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Old Feb 26, 2013, 06:23 PM   #1
benproiii
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Boot Mac SE from Zip Drive

I have a Mac SE original version that has no HD or floppy drive I also have a SCSI ZIP Drive and a ATAPI ZIP Drive in a PowerMac G3. I tried to format a 100MB ZIP disk on the PowerMac with FWB Hard Disk ToolKit 4.0 and copy a System Folder from System 6.0.8 on it. I put the zip disk in the Mac SE SCSI Zip Drive and it won't boot, I have termination on and SCSI ID set to 6, it is plugged into the motherboard with a 50-pin ribbon cable (same one used for the HD). I think that it wont boot because of the FWB Toolkit media drivers as I read online that only the IOMEGA 4.2 drivers allow the ZIP disk to boot the Mac.
I tried using the 4.2 drivers but they are incompatible with the ATAPI version of the ZIP drive. I thought that if someone with a 100MB ZIP disk formatted with the 4.2 drivers could dd (copy block by block) the disk and upload it online and I could copy the raw image into the zip disk and then it would boot the Mac, would that work??
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Old Feb 26, 2013, 07:11 PM   #2
havokalien
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Not positive

If I remember right, and when I get some rest after I work tonight ill try it, the driver for the zip must be on the disk in the system folder. Also hard drive must be removed from the SE or it will fail (unplugging cable should be fine). If its the dual floppy version you should have at least one floppy that works. Only thing is the Mac uses MFS and its why you need a driver for it, but it may still need formatting to work. Ill let you know after I get done messing around with mine tomorrow.
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Old Feb 27, 2013, 12:28 AM   #3
MacTech68
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IIRC, Iomega mucked about with putting drivers onto the Zip Disk and NOT putting drivers onto the disk.

It depended on which Iomega Zip Tools version was used to format the disk.

If you use the Iomega Zip Tools 3.5.3 to "Format with Surface Verify", then it should place the driver as an invisible driver partition on the Zip Disk.

You MUST use the Iomega Zip Tools to format the disk. This is the only way to get the driver onto the disk. Also, make sure the disk is HFS-Standard format and NOT HFS+ (or HFS-Extended).

Note that Iomega Zip Tools was later renamed to IomegaWare - the two are different, and IomegaWare NEVER puts a driver onto the disk.

The other thing you may need to do, is to put the Zip Disk into the drive and apply power to the Zip Drive BEFORE you power on the Mac. This allows the Zip drive to have the Iomega SCSI driver ready to pass to the Mac when the Mac polls the drive.

I'm not sure if this will run on the G3 you have, but here is Iomega Zip Tools v3.5.3
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Old Feb 27, 2013, 06:39 AM   #4
benproiii
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Those ZIP tools are not compatible with the ATAPI Zip Drive, it says not detected. Could someone with a ZIP Disk formatted with 4.2 drivers use FWB Toolkit (or anything else that will copy the low level format) to create a block for block copy of the disk, upload it here and I can restore it onto a blank ZIP and that should install the 4.2 drivers on the disk, would that work?
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Old Feb 27, 2013, 09:50 AM   #5
MacTech68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benproiii View Post
Those ZIP tools are not compatible with the ATAPI Zip Drive, it says not detected. Could someone with a ZIP Disk formatted with 4.2 drivers use FWB Toolkit (or anything else that will copy the low level format) to create a block for block copy of the disk, upload it here and I can restore it onto a blank ZIP and that should install the 4.2 drivers on the disk, would that work?
Sorry about that - my bad, I should have thought of that.

Just a quick check;

Make sure the FWB extensions are disabled and the Zip extensions are enabled.

Otherwise, if havokalien is unable to help, I might be able to get something cranked up here to get you the FWB block image.
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Old Feb 27, 2013, 03:16 PM   #6
benproiii
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Another way I was thinking might work to startup the Mac SE is to get a Adaptec SCSI PCI Card put it in my Windows XP comp plug the SCSI Zip Drive into that then use BasiliskII to connect to the SCSI Zip Drive and format it in the emulator with the 4.2 drivers, do you think that would work?

The SCSI card I have is the Adaptec Ultra2 SCSI LVE/SE PCI Card AHA-2940U2B its the Mac Version but it should still work in the PC

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTech68 View Post
Sorry about that - my bad, I should have thought of that.

Just a quick check;

Make sure the FWB extensions are disabled and the Zip extensions are enabled.

Otherwise, if havokalien is unable to help, I might be able to get something cranked up here to get you the FWB block image.
I tried doing that (disable FWB extensions and enable Zip extensions) but at startup it has a red X through the IOMEGA extension icon.
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Old Feb 27, 2013, 04:01 PM   #7
MacTech68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benproiii View Post
Another way I was thinking might work to startup the Mac SE is to get a Adaptec SCSI PCI Card put it in my Windows XP comp plug the SCSI Zip Drive into that then use BasiliskII to connect to the SCSI Zip Drive and format it in the emulator with the 4.2 drivers, do you think that would work?

The SCSI card I have is the Adaptec Ultra2 SCSI LVE/SE PCI Card AHA-2940U2B its the Mac Version but it should still work in the PC.
What G3 PowerMac do you have? G3 Blue & White or a Beige G3 Desktop/MiniTower?

The Mac version 2940 should work on a PCI PowerMac. Also, what system version is the G3 running?

I'm a little confused as to why you don't use the card in the G3 PowerMac with the SCSI drive and format the disk that way.
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Old Feb 27, 2013, 09:00 PM   #8
benproiii
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTech68 View Post
What G3 PowerMac do you have? G3 Blue & White or a Beige G3 Desktop/MiniTower?

The Mac version 2940 should work on a PCI PowerMac. Also, what system version is the G3 running?

I'm a little confused as to why you don't use the card in the G3 PowerMac with the SCSI drive and format the disk that way.

I don't actually have a Powermac g3 I just got the scsi pci card from it I have a Imac g3 but they don't have a pci slot
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Old Jun 28, 2014, 02:26 PM   #9
rgfrfe
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Reading and Writing to Zip Disk in OS 10.8.5 to OS 8.6

Yes, you heard correctly...to 8.6! Long story short, I had a client that needed to use Zip disks (100mb), on OS 10.8.5 as well as 8.6 (Beige G3). Disks formatted in "Standard" format, cannot be written to in 10.8.5 (just read). Disks formatted "Extended" format with Disk Utility on 10.8.5, could not be read on OS 8.6 (wanted to initialize it). After an hour or so, figured out we needed to format the zip disks in 10.4.11 (on a G4 with Disk Utility), extended format, then we could read and write on the other OS's. Just FYI for those who would ever need to go through that process. Thanks.
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Old Jun 29, 2014, 01:39 AM   #10
tdiaz
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HFS+ from 10.8 vs. 10.4 shouldn't make a difference, unless the type of partitioning is incorrectly specified for the target. The default setting may have changed along the course of releases.
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