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chrfr

macrumors G5
Jul 11, 2009
13,520
7,047
---
Missing a lot 10.9.x comes with OpenGL 4.1 good but my intel hd3000 has support for only OpenGL 3.3 ! am i clear now !
Hope for next OS X ?
You weren't clear. Intel does not support OpenGL 4 on the HD3000, not even in Windows. As with 4k, this isn't Apple setting a limitation on this hardware.
 

Irishman

macrumors 68040
Nov 2, 2006
3,398
844
What is missing from OpenGL? it is fully supported up to 4.1. As for performance improvements - I think they're pretty much already squeezing as much performance out of the GPU as they can bearing in mind it is from 2 generations ago.

Fully supported? I think some of our developer friends on MR have a wish-list for 4.1 features that they don't yet have. And, remember, 4.1 isn't parity with OpenGL on Windows. 4.3 is the latest version available.
 

MARKBOARD

macrumors newbie
Mar 21, 2014
29
2
No. The HD3000 is too old now!

You asked the same question in the 13D33 thread. The HD 3000 does not support 4K and I very much doubt they will release updated drivers for it now.

Ok stop here i don't need your answer ! next time just skip my comments because i will always check my HD3000 love it or leave it !
 
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WallToWallMacs

macrumors regular
Jan 26, 2014
166
0
Fully supported? I think some of our developer friends on MR have a wish-list for 4.1 features that they don't yet have. And, remember, 4.1 isn't parity with OpenGL on Windows. 4.3 is the latest version available.

The latest OpenGL is 4.4 which was released July 2013.

I just had a check on this chart and it appears that OpenGL 3.3 is the highest supported by HD 3000 and according to this the highest supported on Windows and Linux is OpenGL 3.1. With that being said, I'm unsure in the case of HD 3000 on OS X whether the reported OpenGL 3.3 on the chart points to hardware capabilities but OpenGL 4.1 functionality is emulated in software mode.
 

MARKBOARD

macrumors newbie
Mar 21, 2014
29
2
You weren't clear. Intel does not support OpenGL 4 on the HD3000, not even in Windows. As with 4k, this isn't Apple setting a limitation on this hardware.

1) There is no need to be abusive and rude.
2) What are you basing the OpenGL version based on? Have you run 'OpenGL Extensions Viewer' and choosing 'Core' what version does it say that it supports? I had a 2011 MacBook Pro and as far as I recall it definitely supported OpenGL 4.1.
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I don't need nor wait for your answers! I'm checking and remarking what's new in graphics FOR MY HD3000 in OS X latest builds. you can't judge a hardware being old if you don't have an Apple's argumentation in that issue!
 

Irishman

macrumors 68040
Nov 2, 2006
3,398
844
The latest OpenGL is 4.4 which was released July 2013.

I just had a check on this chart and it appears that OpenGL 3.3 is the highest supported by HD 3000 and according to this the highest supported on Windows and Linux is OpenGL 3.1. With that being said, I'm unsure in the case of HD 3000 on OS X whether the reported OpenGL 3.3 on the chart points to hardware capabilities but OpenGL 4.1 functionality is emulated in software mode.

Thanks for the correction. Apple knows they have work to do to achieve true graphics parity with Windows.
 

Michael Goff

Suspended
Jul 5, 2012
13,329
7,421
Thanks for the correction. Apple knows they have work to do to achieve true graphics parity with Windows.

But do they care?

And is OpenGL at complete parity with DirectX anyway? I know feature wise, probably, but what about performance?
 

Irishman

macrumors 68040
Nov 2, 2006
3,398
844

Irishman

macrumors 68040
Nov 2, 2006
3,398
844
I suppose the question now is why OpenGL isn't used more in games.

Microsoft, by virtue of their default install base, has had a near monopoly in DirectX. That is being questioned now as top-tier game developers are reaching out to other OSs for opportunities that they didn't before.

Steam/Valve with their Linux-driven Steamboxes, have no choice to go OpenGL.

Attention is being given OpenGL that wasn't just 2 years ago.
 

Michael Goff

Suspended
Jul 5, 2012
13,329
7,421
Microsoft, by virtue of their default install base, has had a near monopoly in DirectX. That is being questioned now as top-tier game developers are reaching out to other OSs for opportunities that they didn't before.

Steam/Valve with their Linux-driven Steamboxes, have no choice to go OpenGL.

Attention is being given OpenGL that wasn't just 2 years ago.

What do you mean "attention is being given to OpenGL that wasn't just 2 years ago"? Are you talking about games being added to the list? Because, I would assume that being the case would mean we'd be seeing a lot more games on OS X than we have.
 

Irishman

macrumors 68040
Nov 2, 2006
3,398
844
What do you mean "attention is being given to OpenGL that wasn't just 2 years ago"? Are you talking about games being added to the list? Because, I would assume that being the case would mean we'd be seeing a lot more games on OS X than we have.

Not just OSX, but yes, I mean games. Top tier games take years to develop.
 

tywebb13

macrumors 68030
Apr 21, 2012
2,948
1,636
I just upgraded to this 13D38 on a Mac guest in Parallels Desktop and after reboot comes up with a black screen. Can't find a workaround. Will report to Parallels. I guess they need to update the Parallels Tools.

Yes. I did this too in parallels and got a black screen of death. So I deleted the borked virtual machine.

I had an older backup of a parallels virtual machine of some build of 10.9.2 (can't remember which - doesn't matter).

I imported this to vmware fusion 6.0.2 and successfully updated it to 10.9.3 build 13D38.
 

SarcasticJoe

macrumors 6502a
Nov 5, 2013
607
221
Finland
The original Intel HD Graphics were pretty bad, choppy animations even on 10.6. That chip was so bad Apple chose to release the 13" 2010 MBP with the old C2D CPU's so they could use the Nvidia 320m instead.

Actually that was because of the license spat between Intel and Nvidia. Nvidia had a license to make their own chipsets and Apple used them in the first Unibody machines because they saved a lot of space by having the chipset and the graphics on one chip. Apple would have kept using them if Intel hadn't gone and (successfully) sued Nvidia saying that the license was only for Core 2 Duo chips. This is why it took so long for Apple to release their first Arrendale/Nahalem machines when they had to bolt a Nvidia GPU to an Intel chipset (rather than getting them in one neat package from Nvidia) and these boards were simply too big to fit in the 13" machine without having to scale down the battery.

according to this the highest supported on Windows and Linux is OpenGL 3.1. With that being said, I'm unsure in the case of HD 3000 on OS X whether the reported OpenGL 3.3 on the chart points to hardware capabilities but OpenGL 4.1 functionality is emulated in software mode.

The source reference for Windows is from 2011 and the source reference for Linux is from 2012. As for 3.3, it's basically the same as 4.0 except for older hardware, the two were after all released at the same time.

Nvidia's had OpenGL 4.4 beta drivers for Windows and Linux since July and AMD's only got support for 4.3 on both platforms (thou the Linux driver is a lot buggier than the Windows one).

On topic:

Any news on a fix for the video output bug that showed up in 10.9.2? Apple has recognized this bug (someone from them even emailed me after I posted about it on the support forums) and it's fairly annoying when I have to fidget with both a miniDisplayPort-to-DVI adapter and a 3,5mm stereoplug when I used to be able to do it with a single adapter AND get better quality audio.

Turns out it's some kind of kernel extension bug in the graphics related ones and when I tried to fix it by replacing one of the broken extensions I broke OSX. Sure taught me not to mess with the kernel extensions the same way Windows taught me not to mess with the registry.
 
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mmomega

macrumors demi-god
Dec 30, 2009
3,879
2,089
DFW, TX
Anyone else noticing any problems with Back to my Mac, as in Screen Sharing?

My MBA and iMac are having difficulties connecting to my other headless Macs, either at my office or at home. Both the MBA and iMac have 13D38 while one of the Mac Mini's I'm trying to connect to is on 10.9.2 and another on 13D33.

Luckily I have Logmein installed on my office Mini and it works fine, screen sharing will show that the Mac is there but gives a connection failed alert when trying to screen share.

EDIT:
Turning BTMM off and then back on seems to fix the problem.
 
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SarcasticJoe

macrumors 6502a
Nov 5, 2013
607
221
Finland
Yes, I'm well aware of that. This is the reason Apple stuck with the old C2D chips in the 13" 2010 MBP.

Yet you claimed it was because how crap integrated graphics were...

Seriously thou, integrated graphics have ever been an issue in regular desktop use with the original 13" Macbook Pro's from 2012 (trying to run a high DPI screen with an HD Graphics 3000 still baffles me).
 

Blue Sun

macrumors 6502a
Feb 11, 2009
984
330
Australia
Yet you claimed it was because how crap integrated graphics were...

Seriously thou, integrated graphics have ever been an issue in regular desktop use with the original 13" Macbook Pro's from 2012 (trying to run a high DPI screen with an HD Graphics 3000 still baffles me).

No, I was saying that Apple chose to go with the older CPU coupled with the Nvidia 320M rather than the new Core i Arrandale CPUs with Intel HD graphics because of how bad the graphics were. Which is exactly what happened, obviously the Arrandale CPU with the Nvidia chip would have been better, but Intel made sure that wasn't possible - probably to further their own integrated GPU business.
 

Four oF NINE

macrumors 68000
Sep 28, 2011
1,931
896
Hell's Kitchen
FWIW, I notice that the disappearing cursor appears to be fixed with this version.

UPDATE: It now appears the disappearing cursor issue has NOT been resolved after all.
 
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Four oF NINE

macrumors 68000
Sep 28, 2011
1,931
896
Hell's Kitchen
Was this is an issue specific to the previous seeds or did you experience it in 10.9.2?

It has happened prior to 10.9.3, but only on rare occasion. This issue became more prominent with 10.9.3.

I've not had another incident since this build. I wouldn't necessarily call it fixed, but fingers crossed right? So far, so good.

______________________________________________________

ADDENDUM: I also got the Appleseed feedback assistant for some reason, not sure what's going on with that.
 

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Parasprite

macrumors 68000
Mar 5, 2013
1,698
144
FWIW, I notice that the disappearing cursor appears to be fixed with this version.

UPDATE: It now appears the disappearing cursor issue has NOT been resolved after all.

Curious, where does this issue precipitate? I've only experienced it in MS Office apps but I pitted it to the general bugginess of the software and not specifically to OS X.
 

Four oF NINE

macrumors 68000
Sep 28, 2011
1,931
896
Hell's Kitchen
Curious, where does this issue precipitate? I've only experienced it in MS Office apps but I pitted it to the general bugginess of the software and not specifically to OS X.

I'm Apple only in my computer applications, and it appears to be random, but mainly in association with Safari. Not sure that helps, but I haven't been able to narrow it any further. It revealed itself with this site, for instance in the most recent example.
 

Parasprite

macrumors 68000
Mar 5, 2013
1,698
144
I'm Apple only in my computer applications, and it appears to be random, but mainly in association with Safari. Not sure that helps, but I haven't been able to narrow it any further. It revealed itself with this site, for instance in the most recent example.

That may explain it, I don't use Safari very often so it may have something to do with Safari and/or OS X's equivalent/implementation of WebView.

I remember a while ago having cursor issues with Flash being loaded on the page where it would disappear and I'd have to switch windows or something to get it back. You might want to see if temporarily disabling Flash improves the issue for you (or set it as click-to-load).

Edit: Woo Office update, that (hopefully) fixes my cursor issues at least.

54RgiVR.png
 
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