a down payment (e.g. $199), and then pay the rest in monthly installments. You can pay it off at anytime. However, the monthly payment for an iPhone would probably be about $20 extra dollars a month. So for about $70 a month you'd get a better plan then what costs $130 on AT&T. Once the iPhone is paid off the bill drops back down to $50.

T-Mobile doesn't have very good LTE right now, but so what? What is the point of super fast data when the plans are both capped and tethered? T-Mobile's data is considered 4G, which is quite fast. The iPhone 5 will support T-Mobile's 4G.
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Old Jan 10, 2013, 12:32 AM   #103
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Originally Posted by chrisbru View Post
However, if you're looking to switch to save money... Look into Straight Talk. My buddy has it and pays $45/month for EVERYTHING unlimited, and they now are offering the iPhone officially with a no-interest payment plan from Wal-Mart.
I'd still go with T-Mobile. Straight Talk buys service from T-Mobile and AT&T. It doesn't include roaming. Further, although the data is unlimited, it does tether the speeds after a certain amount of data. It just doesn't tell you when. Straight Talk also doesn't truly mean unlimited. If you use too much, it will let you know.

T-Mobile costs five dollars more a month ($50), includes roaming, has actual stores to go to, decent customer service, and is clear about when it tethers the data speeds. Moreover, with T-Mobile you get more options in terms of customizing your plan. For instance, say you always are around wi-fi and don't need a data plan or a very small one is good, you can make the plans as low as $30 a month. AT&T forces you to have a data plan when using an iPhone. Straight talk doesn't have the flexibility of creating custom plans. With T-Mobile if you are happy with the service, you can either go the no contract route or sign up for one of its value plans under a contract to lock your rate in. With no contract plans you are subject to rate increases.

Also what Walmart does is sell you the iPhone on a separate credit account then your Straight Talk account. So, you have to open a separate credit account, and have two bills. Currently, you can just buy an unlocked iPhone from Apple and take it anywhere you want. If you don't have the funds, you can charge it. If you have a low interest credit line, it probably will be cheaper than getting it at Walmart.

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Originally Posted by nastychild View Post
If I am not mistaken, they will offer plans for a bit less, but you are still committed to a 2 year contract. I don't see a reason to pay full price, and still commit to a contract. Which probably means there will be ETF if you decide to leave.

Anyway T-Mo is only 3 years later then the other providers to offer iPhone.
You are mistaken on a couple counts. First, T-Mobile offers no contract plans and contract value plans. The value plans cost about the same as the no contract plans (may be a little less), but they are good if you want to lock your rate in for the period of the contract. With no contract plans everybody can decide to raise the price.

Second, for about fifty dollars a month on T-Mobile you can get an unlimited everything plan. This includes unlimited Internet. AT&T charges about $130 for a comparable plan, and doesn't offer unlimited data.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post
Logic says you are correct but your contract does not. And current laws (which I agree need to be changed) say your contract wins over logic

As for this 'news', I'll believe it when Apple announces it. Regardless of WSJ, some t-mobile rep etc
This doesn't make sense because the person doesn't have a contract after the contract is up, which is why he thinks the price should drop since he no longer is getting a subsidized phone.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by aliensporebomb View Post
Public perception is everything. If all the carriers go to this most people will be like "I'm not going to pay $649 for something that cost me $200 two years ago". The big technology cellphone party where everyone updated their device with every new upgrade and iteration that the economy has been helped by for the last few years will be over.

The public perception will entirely depend on TMobile producing some kind of marketing puffery indicating that their monthly bills for subscribers are significantly lower than the other carriers.

If they can't do that and keep the prices the same this isn't a great deal for the average person looking at it on the street.
T-Mobile already operates this way. It is nothing new for it. Just currently, it also offers subsidized plans as well.

More importantly, you'd have to be an idiot to not understand T-Mobile's way is better and doesn't cost you any more out of pocket initially. For instance, if you want a $649 on T-Mobile and don't have the money or means to get it yourself (e.g. via Apple), T-Mobile will buy it for you. You will probably pay T-Mobile about $199 up front, and make monthly payments of less than $20 a month on top of what your monthly service plan costs. Unlimited everything on T-Mobile costs $50. So the total costs would be about $70 a month (excluding taxes and fees). Once the phone is paid off, the bill goes back to $50. On AT&T the same plan currently costs about $130 (excluding taxes and fees) and it never drops.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmhop81 View Post
yeah like my mother-in-law. it took her years to decide on paying the $49 to get an iPhone 4.....no way in hell she's gonna pay $649 to upgrade her phone when it's time.

You can't get consumers used to paying cheap subsidized phones then shock them at $649. Bc they don't understand that's how much the phones really cost.

If you are right I lost all hope for humanity. The math is simple. You go into T-Mobile and tell it what plan you want. Most people will likely go for the unlimited everything plan at $50 a month. T-Mobile will ask you if you have a phone. If you don't and you want an iPhone, T-Mobile will offer to buy it for you. If you go with the $649 version, you will pay it $199 a month (like with AT&T, Sprint, and Verizon). The remainder of the phone price will be broken down into monthly payments, which comes out to less then $20 a month. So your T-Mobile bill will reflect a $50 and $20 a month charge equaling about $70 a month. When your iPhone is paid off, the bill goes down to $50.

Go get the same plan at AT&T. First, it is impossible, as AT&T doesn't offer an unlimited plan. So get the next comparable plan. It is going to set you back about $130 a month. I am unsure about Verizon, but the same plan will cost about $130 on Sprint as well.

Who is going to fail to see that $70 a month for 20 months and then $50 a month thereafter is better than $130 a month for 24 months?

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Internaut View Post
As for T-Mobile's move, my spider senses are telling me they will both want their cake and eat it! So, don't be too surprised if, in the future, the carriers expect the full cost of the phone from you, plus a $50+ per month contract over a minimum 24 month period....... I love capitalism .
What many people do not get is that T-Mobile which offer more expensive subsidized plans it already largely operates on unsubsidized plans. Moreover, T-Mobile offers both no contract and contract value plans. I personally opted for the contract value plan because the rate is far below the other carriers and it is now locked in. Based on past experience, when the contract ends if rates are higher, T-Mobile will keep my rate at the lower rate as a valuable customer.

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Originally Posted by dontwalkhand View Post
T-Mobile, Straight Talk, SIMple Mobile (SIMple, get it?), offer exactly this in the US. However, I think the minute/text/data bundles are pretty limited in choices
This is not true for T-Mobile. The other carriers are buying service from T-Mobile and AT&T so the plans are somewhat limited. On T-Mobile though you have a lot of options regarding plans. You can even get a plan for an iPhone with no data or just 100 MB. There is a lot of variety concerning unlimited data plans as well. The variety involves at what point tethering of speed takes place.
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Old Jan 10, 2013, 12:44 AM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SVTVenom View Post
Why would T-Mobile discount plans by the same amount that you finance the phone for? From a business standpoint, that makes no sense. Just using nice, round numbers, you have this:
Huh? How is it that it makes no sense? IT'S A SELLING POINT! Get new customers by emphasizing that they can expect a lower bill once their phone is paid off. Otherwise, they face no substantive change in income from the people who upgrade every chance they get. So, from where I'm sitting, it make a h*ll of a lot of sense, from a business standpoint. It'd be a simple projection. Does the projected increase in userbase equate to more income than the loss of income from the people who don't upgrade immediately everytime? It's not so surprising to me that the answer to that question, especially in today's market, would seem to be "yes" for T-Mobile.

Quote:
Originally Posted by randomguyishere View Post
Any idea if there will be a T-Mobile-specific iPhone, or if they'll be selling the unlocked versions?

This could drastically affect sales since, even though their network is being "refarmed" to support 3G on the iPhone, that 3G coverage is very minimal and spotty (at least where I am), and leaves the iPhone users on Edge 80% of the time (just a rough percentage right there).

However, when I am on 3G, speeds are more than acceptable. Its simply a coverage issue.

Let's hope T-Mobile has a specific iPhone
While this must be taken with a grain of salt, the sales rep we dealt with when switching to TMo said that the iPhones that they would be selling would be 100% compatible with their network, even though unlocked phones from AT&T wouldn't be. He said that he guessed they were getting both the iPhone 4S and the iPhone 5, but on that point he did say he had no specific knowledge, only guesses. So, if he's right, there's your TMo specific iPhone...

Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post
And where exactly was that statement from the CEO because it sure wasn't in the MR article. His comment was so vague it could have been about anything
Know your history a bit...

T-Mobile USA to begin selling Apple products in 2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRumors View Post
...Deutsche Telekom CEO Rene Obermann has just announced at his company's analyst day event that T-Mobile USA will begin selling Apple products in 2013...
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Old Jan 10, 2013, 10:23 AM   #105
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Originally Posted by Terrin View Post
If you are right I lost all hope for humanity. The math is simple. You go into T-Mobile and tell it what plan you want. Most people will likely go for the unlimited everything plan at $50 a month. T-Mobile will ask you if you have a phone. If you don't and you want an iPhone, T-Mobile will offer to buy it for you. If you go with the $649 version, you will pay it $199 a month (like with AT&T, Sprint, and Verizon). The remainder of the phone price will be broken down into monthly payments, which comes out to less then $20 a month. So your T-Mobile bill will reflect a $50 and $20 a month charge equaling about $70 a month. When your iPhone is paid off, the bill goes down to $50.

Go get the same plan at AT&T. First, it is impossible, as AT&T doesn't offer an unlimited plan. So get the next comparable plan. It is going to set you back about $130 a month. I am unsure about Verizon, but the same plan will cost about $130 on Sprint as well.

Who is going to fail to see that $70 a month for 20 months and then $50 a month thereafter is better than $130 a month for 24 months?
This is how tmobile plans to do it...but you know what? AT&T and Verizon don't follow what tmobile does. Look what happened with shared plans...prices went up.

And there isn't going to be such a big gap from $130 down to $50. It's only going to be $15-20 IF any. What if they just get rid of subsidies but don't lower prices? then what?

My point is....people don't understand the true cost of cell phones nowadays. When someone like my mother-in-law sees $649 as the phone price...she will crap a brick. She thinks iphones cost what they are on subsidy. So if you tell her you have to pay $649 for the device and THEN $100/month it's just not gonna happen.

Also, you really think AT&T and Verizon are going to give you an interest free loan to get your phone?? Look at what they charge for insurance a month....this isn't going to be some cheap free deal.
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Old Jan 10, 2013, 11:11 AM   #106
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Originally Posted by Internaut View Post
Sorry, I was writing dollars and thinking in pounds. That $110-120 minimum you quoted is absurd BTW, even when you convert back to pounds. In the UK, you can get an iPhone at a reasonable price with a 30-40 month contract.
It is absurd... that's why I don't like US telco's
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Old Jan 10, 2013, 11:56 AM   #107
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If this is indeed true, the OP post, then I will most likely leave ATT for T-Mobile.

Im sick of ATT prices, yet if i go to Verizon its the same price & Sprint service sucks - so that negates any small savings.

Lets see how this plays out, but more competetion = better.
You see how NFL 2k was dominating and Madden bought the NFL license & went into the toilet!!??
Competetion breeds innovation & better products.

The best thing that may have happened in the last 3-4 years is the ATT/T-Mobile deal to fall thru thus allowing T-Mobile to gain spectrum & like $39 billion.
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Old Jan 10, 2013, 12:15 PM   #108
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Now to see how tmobile refarming turns out. Hope they pick up steam and become a real contender again.
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Old Jan 10, 2013, 12:17 PM   #109
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This will certainly prevent many people from being able to upgrade. I hope AT&T doesn't do this. I was able to upgrade in the past because $399 was easier to afford than paying $799 full price for a 64GB. I would much rather pay for the phone over the course of my contract than pay full price for a phone up front. I won't pay for a phone that costs as much as my mortgage.
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Old Jan 10, 2013, 03:40 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by dontwalkhand View Post
T-Mobile ending subsidies is going to align it right exactly where you guys have it in the UK, after you "Pay off" your phone, your bill will go down by $20 (or whatever your financing rate was for your device)
Then you're in for good times! A huge amount of the mobile networks' advertising here is about Sim only deals and there are some enormous savings to enjoy

Main problem we have is that LTE is only just getting off the ground... One network started selling it but the others are having to wait for the government to auction off the required bandwidth spectrum which is due to happen in the next few weeks...
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Old Jan 10, 2013, 10:37 PM   #111
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If I had to pay full price I would not get an iPhone.
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 01:21 AM   #112
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I'm down for no more subsidies and an iPhone.
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 03:37 AM   #113
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MetroPCS (the company that is merging with T-Mobile) new LTE prices



After the data limit is hit, they will throttled your data speed.

MetroPCS offer no subsidy but does offer financing. So if you are buying a $500 phone, you can pay it off over 20-24 months.


Once the merger happen, Metro PCS will go nationwide (similar to Virgin Mobile and Boost for Sprint) using T-mobile towers.
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 02:03 AM   #114
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Originally Posted by NewAnger View Post
This will certainly prevent many people from being able to upgrade. I hope AT&T doesn't do this. I was able to upgrade in the past because $399 was easier to afford than paying $799 full price for a 64GB. I would much rather pay for the phone over the course of my contract than pay full price for a phone up front. I won't pay for a phone that costs as much as my mortgage.
First, they still offer financing options. $399 up front, then $20 a month for 20 months would get you the same thing. The difference is that after the 20 months, your bill would drop by $20 a month, whereas on one of the subsidized phone plans, your bill never drops, even after you've "paid off" the phone. So, tell me, as you brought up your mortgage, how would you feel about continuing to make mortgage payments even after you get your house paid off? If you'd be okay with that, then I'm sure that your bank would be delighted to set that up for you...

Incidentally, another advantage of this "new" system has occurred to me. Under the old subsidized phone system, you had to wait until you were eligible to upgrade before you got a new phone. With this new system, all you'd have to do is pay off the balance on your old phone, then you could buy your new one. Nice and neat.
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