iPhone 5S to Include Sapphire-Covered Convex Home Button with Fingerprint Sensor?

duffman9000 said:

You think that iOS doesn't have a filesystem? Oh boy...



Oh no it doesn't. Search for complaints here about iOS 6 on iPhone 4 or better yet iOS 4 on iPhone 3G.



I'm not asking for a completely bug free OS, but at least Google could fix some of the obvious bugs. Chrome on Android has been a turd for a long time. Given the option of including a better browser (Browser) Google instead chooses to include Chrome!

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It has a filesystem if you jailbreak. Not by default.

iOS 4 on 3g was a disaster (I updated right before buying the 4, the fact that it was horrible certainly helped), but iOS 6 is not anywhere on the same level on the 4.

And Chrome has become a bloated, slow turd on desktops. I've moved back to safari lol. So what kind of 'fix' are you expecting on portable systems?

What's funny is that chrome is amazing on ipad mini. Real working tabs, and if you buy a certain app (Nitrous) on Cydia it becomes as fast as Safari.

If you really hate Chrome on Android I would simply forget about it and install Dolphin HD or Opera. MAYBE Google will make 'Chrome Project Butter' once they realize that Chrome is slow and uses too much ram, around release version 100 (Which at their current release rate, should be in about 6 days).

Zellio said:

It has a filesystem if you jailbreak. Not by default.

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You're wrong. iOS has a file system. iOS doesn't include a file system browser. Do you even know the difference?

Zellio said:

iOS 4 on 3g was a disaster (I updated right before buying the 4, the fact that it was horrible certainly helped), but iOS 6 is not anywhere on the same level on the 4.

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You said iOS would run fast on any hardware. No, it doesn't run fast on any hardware. You just said so yourself.

Zellio said:

And Chrome has become a bloated, slow turd on desktops. I've moved back to safari lol. So what kind of 'fix' are you expecting on portable systems?

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Compare the Android Browser to Chrome. End of discussion.

Zellio said:

What's funny is that chrome is amazing on ipad mini. Real working tabs, and if you buy a certain app (Nitrous) on Cydia it becomes as fast as Safari.

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That's another rub. Chrome is better on iOS even if it doesn't use Nitro.

duffman9000 said:

You're wrong. iOS has a file system. iOS doesn't include a file system browser. Do you even know the difference?

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Yes. Do you know what the definition of irony is? Because calling something a browser is not the same as a file system, unless all you want to do is look at your files. A true file system allows modification.

duffman9000 said:

You said iOS would run fast on any hardware. No, it doesn't run fast on any hardware. You just said so yourself.

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Well, technically DSL doesn't run on 386 devices. That doesn't change the fact that it can run on slow devices. Try running Jellybean on low powered machines with 512 mb ram. You are arguing semantics.

duffman9000 said:

Compare the Android Browser to Chrome. End of discussion.

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I still use stock android browser. As I said, There's also Opera and Dolphin.

duffman9000 said:

That's another rub. Chrome is better on iOS even if it doesn't use Nitro.

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I would disagree. I like Chrome's advancements compared to iOS safari, but if I couldn't use Nitro...

Zellio said:

Yes. Do you know what the definition of irony is? Because calling something a browser is not the same as a file system, unless all you want to do is look at your files. A true file system allows modification.

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Irony is you don't understand the difference between a file system and file system browser. Does the Xbox 360 have a file system? Yes it does. Does it provide a file browser? No. Does it still have a file system? Yes.

Zellio said:

Well, technically DSL doesn't run on 386 devices. That doesn't change the fact that it can run on slow devices. Try running Jellybean on low powered machines with 512 mb ram. You are arguing semantics.

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You said that iOS would run fast on any hardware. But now you say it can run slow on underpowered devices? Contradicting yourself again?

Zellio said:

I still use stock android browser.

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No kidding. Except Google went out of their way to not allow this to happen without a 3rd party app on recent Nexus devices.


Chrome has been a turd since it was released on Android which is about a year IIRC.

Zellio said:

I would disagree.

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You're entitled to your opinion as am I.

duffman9000 said:

Irony is you don't understand the difference between a file system and file system browser. Does the Xbox 360 have a file system? Yes it does. Does it provide a file browser? No. Does it still have a file system? Yes.

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You keep calling it a 'browser'. Do you know what browsing means?

If Macrumours made their files that they use to design their webpage viewable to you, that would be a good example of a file system broswer, since you don't have an admin account and can't modify them.

If Apple made a file system 'browser', it would be as useless as this back and forth argument you and I are making entirely on semantics.

duffman9000 said:

You said that iOS would run fast on any hardware. But now you say it can run slow on underpowered devices? Contradicting yourself again?

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So when I was saying that it ran good on any hardware, you thought I meant that it can run on Commodore 64's and TI calculators instead of referring to contemporary stuff?

Zellio said:

You keep calling it a 'browser'. Do you know what browsing means?

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You have no idea what a file system is. Since you stated that "iOS has a filesystem if you jailbreak. Not by default.", this surely must also apply to stock Android? What about the Nexus 7 (2013) that I'm holding right now?

I haven't installed File Manager yet and I can't find a stock app that provides the same or similar functionality. Maybe I can't find it. Maybe it doesn't exist. If a stock app doesn't exist then this Nexus 7 doesn't have a file system by default either?

Zellio said:

So when I was saying that it ran good on any hardware, you thought I meant that it can run on Commodore 64's and TI calculators instead of referring to contemporary stuff?

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You said it ran fast on any hardware. Running good and running fast isn't the same thing. I even gave you an example where iOS ran downright slow.

duffman9000 said:

You have no idea what a file system is. Since you stated that "iOS has a filesystem if you jailbreak. Not by default.", this surely must also apply to stock Android? What about the Nexus 7 (2013) that I'm holding right now?

I haven't installed File Manager yet and I can't find a stock app that provides the same or similar functionality. Maybe I can't find it. Maybe it doesn't exist. If a stock app doesn't exist then this Nexus 7 doesn't have a file system by default either?

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There is a default file manager app on Android. I forget the name (Should be Files or something like that), but look in your apps.

And I'm guessing you are being facetious in this reply? I was being facetious too, as everything, from DOS to even car computers has a file system. Doesn't mean it's usable, which is usually where people count if a program has a file system.

duffman9000 said:

You said it ran fast on any hardware. Running good and running fast isn't the same thing. I even gave you an example where iOS ran downright slow.

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Everything runs slow on certain hardware though. You are just nitpicking, as iOS runs a lot better on slower hardware then Android has ever done.

In fact, since you mentioned it, and keep nitpicking, part of the reason why ios4 ran so slow is a lack of ram. One of the things that can speed up ram is removing daemons and language packs from ios. I more then guarantee with the knowledge I have today I could make ios4 run at least decently on a 3g. Can't say the same on Android. Even if I removed certain things Android would never be as smooth and fast as ios.

Zellio said:

There is a default file manager app on Android. I forget the name (Should be Files or something like that), but look in your apps..

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Not on my Nexus 7 (2013) and I haven't tried to uninstall any of the stock apps. That must mean that it doesn't have a file system, right?

Zellio said:

And I'm guessing you are being facetious in this reply? I was being facetious too, as everything, from DOS to even car computers has a file system. Doesn't mean it's usable, which is usually where people count if a program has a file system.

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I wasn't being facetious. Maybe you didn't know what you're talking about?

Zellio said:

Everything runs slow on certain hardware though. You are just nitpicking, as iOS runs a lot better on slower hardware then Android has ever done.

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I'm not nitpicking. You said iOS runs fast on any hardware. I said it doesn't.

Zellio said:

In fact, since you mentioned it, and keep nitpicking, part of the reason why ios4 ran so slow is a lack of ram. One of the things that can speed up ram is removing daemons and language packs from ios.

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I'm not nitpicking. You said iOS runs fast on any hardware. I said it doesn't. I don't know why you mentioned DSL running on 16MB of RAM.

Zellio said:

I more then guarantee with the knowledge I have today I could make ios4 run at least decently on a 3g. Can't say the same on Android. Even if I removed certain things Android would never be as smooth and fast as ios.

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Oh really? The lack of RAM wasn't the sole issue. You could do what Apple chose not do for iOS 4 on the iPhone 3G: optimize the OS for the iPhone 3G's SoC?

Jesus Christ.

Went to this thread to read comments about the actual topic but instead walk into this **** show.

Michael Scrip said:

What if something goes wrong and you use your fingerprints to log in? Change your fingers?

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This would be my concern as well, but Apple is very thorough when it comes to releasing their products and features, so I would say it will be good to go. Even if there was an issue, I would assume there would be a backup password to work around that type of issue, similar to making an emergency call.

sik08amg said:

This would be my concern as well, but Apple is very thorough when it comes to releasing their products and features, so I would say it will be good to go. Even if there was an issue, I would assume there would be a backup password to work around that type of issue, similar to making an emergency call.

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Yep.

It's common for devices with fingerprint sensors to allow either a finger or a password / PIN to unlock the device.

The fingerprint method is simply a convenience (when it works!).

maxosx said:

Of course it does. That's why Apple is adding the fingerprint scanner. They will then have absolute proof of who is using the phone. That data is extremely valuable. As a "silent" revenue stream, Apple will really double down on profit.

It's every FBI agents wet dream to plant on bug on your person. With the magical & revolutionary Apple iPhone 5S, they should pay people to voluntarily carry one. It's quite funny to read all the comments from those that are so naive they are actually excited to be fingerprinted. Wonders never cease.

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Finally somebody with a clear mind. Thanks and good to know such people still exist beside the mob of brainwashed blind sheeps.
" Oh I am so excited, about this new ..." Says the lazy pig and gets fatter for slaughter.

If you think you can switch it off:
How you know its really off, like the camera lens in front of your face ...
How you know that it can't be switched on without your notice?

Its impossible says apple ....... Yes right.... Now we feel better....

Wake up guys! This is not the so called wet dream.
They cum already! ( and are funny laughing about the pigs paying premium for their own imprisonment and observation.)

Iwill never buy an apple product again, under such circumstances.
That seems to be the only thing one can do, to hold up freedom for our children.
As if the money wont roll in, they listen up and hopefully change.
One can hope, but as I read along .... I know ..... You are so excited....

From a newMacRumors post.....

MacRumors said:

Gurman also says that the iPhone 5S home button will not take on a convex shape and that it will in fact be nearly indistinguishable from the current design.

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So that hopefully puts an end to the convex button rumour.

manu chao said:

How would anybody come up with the idea that one will not be able to turn it off? Look through the settings app on your iPhone, you can turn off pretty much everything.

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I was just messing around. I know most everything can be turned off, EXCEPT government alerts. Which means we are never truly out of reach.

AppleVsAndroid said:

Then stick with iPhone 5.

If government wants they can even track your smelly hole down there 24 x 365 if they want so shut up

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Your hole may be smelly and probably is. However, I practice exemplary anal hygiene.

Zellio said:

Well I'll respond to your link with this:

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-57596084-94/htc-one-sales-outpace-last-years-flagship-devices/

The sales fell off later on, but the sales of the One definitely fixed things from the year before. Not only that, but it was easily the best phone of the year.

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All that report says is that the HTC One is selling better than any HTC phone from last year.

But HTC isn't even a top 5 vendor anymore... and they haven't been in a while.

I'm curious why you're mentioning HTC in a discussion about sales performance.

Earlier you said "Apple is falling behind"

Funny... Apple is outselling HTC by 4:1

Michael Scrip said:

All that report says is that the HTC One is selling better than any HTC phone from last year.

But HTC isn't even a top 5 vendor anymore... and they haven't been in a while.

I'm curious why you're mentioning HTC in a discussion about sales performance.

Earlier you said "Apple is falling behind"

Funny... Apple is outselling HTC by 4:1

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Have you actually used the HTC One? It not only reversed HTC's fortunes but it's also currently the phone of the year. Anybody who has used it can you (Such as me, it's my phone).

I never cared about HTC before the One.

So sales to you are the only factor that shows if a company is falling behind? Then expect to be completely caught off guard when sales drop, the same that happened to companies like RIM or Sony with the PS3.

xumax said:

Finally somebody with a clear mind. Thanks and good to know such people still exist beside the mob of brainwashed blind sheeps.
" Oh I am so excited, about this new ..." Says the lazy pig and gets fatter for slaughter.

If you think you can switch it off:
How you know its really off, like the camera lens in front of your face ...
How you know that it can't be switched on without your notice?

Its impossible says apple ....... Yes right.... Now we feel better....

Wake up guys! This is not the so called wet dream.
They cum already! ( and are funny laughing about the pigs paying premium for their own imprisonment and observation.)

Iwill never buy an apple product again, under such circumstances.
That seems to be the only thing one can do, to hold up freedom for our children.
As if the money wont roll in, they listen up and hopefully change.
One can hope, but as I read along .... I know ..... You are so excited....

Click to expand...

Wtf really man calm down

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Zellio said:

Have you actually used the HTC One? It not only reversed HTC's fortunes but it's also currently the phone of the year. Anybody who has used it can you (Such as me, it's my phone).

I never cared about HTC before the One.

So sales to you are the only factor that shows if a company is falling behind? Then expect to be completely caught off guard when sales drop, the same that happened to companies like RIM or Sony with the PS3.

Click to expand...

Idk if they release 2 iPhones, with the china mobile deal too, I don't think you'll see sales drop this time. Maybe the iPhone 5s alone, but as the iPhone in whole prolly not.

xumax said:

Finally somebody with a clear mind. Thanks and good to know such people still exist beside the mob of brainwashed blind sheeps.
" Oh I am so excited, about this new ..." Says the lazy pig and gets fatter for slaughter.

If you think you can switch it off:
How you know its really off, like the camera lens in front of your face ...
How you know that it can't be switched on without your notice?

Its impossible says apple ....... Yes right.... Now we feel better....

Wake up guys! This is not the so called wet dream.
They cum already! ( and are funny laughing about the pigs paying premium for their own imprisonment and observation.)

Iwill never buy an apple product again, under such circumstances.
That seems to be the only thing one can do, to hold up freedom for our children.
As if the money wont roll in, they listen up and hopefully change.
One can hope, but as I read along .... I know ..... You are so excited....

Click to expand...

These thoughts never gets past the point of why Big Ol Brother would be concerned with little ol me in the vast millions. It's possible one of us is very special and needs secrecy. I wish him well

I hope it doesn't come with a fingerprint sensor. That is so 'last decade'. I had a fingerprint sensor on an older notebook, and it was a waste of time. I entered multiple fingers, just in case, and still had moments when I had to enter the 'secret pass phrase' like I was trying to get into Calvin's G.R.O.S.S. club... Does any other phone have a finger print sensor? It's a waste and downright silly!

Roller said:

One month to go... surprised we haven't seen any leaked shots of the front of the 5S.

Click to expand...

maybe it doesn't have a front?

PinkyMacGodess said:

I hope it doesn't come with a fingerprint sensor. That is so 'last decade'. I had a fingerprint sensor on an older notebook, and it was a waste of time. I entered multiple fingers, just in case, and still had moments when I had to enter the 'secret pass phrase' like I was trying to get into Calvin's G.R.O.S.S. club... Does any other phone have a finger print sensor? It's a waste and downright silly!

Click to expand...

No other consumer device has ever had the type of sensor in the IP5S. Apple acquired the company right after they introduced the new sensor technology, but before it shipped. It is not an optical scanner. It uses radio waves to scan beneath your skin. According to th manufacturer (Authentec), it can image your print through a layer of plastic. The sensor can also be used as a touchpad-like navigation device for gestures, according to the manufacturer.

Unlike other, older technologies which require second or longer to scan and march your print, the new sensor technology can scan and match your print in 0.5sec or less.

MacMan988 said:

maybe it doesn't have a front?

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Yeah, it's so fast, and so capable that it literally is too fast to see the front...

Oh bother...

KenAFSPC said:

No other consumer device has ever had the type of sensor in the IP5S. Apple acquired the company right after they introduced the new sensor technology, but before it shipped. It is not an optical scanner. It uses radio waves to scan beneath your skin. ...

Click to expand...

RF fingerprint scanners date back to before this century. (I love saying that.)

AuthenTec apparently has invented (or acquired) something new, but RF scanning alone isn't it.

More interestingly, the proxy document that everyone quotes from (see below), indicates that their invention might be outside of their normal product range.

So it might not be a fingerprint reader at all. Perhaps it's some kind of gesture sensor instead. We'll know soon enough.

Our board and senior management regularly review and assess our long-term strategy and objectives in light of developments in the markets in which we operate, including strategic alternatives available to the Company to enhance stockholder value. As part of this process, our board and management regularly consider opportunities that could complement, enhance or expand our current business or products or that might otherwise offer growth opportunities for the Company. As a result, we acquired several companies and businesses during the past few years. In addition, multiple parties approached the Company regarding possible strategic transactions over the last two years and the Company engaged in preliminary conversations with these parties from time to time. Other than the discussions described below, such approaches never developed past preliminary conversations and preliminary exchanges of confidential information about the Company.

Late in 2011 and early in 2012, the Company discussed new technology with several leading consumer electronics companies to gauge potential market interest for such a product. For a number of reasons, including cost, Apple was the only potential customer that expressed substantive interest in pursuing further development of and a commercial agreement with respect to this technology.

- merger document

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In the other thread about the new supposed leaked pics showing a ring around the home button, I tried to explain the evidence supporting the existence of a fingerprint sensor on the iphone 5S. Upon further research, I am fairly certain I was wrong about the specifics.

The 5S fingerprint sensor will be based on the AuthenTec radio frequency (RF) imaging technology, which Apple acquired last year in the purchase of AuthenTec. This technology likely achieved a significant improvement since it was last released commercially by authentec (improved performance, longer life, etc). The sensor will be integrated into the 5S's home button.


As you can see in this detailed part leak photo, the sensor is in the center of the metal disc, which would lie directly under the button. The fingerprint processor is the adjacent square directly down the ribbon cable.

The sapphire composition of the home button makes sense because it would be important to keep the integrity of the finger/sensor interface maintained and free of wear. The metal ring surrounding the home button is also key to this technology. Electrical contact with the users finger is needed for this RF imaging method to work. Interestingly, this metal ring could be constructed out of Apple's acquired LiquidMetal technology, which is reported to be transparent to RF. So this ring will NOT be an indicator light or anything.

I still find it odd that the button had to be made convex in shape. A typical finger would be flush with the regular concave shaped button. Maybe it was necessary to fit the sensor correctly and have the exact tolerances of dielectric thickness.