Go Back   MacRumors Forums > News and Article Discussion > MacRumors.com News Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old Mar 27, 2014, 09:39 AM   #26
leventozler
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by everything-i View Post
The oleophobic layer is nano-coating on the glass so if it gets scratched off you don't even see it. On current devices it eventually wares off and you don't notice that because its so thin, you just get fingerprints being more noticeable as the device ages.
Remember this? http://www.macrumors.com/2009/07/06/...g-wearing-off/


leventozler is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 09:40 AM   #27
rikardors
macrumors member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Concepcion, Chile
Bring it on! Apple. Be the first.
__________________
iPad Mini 16 GB,iPhone 4, 8 GB, iPhone 4S, 16 GB, MacBook Air, mid 2013, 256 GB
rikardors is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 09:49 AM   #28
cmChimera
macrumors 68000
 
cmChimera's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisCW11 View Post
Because Oleophobic coatings on glass is a completely different idea?

I have used phones before with oleophobic claims and the bottom line is they do not prevent fingerprints on screens. The reality is that fingerprints are only an issue when the screen is off because it makes the glass look dirty, but when the screen is on, and unless you have been inhaling Cheetos for a few hours while using your tablet or phone, you are never going to notice fingerprints.

If Apple is patenting how to apply this coating on sapphire then they have a claim, but to claim the "novel" idea of simply using this coating on another type of display surface I do not think will be granted.

Oleophobic is just a marketing gimmick that tries to make people believe that a device with it is better then a device without it, just like sapphire. Apple is the king of patenting marketing myths.
I don't think novel means what you think it means.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by leventozler View Post
No?
cmChimera is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 09:52 AM   #29
Serban
macrumors 68030
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
i think the sapphire dont need an oleophobic coating because on my Nokia 8800 Arte i never had any problems with the fingerprint even wasnt a touchscreen i did touch it a lot to make a difference between iphone 4 and Arte
Serban is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 10:00 AM   #30
needfx
macrumors 68020
 
needfx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: macrumors apparently
I thought oleophobia was a hair thing
needfx is online now   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 10:02 AM   #31
brendu
macrumors 68000
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: USA
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisCW11 View Post
Oleophobic is just a marketing gimmick that tries to make people believe that a device with it is better then a device without it, just like sapphire. Apple is the king of patenting marketing myths.
Use a phone without it and you will realize it's not a gimmick. It's used by almost every phone manufacturer because it serves a very useful purpose.

Sapphire is also going to have benefits over glass. It will be much more scratch resistant. These aren't gimmicks. They are useful applications that you almost never even notice but they make the device better. That is kind of the opposite of a gimmick.
brendu is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 10:06 AM   #32
brianvictor7
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Midwest, US
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbSoluTc View Post
I have had every iPhone since the 3G. Never had a glass scratch/coating issue and I don't use cases or screen protectors. If you're screen is scratching, it's the glass, not the coating as someone has said above me, it's a nano coating. You will never see it come off or scratch.
I have only ever had very minor scratches on my iPhones (owned 2). Scratches are not likely so long as you use a case with a bit of lip to lift the screen from any flat surface you lay it face down on. Also, never put it in the same pocket any metal object (like your keys!). Mine stays flush against my thigh in the same pocket as my leather wallet.
__________________
Macbook Pro Retina 13" (2013) iPhone 5S iMac 21.5" (2009)
brianvictor7 is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 10:11 AM   #33
ItWasNotMe
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Enough "May"s in the quote to last the better part of a decade

I'm so last century I thought patents were meant to be accurate descriptions.
__________________
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled."
Richard P. Feynman
ItWasNotMe is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 10:12 AM   #34
Jimmy James
macrumors 68000
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fresh Pie View Post
Ah, so they make the first incision at 110 and then pour the oleophobia inside… I see…

Image
You win this thread. I just about spat out my coffee on my computer.
Jimmy James is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 10:45 AM   #35
agsystems
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisCW11 View Post
Because Oleophobic coatings on glass is a completely different idea?

If Apple is patenting how to apply this coating on sapphire then they have a claim, but to claim the "novel" idea of simply using this coating on another type of display surface I do not think will be granted.
Correct- that's what the patent claims - and apparently this is a first in the industry

"This patent allows for the oleophobic coating to be applied to a brick of sapphire and not having to apply it to each cut screen individually i.e. the patent allows for batch processing."

http://margolismatt.com/2014/03/27/o...pphire-patent/

Last edited by agsystems; Mar 27, 2014 at 11:12 AM.
agsystems is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 10:56 AM   #36
aperry
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
I always suspected the "micro scratches" that I got on my iPhones was due to the coating. These scratches were very fine, almost invisible, until you look at the phone under sunlight or a clean halogen/LED light. Then they would become quite visible (and annoying). It's a bummer that they'll put this coating on a material that's even more scratch resistant.
aperry is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 11:11 AM   #37
Lepton
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Long Island, NY
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZidaneZidane View Post
As already stated, this is Dumb. Every iphone I have ever had got scratches on the coating. What a waste that would be of sapphire
This sapphire crystal wristwatch I've been wearing continuously for the past thirty years hasn't got a single scratch on it.

I'm predicting an iWatch with sapphire on the front and liquidmetal on the back.
__________________
Mac OS, iOS, what else is there?
My stuff is at myallo.com
Lepton is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 11:19 AM   #38
britboyj
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Because the oleophobic coating on my 3GS lasted so long.

Yawn.
__________________
"No raindrop believes it is responsible for the flood."
 iMac 27" 2.8 Ghz Core i5 Quad-Core 12GB RAM  MacBook Pro 15" Retina 2.0Ghz i7 8GB RAM  16GB Wifi iPad 2  16GB Black Verizon iPhone "5"
britboyj is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 11:21 AM   #39
DonutHands
macrumors member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
regardless of the oil resistant coating on the very top. the patent is calling for a sapphire substrate with a glass surface layer on top of it. whats the deal with that ???
DonutHands is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 12:00 PM   #40
mdelvecchio
macrumors 68020
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTorro View Post
Anyone is familiar with this type of coating? I am all for the scratch resistant Sapphire, but if it is coated with something that can be scratched off, it might defeat the purpose. I'd rather have fingerprints than scratches.
im certain theyve thought about that and more. these guys didnt just fall off the turnip truck.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZidaneZidane View Post
As already stated, this is Dumb. Every iphone I have ever had got scratches on the coating. What a waste that would be of sapphire
gosh, you guys had better let Cook and his executive team of ultra successful hardware engineers know, pronto!! they could be making a huge mistake!

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisCW11 View Post
Oleophobic is just a marketing gimmick that tries to make people believe that a device with it is better then a device without it, just like sapphire. Apple is the king of patenting marketing myths.
nope. it serves a function, which is why they bother with it.

please link us to some other patented marketing myths, dying to hear about them.
mdelvecchio is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 12:02 PM   #41
kdarling
macrumors G4
 
kdarling's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Device engineer 30+ yrs, touchscreens 23+.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lepton View Post
This sapphire crystal wristwatch I've been wearing continuously for the past thirty years hasn't got a single scratch on it.
Yeah, with a screen that can last decades, it's almost a pity that most people only use a phone for a year or two.

"Grandpa, I found this old thing in the attic. Is this what smartphones used to look like before they became flexible screens tattooed on your arm?"

"Yep, that's right, kid. But hey, isn't the display amazingly scratch free for its age?!"
kdarling is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 12:04 PM   #42
mdelvecchio
macrumors 68020
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by aperry View Post
I always suspected the "micro scratches" that I got on my iPhones was due to the coating. These scratches were very fine, almost invisible, until you look at the phone under sunlight or a clean halogen/LED light. Then they would become quite visible (and annoying).
why is it annoying, if you can only detect them when putting the powered-off display into a non-natural lighting environment designed to light them?

Quote:
It's a bummer that they'll put this coating on a material that's even more scratch resistant.
the coating isnt what causes scratches. you have a misunderstanding about how the layers work and what they do.
mdelvecchio is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 12:38 PM   #43
AbSoluTc
macrumors 68020
 
AbSoluTc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by leventozler View Post
Yes and it was complete BS too. It was the ONLY phone that did that. Good try though.
__________________
Twitter - Flickr
AbSoluTc is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 01:15 PM   #44
aperry
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdelvecchio View Post
why is it annoying, if you can only detect them when putting the powered-off display into a non-natural lighting environment designed to light them?
I'm not sure why that would be annoying, however it has little to do with what I said. Funny how you quoted me and apparently didn't read what I wrote. Nowhere did I mention "powered-off" or "non-natural". Try again.



Quote:
Originally Posted by mdelvecchio View Post
the coating isnt what causes scratches. you have a misunderstanding about how the layers work and what they do.
Uh, right. So let me see if I understand correctly. The coating can be worn away in specific areas of the screen (as evidenced by many photos, including those posted earlier in this thread), but it can't be scratched? Please go ahead and enlighten us as to how this is a misunderstanding of "how the layers work and what they do".
aperry is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 01:32 PM   #45
ApfelKuchen
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Between the coasts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZidaneZidane View Post
As already stated, this is Dumb. Every iphone I have ever had got scratches on the coating. What a waste that would be of sapphire
Scratches are only the tip of the sapphire iceberg. Micro-scratches and the occasional deep scratch may be annoying to some and infuriating to a few, but a shattered screen is a heartbreaker for all affected.

As a selling point? "Fewer scratches" isn't going to sell a whole lot more iPhones - most people don't notice the micro-scratches, as all micro-scratches do in practice is reduce contrast. Up the screen brightness, and that issue is overcome (while increased brightness doesn't change contrast, the net effect is similar - easier visibility).

The key selling point is shatter-resistance. That may affect a smaller number of users than scratching, but it's a result all purchasers fear.

Meantime, the overall thickness of the transition layer places a near-maximum on the depth of scratches, and as it varies in hardness between silica glass at the very surface and nearly pure sapphire at the base, it will be more scratch-resistant than silica glass just a short distance below the surface. The deeper the scratch, the more visible it is, so this should still improve the optical performance of the screen.

The fact that a transition layer is necessary says a lot for the intrinsic qualities of sapphire - if it can't be coated directly, it's pretty slick stuff.
ApfelKuchen is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 01:57 PM   #46
Harmonious Zen
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: May 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisCW11 View Post
Because Oleophobic coatings on glass is a completely different idea?

I have used phones before with oleophobic claims and the bottom line is they do not prevent fingerprints on screens. The reality is that fingerprints are only an issue when the screen is off because it makes the glass look dirty, but when the screen is on, and unless you have been inhaling Cheetos for a few hours while using your tablet or phone, you are never going to notice fingerprints.

If Apple is patenting how to apply this coating on sapphire then they have a claim, but to claim the "novel" idea of simply using this coating on another type of display surface I do not think will be granted.

Oleophobic is just a marketing gimmick that tries to make people believe that a device with it is better then a device without it, just like sapphire. Apple is the king of patenting marketing myths.
Marketing gimmick? Have you tried a screen without an oleophobic coating? It's far worse at handling fingerprints. At least with current day iPhones and iPads, the most you get are smudges that wipe off extremely easily.

They barely even mention this feature so I don't see how it's any sort of a gimmick. No need to go through the expense of adding an extra layer of coating just for marketing purposes.
Harmonious Zen is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 02:08 PM   #47
ZidaneZidane
macrumors newbie
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbSoluTc View Post
I have had every iPhone since the 3G. Never had a glass scratch/coating issue and I don't use cases or screen protectors. If you're screen is scratching, it's the glass, not the coating as someone has said above me, it's a nano coating. You will never see it come off or scratch.
Both my 4s and 5 ended up getting little scratches, mainly from my keys. They are not visible when the screen is turned on but when it's turned off they are clearly there. That wouldn't bother some folks but it does me. The scratches I always assumed where to the coating since they are not too deep.

----------

shatter-resistance would be nice, but I've heard with sapphire when it gets large enough for a screen that benefit goes away? Not sure of that's true but that's what Corning claimed. "Micro scratches" are still scratches. If I didn't care about those I wouldn't care about having a device like the iphone. Defeats the whole point of having a beautiful device when it's got a bunch of micro scratches. Give me smudges I can wipe away over permanent "micro" scratches any day.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by aperry View Post
I always suspected the "micro scratches" that I got on my iPhones was due to the coating. These scratches were very fine, almost invisible, until you look at the phone under sunlight or a clean halogen/LED light. Then they would become quite visible (and annoying). It's a bummer that they'll put this coating on a material that's even more scratch resistant.
Exactly
ZidaneZidane is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 04:17 PM   #48
Mattsasa
macrumors 68000
 
Mattsasa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Minnesota
Send a message via AIM to Mattsasa
Will next-gen iPads have sapphire displays ?
Mattsasa is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 27, 2014, 08:56 PM   #49
fastasleep
macrumors newbie
 
Join Date: May 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by satchmo View Post
I don't know about anyone else, but I still have lots of fingerprints on my iOS devices. I'd hate to see what the screens look like without this oleophobic coating.
I got a crappy aftermarket replacement glass put on my iPad 2 by a repair shop that clearly didn't have the coating. Trust me, it's noticeable. Then the glass cracked right away and they replaced it with the "proper" part, and it's back to normal or at least much closer to OEM if it isn't.
fastasleep is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Mar 28, 2014, 06:28 AM   #50
Mactendo
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serban View Post
yees plz, with sapphire they can make bezel free on sides
How's that?
Mactendo is offline   0 Reply With Quote

Reply
MacRumors Forums > News and Article Discussion > MacRumors.com News Discussion

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Similar Threads
thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Apple Experimented with Sapphire Crystal Displays, Found Them Infeasible MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 55 Jun 28, 2014 10:15 AM
Apple Patent Awarded for Liquid Metal / Sapphire Display Apparatus jrswizzle iPhone 12 May 29, 2014 12:41 PM
Apple Describes Disposable Email Solution to Combat Spam in New Patent Application MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 134 Feb 18, 2014 06:39 PM
Apple Preparing for Massive Production of Devices with Sapphire Displays MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 108 Feb 7, 2014 03:32 PM
Apple Details Uses for Sapphire Glass in New Patent Application MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 29 Feb 2, 2014 09:32 AM

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:22 AM.

Mac Rumors | Mac | iPhone | iPhone Game Reviews | iPhone Apps

Mobile Version | Fixed | Fluid | Fluid HD
Copyright 2002-2013, MacRumors.com, LLC