Refurbs usually don't get discounted further even on Black Friday. I reckon if there's a price drop, it'll probably be around the time when the iPad Air hits the refurbs section. While it may be a generation behind, it's still a very capable device and you get a full 1-year warranty unlike if you go used.right now I can get a refurb ipad 4 32gb from apple for $449. think that is good or do they usually go down with the holidays?