mobile OSs: Jelly Bean 4.1.1 vs. iOS 6

[The iGentleman]

Originally Posted by matttye

I was just going by what the video in the OP said...it's obviously outdated

You really probably should stop making arguments based on things you aren't knowledgeable about. This marks at least the second time now you made an argument about something you didn't know about. You did it before with Wifi Direct, when you weren't even familiar with how it worked, and now with the settings reminders with voice. If you're going to attempt to take a position, at least be knowledgeable about it.

[matttye]

Originally Posted by onthecouchagain

Non sequitur

if you don't think there is a shift and change happening you're diluting yourself. Even apple feels iOS needs a new direction (Forestall).

If you say so.

I'm sure there are changes happening with the OS, but your "changes among even the most devoted iOS fan" makes it sound like you think there are lots of defectors..again, when there's no evidence of this.

Originally Posted by siiip5

Uhh, this was not their best quarter ever. Profit was flat fro m the same quarter last year, market share shrunk, revenue estimates missed and let's not mention the very low sales of Macs for the quarter. Apple stock has tanked 30% in less than 120 days. I would call this one of Apple's worst quarters, not best. (BTW, notice how Apple has been extremely quiet regarding exact sales of the iPhone 5? They only would say they shipped 46 million iPhones this quarter, but 10.6 million of that was still in inventory channels. The iPhone 5 is very likely being outsold by the 4 and 4S, primarily in the U.S. because they are subsidized and cheap to buy.)

In terms of pure numbers, they made the most profit and most revenue ever, so it was their best quarter in that respect. The problem comes in that they didn't grow as much as people expected.

Originally Posted by The iGentleman

You really probably should stop making arguments based on things you aren't knowledgeable about. This marks at least the second time now you made an argument about something you didn't know about. You did it before with Wifi Direct, when you weren't even familiar with how it worked, and now with the settings reminders with voice. If you're going to attempt to take a position, at least be knowledgeable about it.

The video that the OP posted as the entire premise of this thread says that reminders on specific days aren't possible. The op should choose a more up to date video otherwise people are going to get the wrong end of the stick.

Clearly at one point setting reminders on specific days wasn't possible, so you can't really say I'm not knowledgeable about it - it's just out of date information.

[Vegastouch]

Originally Posted by matttye

If you say so.

I'm sure there are changes happening with the OS, but your "changes among even the most devoted iOS fan" makes it sound like you think there are lots of defectors..again, when there's no evidence of this.



In terms of pure numbers, they made the most profit and most revenue ever, so it was their best quarter in that respect. The problem comes in that they didn't grow as much as people expected.



The video that the OP posted as the entire premise of this thread says that reminders on specific days aren't possible. The op should choose a more up to date video otherwise people are going to get the wrong end of the stick.

Clearly at one point setting reminders on specific days wasn't possible, so you can't really say I'm not knowledgeable about it - it's just out of date information.

I am on JB 4.1.1 and i can set reminders so that isn't accurate.

[matttye]

Originally Posted by Vegastouch

I am on JB 4.1.1 and i can set reminders so that isn't accurate.

The video SHOWS google voice search saying its not supported, so it obviously wasn't at some point. Maybe gvs can be updated without having to update the actual software and just update the servers? Obviously that wouldn't update the offline version.

[tjl3]

Has the text messaging bug that truncates the number of contacts been fixed? Just wondering b/c I finally got a Nexus 4 ordered, but last summer when I had a Galaxy Nexus for a month this was a pain in the ass.

[mattopotamus]

Originally Posted by Vegastouch

I am on JB 4.1.1 and i can set reminders so that isn't accurate.

You can say "remind me on February 1 to pay comcast" and it will work? I remember being able to set a reminder but not for a specific date.

[The iGentleman]

Originally Posted by mattopotamus

You can say "remind me on February 1 to pay comcast" and it will work? I remember being able to set a reminder but not for a specific date.

Yes.

Originally Posted by matttye

The video SHOWS google voice search saying its not supported, so it obviously wasn't at some point. Maybe gvs can be updated without having to update the actual software and just update the servers? Obviously that wouldn't update the offline version.

That's my very point. If you were knowledgeable about what you are addressing, then you'd have known that what you saw was no longer applicable. Google Now/Voice Search has been updated a few times since its release. Regarding the "offline version"...this is a perfect example of what I mean. The app receives an update and you have new features, so yes the "offline version" (whatever that's supposed to mean) would have the same functionality if it is up to date. If you are not knowledgeable about something, it is best not to speak on it.

Originally Posted by matttye

The video that the OP posted as the entire premise of this thread says that reminders on specific days aren't possible. The op should choose a more up to date video otherwise people are going to get the wrong end of the stick.

Clearly at one point setting reminders on specific days wasn't possible, so you can't really say I'm not knowledgeable about it - it's just out of date information.

That would be like me posting a video of an old iPhone not being able to do copy and paste. When I see that video, if I'm going to comment on it, I should be knowledgeable enough to know that the information is outdated and no longer applicable.

[matttye]

Originally Posted by The iGentleman

Yes.


That's my very point. If you were knowledgeable about what you are addressing, then you'd have known that what you saw was no longer applicable. Google Now/Voice Search has been updated a few times since its release. Regarding the "offline version"...this is a perfect example of what I mean. The app receives an update and you have new features, so yes the "offline version" (whatever that's supposed to mean) would have the same functionality if it is up to date. If you are not knowledgeable about something, it is best not to speak on it.


That would be like me posting a video of an old iPhone not being able to do copy and paste. When I see that video, if I'm going to comment on it, I should be knowledgeable enough to know that the information is outdated and no longer applicable.

Erm HELLO?? I'm not the one who posted the video! The OP should be the one you're addressing this to, not me. He's the one who posted this video to show the difference between Android and iOS. Therefore if the information in it is not correct, it is he who doesn't know what he's talking about.

I simply responded to an obviously out of date video that shouldn't have been posted.

[WalterRead]

I'm not an expert or tech guy, so do not know under the hood things.

I've used both iOS (not iOS 6) and JB (in GS III), for me, definitely JB is a great OS. Much customizable, coz I love customizing my mobile's home screen with different apps, widgets etc. Especially the widgets are worth mentioning here. Unfortunately I didn't find anything like that (customization) in iOS.

So, for me JB wins, but iOS not far behind. If they could improve customization and some other things, they can really give tough time to JB.

[Vegastouch]

Originally Posted by matttye

Erm HELLO?? I'm not the one who posted the video! The OP should be the one you're addressing this to, not me. He's the one who posted this video to show the difference between Android and iOS. Therefore if the information in it is not correct, it is he who doesn't know what he's talking about.

I simply responded to an obviously out of date video that shouldn't have been posted.

I did post another video right below the first that had the most recent OS's to compare but as i stated, the guy doing it didnt do as good a job demonstrating them but it is worth a look.

[ReanimationN]

Originally Posted by WalterRead

I'm not an expert or tech guy, so do not know under the hood things.

I've used both iOS (not iOS 6) and JB (in GS III), for me, definitely JB is a great OS. Much customizable, coz I love customizing my mobile's home screen with different apps, widgets etc. Especially the widgets are worth mentioning here. Unfortunately I didn't find anything like that (customization) in iOS.

So, for me JB wins, but iOS not far behind. If they could improve customization and some other things, they can really give tough time to JB.

There's a jailbreak for the iPhone 5 being released very soon, so that will address some of your concerns. You'll be able to set default maps, change what icons look like, add toggles and widgets into the notification centre etc.

[The iGentleman]

Originally Posted by ReanimationN

There's a jailbreak for the iPhone 5 being released very soon, so that will address some of your concerns. You'll be able to set default maps, change what icons look like, add toggles and widgets into the notification centre etc.

A person shouldn't have to hack their phone just to gain basic functions. The fact that this is acceptable to people is perplexing to me.

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Originally Posted by matttye

Erm HELLO?? I'm not the one who posted the video! The OP should be the one you're addressing this to, not me. He's the one who posted this video to show the difference between Android and iOS. Therefore if the information in it is not correct, it is he who doesn't know what he's talking about.

I simply responded to an obviously out of date video that shouldn't have been posted.

My point is you were arguing from a position of ignorance. Regardless of what was in the video, had you been knowledgeable about the very thing you were debating, you would not have made the statements you did. Unfortunately, you chose to argue a point you knew nothing about, and it showed.

[matttye]

Originally Posted by The iGentleman

My point is you were arguing from a position of ignorance. Regardless of what was in the video, had you been knowledgeable about the very thing you were debating, you would not have made the statements you did. Unfortunately, you chose to argue a point you knew nothing about, and it showed.

It was not a subject I knew nothing about, simply something I had an out of date understanding of. When I had my jelly bean phone back in September 2012 it certainly couldn't add reminders which specified dates.

Seeing the video, I assumed (wrong I know) that that was still the case.

There's a difference between knowing nothing and simply having outdated info.

[ReanimationN]

Originally Posted by The iGentleman

A person shouldn't have to hack their phone just to gain basic functions. The fact that this is acceptable to people is perplexing to me.

Agreed, that's one of the reasons why I don't recommend Android to people who ask me- if they aren't technically inclined, they'll have no chance of making a full backup.

The iPhone should be more open, however, I'm not going to argue that.

[cynics]

Originally Posted by ReanimationN

Agreed, that's one of the reasons why I don't recommend Android to people who ask me- if they aren't technically inclined, they'll have no chance of making a full backup.

The iPhone should be more open, however, I'm not going to argue that.

Aside from losing my iPhone and having a mirror imagine of my iOS I don't find it's back up very useful. If I have a problem I'm restoring from new anyway. App data gets carried away on iOS too so I don't save that (Facebook is a good example of an app I delete once its using 200 mb of data and install a fresh copy Instagram is even worse).

I find Androids back up pretty nice actually. You'll have to re setup your home page but that trivial anyway. Last Android device I restored was my Xoom going from honeycomb to ICS. No issues, all my pictures and videos came back, my email, my apps, etc.

Maybe someone finds something in particular more of a pita with Androids back up method but I feel its a tight race for my uses anyway. Plus I'm not paying google 20 dollars a year for extra storage space like I am on my iPhone. You don't have to DO anything it's all automatic technically its easier then iOS.

[Tinmania]

Originally Posted by matttye

It was not a subject I knew nothing about, simply something I had an out of date understanding of. When I had my jelly bean phone back in September 2012 it certainly couldn't add reminders which specified dates.

Seeing the video, I assumed (wrong I know) that that was still the case.

There's a difference between knowing nothing and simply having outdated info.

Well about all that was updated recently was changing how "remind me" is interpreted--and it is not consistent.

I only got my first Android device (Nexus 4) in November of 2012 and at that time I could create calendar appointments by saying "create appointment" (or set a meeting, etc.) at any point in the future. If I said remind me for anything greater than 24 hours I was warned it could not do that. Less than 24 hours it would create an alarm.

Now it will still create an alarm if it is less than 24 hours. So, "remind me to go to gym at 7pm" will create an alarm at that time. If I say "remind me to go to the gym today at 7pm" it will create a calendar meeting for "gym." If I say "remind me today at 7pm to go to the gym" it will create a calendar entry of "go to gym."

If I say remind me in 6 hours to go to the gym it will set an alarm. But if I say remind me in 7 hours it does a google search. WTF?

I'd say Google Now is definitely improving but to me there is still a lot of confusion and inconsistency about it. Saying "reminder" should not trigger two completely different things and the 6-hour cutoff for "remind me in x hours" turning into a google search is practically insulting. If you can't set an alarm for greater than 6 hours TELL me. Don't do a worthless google search.

Oh, and then there is S Voice. Some say it sucks but I find it better at setting reminders and such. Whenever I say "remind me" to S voice it creates a task not a calendar entry or alarm.



Michael

[The iGentleman]

Originally Posted by ReanimationN

Agreed, that's one of the reasons why I don't recommend Android to people who ask me- if they aren't technically inclined, they'll have no chance of making a full backup.

That's not quite true, but I do get where you are coming from.

The iPhone should be more open, however, I'm not going to argue that.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by cynics

Aside from losing my iPhone and having a mirror imagine of my iOS I don't find it's back up very useful. If I have a problem I'm restoring from new anyway. App data gets carried away on iOS too so I don't save that (Facebook is a good example of an app I delete once its using 200 mb of data and install a fresh copy Instagram is even worse).

I find Androids back up pretty nice actually. You'll have to re setup your home page but that trivial anyway. Last Android device I restored was my Xoom going from honeycomb to ICS. No issues, all my pictures and videos came back, my email, my apps, etc.

Maybe someone finds something in particular more of a pita with Androids back up method but I feel its a tight race for my uses anyway. Plus I'm not paying google 20 dollars a year for extra storage space like I am on my iPhone. You don't have to DO anything it's all automatic technically its easier then iOS.

Agreed. I can back up my phone now, yet I never do, as I really see very little (if any) benefit to doing so.

Originally Posted by matttye

It was not a subject I knew nothing about, simply something I had an out of date understanding of. When I had my jelly bean phone back in September 2012 it certainly couldn't add reminders which specified dates.

Seeing the video, I assumed (wrong I know) that that was still the case.

There's a difference between knowing nothing and simply having outdated info.

The bottom line is the things you said were not factual, thus you were arguing from a position of ignorance. If you had been knowledgeable, you would not have been making the comments. You can dress it up however you'd like, but the bottom line is you had no idea what you were talking about, yet chose to debate as though you did.

[ReanimationN]

Originally Posted by cynics

Aside from losing my iPhone and having a mirror imagine of my iOS I don't find it's back up very useful. If I have a problem I'm restoring from new anyway. App data gets carried away on iOS too so I don't save that (Facebook is a good example of an app I delete once its using 200 mb of data and install a fresh copy Instagram is even worse).

I find Androids back up pretty nice actually. You'll have to re setup your home page but that trivial anyway. Last Android device I restored was my Xoom going from honeycomb to ICS. No issues, all my pictures and videos came back, my email, my apps, etc.

Maybe someone finds something in particular more of a pita with Androids back up method but I feel its a tight race for my uses anyway. Plus I'm not paying google 20 dollars a year for extra storage space like I am on my iPhone. You don't have to DO anything it's all automatic technically its easier then iOS.

That's exactly why iOS' backup is great, you backup everything- all app data, all settings etc.

Google's built-in backup backs up next-to-nothing. It may satisfy you, but it's pretty bad. When I did a factory reset on my N7 it really surprised me how little it retained. To get a full backup, you have to root and install something like Titanium Backup, which isn't going to be easy for those who aren't technically inclined. Btw, I'm not paying any extra to backup my 32GB iPhone 5 either, I plug it into my computer and it does the rest.

[siiip5]

Originally Posted by ReanimationN

That's exactly why iOS' backup is great, you backup everything- all app data, all settings etc.

Google's built-in backup backs up next-to-nothing. It may satisfy you, but it's pretty bad. When I did a factory reset on my N7 it really surprised me how little it retained. To get a full backup, you have to root and install something like Titanium Backup, which isn't going to be easy for those who aren't technically inclined. Btw, I'm not paying any extra to backup my 32GB iPhone 5 either, I plug it into my computer and it does the rest.

ROM Manager is free and does the exact same thing as iCloud. Makes a 'snapshot' of your entire phone at that moment and can be saved in the cloud, internal sd card, external sd card or any PC. It is a one click affair. And now, unrooted stock phones can get the app Carbon and back up their phone and apps simply as well. Nice thing is, we don't have to use a garbage program like iTunes. That's the real benefit.

And titanium backup works just fine as well. Allows you to save versions of any app or system file for use down the road. I can wipe my entire phone, and have it back up and running in under 10 minutes. I have a multitude of ways, from simple to complex, to do this. Options are a nice thing to have.

[The iGentleman]

Originally Posted by ReanimationN

That's exactly why iOS' backup is great, you backup everything- all app data, all settings etc.

Google's built-in backup backs up next-to-nothing. It may satisfy you, but it's pretty bad. When I did a factory reset on my N7 it really surprised me how little it retained. To get a full backup, you have to root and install something like Titanium Backup, which isn't going to be easy for those who aren't technically inclined. Btw, I'm not paying any extra to backup my 32GB iPhone 5 either, I plug it into my computer and it does the rest.

In short, that is not accurate.

Originally Posted by siiip5

ROM Manager is free and does the exact same thing as iCloud. Makes a 'snapshot' of your entire phone at that moment and can be saved in the cloud, internal sd card, external sd card or any PC. It is a one click affair. And now, unrooted stock phones can get the app Carbon and back up their phone and apps simply as well. Nice thing is, we don't have to use a garbage program like iTunes. That's the real benefit.

And titanium backup works just fine as well. Allows you to save versions of any app or system file for use down the road. I can wipe my entire phone, and have it back up and running in under 10 minutes. I have a multitude of ways, from simple to complex, to do this. Options are a nice thing to have.

Well said.

[ReanimationN]

Originally Posted by siiip5

ROM Manager is free and does the exact same thing as iCloud. Makes a 'snapshot' of your entire phone at that moment and can be saved in the cloud, internal sd card, external sd card or any PC. It is a one click affair. And now, unrooted stock phones can get the app Carbon and back up their phone and apps simply as well. Nice thing is, we don't have to use a garbage program like iTunes. That's the real benefit.

And titanium backup works just fine as well. Allows you to save versions of any app or system file for use down the road. I can wipe my entire phone, and have it back up and running in under 10 minutes. I have a multitude of ways, from simple to complex, to do this. Options are a nice thing to have.

Excellent, finally! Not a single one of my friends who have an Android phone have rooted it, I'll be passing Carbon onto them, thanks for that. Hopefully it works well. All other non-root backup solutions haven't worked with Jelly Bean so far.

I've never understood the iTunes hate though, it runs fine on every Mac and PC I've used it on and backs up iPhones and iPads without any hassle (I understand it gives a lot of PC owners issues though). Yes, iDevices are tied to it, in a way, but it does what it says on the tin and handles things such as backups in a way that those who aren't tech savvy find fairly easy to understand. Drag and drop, rage rage rage etc- I've never understood the complaints about that, the iPhone is following in the footsteps of the iPod, which was equally as tied to iTunes (I know it could be used with a handful of other programs, but very few people did that), not the more open and customizable Mac. That the iPhone is locked to Apple's vision of how things should be done isn't, and wasn't, a surprise, how the iPod managed music foreshadowed what was to come with the iPhone. Android covers those who want a more PC-like experience in their phone. Apple should open up the iPhone more, I agree, but I highly doubt that's going to happen.

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Originally Posted by The iGentleman

In short, that is not accurate.



Well said.

Until Carbon (as long as it works), what I said was accurate. No backup solution that advertised itself as working with non-rooted devices worked with Jelly Bean devices.

[blackhand1001]

Originally Posted by ReanimationN

Excellent, finally! Not a single one of my friends who have an Android phone have rooted it, I'll be passing Carbon onto them, thanks for that. Hopefully it works well. All other non-root backup solutions haven't worked with Jelly Bean so far.

I've never understood the iTunes hate though, it runs fine on every Mac and PC I've used it on and backs up iPhones and iPads without any hassle (I understand it gives a lot of PC owners issues though). Yes, iDevices are tied to it, in a way, but it does what it says on the tin and handles things such as backups in a way that those who aren't tech savvy find fairly easy to understand. Drag and drop, rage rage rage etc- I've never understood the complaints about that, the iPhone is following in the footsteps of the iPod, which was equally as tied to iTunes (I know it could be used with a handful of other programs, but very few people did that), not the more open and customizable Mac. That the iPhone is locked to Apple's vision of how things should be done isn't, and wasn't, a surprise, how the iPod managed music foreshadowed what was to come with the iPhone. Android covers those who want a more PC-like experience in their phone. Apple should open up the iPhone more, I agree, but I highly doubt that's going to happen.

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Until Carbon (as long as it works), what I said was accurate. No backup solution that advertised itself as working with non-rooted devices worked with Jelly Bean devices.

I just tried it. It works fantastically on my nexus 7.

[matttye]

Originally Posted by The iGentleman

The bottom line is the things you said were not factual, thus you were arguing from a position of ignorance. If you had been knowledgeable, you would not have been making the comments. You can dress it up however you'd like, but the bottom line is you had no idea what you were talking about, yet chose to debate as though you did.

I did have an idea of what I was talking about because I used to have an android phone running jelly bean that was consistent with what I said.

[onthecouchagain]

Having to go through iTunes to import music/photos/files is a dreadful experience. Another thing is, lately, when I click eject in iTunes to eject my iPad, I get the pinwheel and iTunes becomes unresponsive. Happens 50% of the time I eject. I don't know why that is. Only started happening after the iOS 6 update and/or after the latest iTunes update.

Being able to select what you want, then dragging and dropping is infinitely easier and more flexible.

As a music player, iTunes is cool. As a device manager, no thank you.

Also, thank goodness for DropBox.

[ReanimationN]

Originally Posted by blackhand1001

I just tried it. It works fantastically on my nexus 7.

Awesome, great news for those who don't have their phones or tablets rooted.