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Old Jan 21, 2013, 02:21 PM   #101
thekev
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Originally Posted by Tilpots View Post
Pivo6 posted the entire ruling in post #82 on this page. Second page of the linked article.
I found that LA times blog link earlier, but I didn't read the second page.

Okay so here is the education code cited in her dismissal.


They classified it as immoral and added that she lied about something that they deemed immoral. As I previously suggested, they are really reaching. Many hours are involved in obtaining a teaching credential. Those have nothing to do with any other field, so I think if any past profession is going to completely bar someone from it, it should be stated up front. It shouldn't be buried within ambiguous education code.


From the ruling...

Quote:
4. Cause for dismissal of Respondent, Stacie Halas, exists under Education Codesection 44932, subdivision (a)(1), based on immoral conduct, as set forth in Factual Findings4 through 97, and Legal Conclusions 7 through 13.5. Cause for dismissal of Respondent, Stacie Halas, exists under Education Codesection 44932, subdivision (a)(3), based on dishonesty, as set forth in Findings 4 through 97,and Legal Conclusions 7 through 13.6. Cause for dismissal of Respondent, Stacie Halas
,
exists under Education Codesection 44932, subdivision (a)(5), based on evident unfitness for service, as set forth inFindings 4 through 97, and Legal Conclusions 7 through 13.
Analysis re: Causes for Dismissal
7. It has been established that “Public service provides no hiding place for thedishonest and those lacking integrity.” (
Brewer v. Department of Motor Vehicles
(1979) 93Cal.App.3d 358, 364.
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 03:11 PM   #102
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Children are not being taught anything here except how to be biased.
That was my feeling. The hangups and prejudices have simply been handed down to the next generation. It could've been a teachable moment in so many ways, but the adults chickened out. Weak.

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7. It has been established that “Public service provides no hiding place for the dishonest and those lacking integrity.”
Quick. Alert the Tea party! Seems they've had it all wrong.
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 03:17 PM   #103
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Back to porn it is then.
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 03:35 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thekev View Post
I found that LA times blog link earlier, but I didn't read the second page.

Okay so here is the education code cited in her dismissal.


They classified it as immoral and added that she lied about something that they deemed immoral. As I previously suggested, they are really reaching. Many hours are involved in obtaining a teaching credential. Those have nothing to do with any other field, so I think if any past profession is going to completely bar someone from it, it should be stated up front. It shouldn't be buried within ambiguous education code.


From the ruling...
So, being "immoral" is all they needed. I can't imagine the *****torm if a teacher was found to be in a BDSM relationship with their partner.
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 03:40 PM   #105
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So, being "immoral" is all they needed. I can't imagine the *****torm if a teacher was found to be in a BDSM relationship with their partner.
Imagine what would happen if school officials used school issued webcam equipped laptops to watch students while they were at home.

Oh, wait...

Okay, imagine if school officials stripped naked a young girl so they could search her for Advil.

Oh, umm...
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 03:47 PM   #106
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So, being "immoral" is all they needed. I can't imagine the *****torm if a teacher was found to be in a BDSM relationship with their partner.
Given every mother in the country has read 50 shades of grey, I really can't see the problem.
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 03:55 PM   #107
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by your logic they would be.
ok..
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 06:36 PM   #108
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So, being "immoral" is all they needed.
Is there a legal definition of immorality?
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 06:39 PM   #109
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Sure it's whatever god doesn't like just ask around you'll get a cohesive and coherent answer.
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 06:42 PM   #110
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Sure it's whatever god doesn't like just ask around you'll get a cohesive and coherent answer.
I want to hear god's legal opinion. With precedents.
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 07:52 PM   #111
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from the original article.

Quote:
Halas, 32, was continually deceitful about her nine-month career in porn before she went to work at the school, the judges said.

Schwab said Halas “was being honest and forthright, but was embarrassed and humiliated by her past experience in the adult industry.”

Halas was fired in April from her job as a science teacher at Haydock Intermediate School in Oxnard after online videos of her in porn were discovered by students and teachers.

Student claims that the teacher was moonlighting as a porn star were initially dismissed after school officials said they couldn’t find any images of her on the Internet — but they were using the school’s computers, which don’t allow access to porn.

Teachers then showed administrators downloads of Halas’ sex videos from their smartphones.

In hearings, former assistant principal Wayne Saddler testified that at the start of a sex video, Halas talked about being a teacher and he felt her effectiveness in the classroom had been compromised.

After rumors of her performance surfaced, profanity was etched on Halas’ classroom window, a teacher testified.

Schwab has said Halas did not star in pornographic movies while teaching in any district. He said she took parts only during an eight-month period from 2005 to 2006 because of financial problems after her boyfriend abandoned her.

District superintendent Jeff Chancer applauded the commission’s ruling.

Halas’ decision to “engage in pornography was incompatible with her responsibilities as a role model for students,” Chancer said in a statement.
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 09:10 PM   #112
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Halas, 32, was continually deceitful about her nine-month career in porn before she went to work at the school, the judges said.
You lie to your employers, lie on your resume, you get fired.
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Old Jan 22, 2013, 12:27 AM   #113
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I want to hear god's legal opinion. With precedents.
Well you're just going to have to ask him/her/it. Better yet find one his/her/it's followers here and ask them, they always know what gods opinion is on everything.

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Old Jan 22, 2013, 12:54 AM   #114
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Originally Posted by skunk View Post
Is there a legal definition of immorality?
I'm not sure. I really hate ambiguity in something like that. I looked it up as I figured it would be something silly without a clear description.

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Originally Posted by MuddyPaws1 View Post
You lie to your employers, lie on your resume, you get fired.
That was listed after their main concern. It referenced the initial charge. I can't find what they considered a resume lie. It's unlikely that she collected a W-2 on something like this. It was probably a 1099. It wouldn't be listed as a job if that was the case. It's really annoying digging up details on this. I read through a large portion, even though I skimmed part of it. What I linked is toward the end. Beyond that I wonder how many people have been fired for resume lies on other topics in that district. Is it overlooked or treated as a minor offense in other circumstances?
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Old Jan 22, 2013, 05:07 AM   #115
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The firing of this teacher strikes as a form of sexual McCarthyism, for during that period people were fired from educational posts on the basis of being presumed members of the communist party, even though being a card-carrying member of the communist party was perfectly legal.

The problem with judges making decisions based on the morality of perfectly legal behaviour is that one day they will make judgements about you.

As for the teacher being dishonest about her other job: First, it's not an employer's business what a person does on their own time provided their actions are legal. Second, is it any wonder that the teacher lied given the discrimination and prejudice she encountered?

The more I think about this the more outrageous it is.

One more thing: Hands up if you ever had a sexual fantasy about a teacher without ever having seen him/her in any porn. Thought so.
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Last edited by VulchR; Jan 22, 2013 at 05:26 AM.
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Old Jan 22, 2013, 08:24 AM   #116
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Saying you have a degree from a college you never attended is a lie. Saying you have certifications or honors you never received is a lie. Not saying you waited tables is not a lie. Not saying you had a paper route is not a lie. Not saying that one of your responsibilities at a former job was to fill the printer with paper is not a lie.

You only put on your resume the bits that are relevant to the job you're applying for.

When asked about her previous job experiences that had nothing to do with teaching, she should have told them "none of your damn business." Granted, telling them at that point something like "no that wasn't me, I've never done anything like that" was a lie, but she should never have been asked that question in the first place.
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Old Jan 22, 2013, 08:47 AM   #117
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Originally Posted by MuddyPaws1 View Post
You lie to your employers, lie on your resume, you get fired.
Your definition of lying is lacking.

I didn't put my previous position as a cashier at Waldbaums on my resume - do you really think my employer has the right to fire me because of it?


I think this has more to do with sexuality than "lying". For some reason sex scares the sh** out of Americans. And the kids in this school are just being taught to continue the tradition.
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Old Jan 22, 2013, 11:24 AM   #118
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I didn't put my previous position as a cashier at Waldbaums on my resume - do you really think my employer has the right to fire me because of it?
Technically they do have a right.

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Originally Posted by Moyank24 View Post
I think this has more to do with sexuality than "lying". For some reason sex scares the sh** out of Americans. And the kids in this school are just being taught to continue the tradition.
I disagree. Americans aren't "scared" of sex at all. The nature of what she's doing, teaching middle schoolers, doesn't jibe with her past in the new digital age. To hormonal tweens, the whole situation is a distraction and compromises her effectiveness. She could do any number of other jobs even within education administration where her past wouldn't matter much.
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Old Jan 22, 2013, 11:38 AM   #119
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Originally Posted by obeygiant View Post
Technically they do have a right..
It would be interesting if they tried.


Quote:
I disagree. Americans aren't "scared" of sex at all. The nature of what she's doing, teaching middle schoolers, doesn't jibe with her past in the new digital age. To hormonal tweens, the whole situation is a distraction and compromises her effectiveness. She could do any number of other jobs even within education administration where her past wouldn't matter much.
Oh please. Americans have a problem with sex. And if you don't think they do, you haven't been paying attention. Especially with the idea of women having sex.

Couldn't an argument be made that to "hormonal tweens" a lesbian teacher or a teacher with qaudruple C sized breasts could be a distraction as well?

If an adult makes a big deal out of it, so with a child. With tweens it would be a big deal for like 2 days and they would move on to something else.

Last edited by Moyank24; Jan 22, 2013 at 12:21 PM.
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Old Jan 22, 2013, 12:04 PM   #120
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If you want to trust your child's well being to "reformed" pornstars, you are more than welcome.
That comment suggest you are not able to forgive, as in once a criminal always a criminal.
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Old Jan 22, 2013, 01:35 PM   #121
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It would be interesting if they tried.
I think it depends on the particular state's labor laws, but AFAIK in some states you can be fired at any time for any reason.

Except for reasons relating to federally protected classes and specific forms of descrimination, of course.

EEOC prohibited descriminations:
•Age
•Disability
•Equal Pay/Compensation
•Genetic Information
•National Origin
•Pregnancy
•Race/Color
•Religion
•Retaliation
•Sex
•Sexual Harassment

EEOC protected class defintion:
"The groups protected from the employment discrimination by law. These groups include men and women on the basis of sex; any group which shares a common race, religion, color, or national origin; people over 40; and people with physical or mental handicaps. Every U.S. citizen is a member of some protected class, and is entitled to the benefits of EEO law. However, the EEO laws were passed to correct a history of unfavorable treatment of women and minority group members."

So, fired for not mentioning a Waldbaums job on your resume? Legal. Stupid, possibly even imoral/unethical, but legal.
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Old Jan 22, 2013, 05:20 PM   #122
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I think it depends on the particular state's labor laws, but AFAIK in some states you can be fired at any time for any reason.

Except for reasons relating to federally protected classes and specific forms of descrimination, of course.

EEOC prohibited descriminations:
•Age
•Disability
•Equal Pay/Compensation
•Genetic Information
•National Origin
•Pregnancy
•Race/Color
•Religion
•Retaliation
•Sex
•Sexual Harassment

EEOC protected class defintion:
"The groups protected from the employment discrimination by law. These groups include men and women on the basis of sex; any group which shares a common race, religion, color, or national origin; people over 40; and people with physical or mental handicaps. Every U.S. citizen is a member of some protected class, and is entitled to the benefits of EEO law. However, the EEO laws were passed to correct a history of unfavorable treatment of women and minority group members."

So, fired for not mentioning a Waldbaums job on your resume? Legal. Stupid, possibly even imoral/unethical, but legal.
Only in some states, according to your post, and very primitive: it can't possibly result in a healthy relationship with your workforce.
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 09:52 AM   #123
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The nature of what she's doing, teaching middle schoolers, doesn't jibe with her past in the new digital age. To hormonal tweens, the whole situation is a distraction and compromises her effectiveness. She could do any number of other jobs even within education administration where her past wouldn't matter much.
What does her past matter, in this case? When I was in middle school we had a young, very attractive teacher. There were plenty of "rumors" (more like passed-around fantasies) about how this teacher was having sex with other teachers and/or students. There were stories of students dropping their pencils in the hopes that the teacher would helpfully pick it up for them - bending over in the process.

Basically, if my teacher had been in a porn production, I can't imagine that it would have changed the way that the male students were regarding her already.

It sounds like what people really want is to ensure that students won't fantasize over their teachers. Perhaps we should only have male teachers to teach boys, and female teachers to teach girls? Or maybe female teachers must be forced to completely cover up and show no skin - hey, since naturally pretty faces are a problem, we could even have them wear a burka, like they do in some of those Middle Eastern countries!

You're probably withdrawing from that last suggestion (I hope you are). So what's the real issue here, and where do we draw the line?
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 10:16 AM   #124
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One more thing: Hands up if you ever had a sexual fantasy about a teacher without ever having seen him/her in any porn. Thought so.
*sigh* not me. I don't remember having a single even halfway-attractive female teacher in elementary or high school. Most were either old bags or very homely.
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 11:21 AM   #125
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*sigh* not me. I don't remember having a single even halfway-attractive female teacher in elementary or high school. Most were either old bags or very homely.
I had a AP Chemistry teacher that was seriously hot! She loved the Sting and the Police as soon as classes were over the chem lab was rocked by them..
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