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Old Jul 13, 2014, 10:58 AM   #26
projectle
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Originally Posted by rols View Post
Perhaps I understood the original intent at the WWDC talk incorrectly, but I thought this was originally supposed to be an open technology anyone could implement.
You mean like AirPlay and FaceTime?
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 11:01 AM   #27
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Sometimes, after reading an article like this, I have to pause and just process how amazing it is that we live in a time in which something small enough to fit in the palm of your hand can accurately display the line width of a lowercase 'L'…

Gone are the days of guessing and on-the-fly calculations!
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 11:29 AM   #28
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Before looking at the size of the diameter, I assumed it was the iWatch lol. But it couldn't be 5inches!
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 11:38 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by projectle View Post
You mean like AirPlay and FaceTime?
Don't know about AirPlay, did they ever suggest that would be open, I have no idea, don't recall reading that? Facetime, yes that was supposed to be open (Steve Jobs 2010) then they ran in to licensing issues, had to change the model to be peer-server-peer instead of peer-peer and there were comments at the time that Apple wasn't going to run server farms for the benefit of the world because it costs a shedload of money. Perhaps when the patent expires ...

There's nothing that proprietary about iBeacon, it's BTLE advertising. The only thing which is apple-specific is the manufacturer id in the advertising packet which is theirs. Perhaps that causes an issue which requires Apple to license the usage but I don't know near enough about Bluetooth licensing rules to do more than random guessing.

I'll go find the original WWDC session and listen to it again, I'm fairly sure at the time it was supposed to be a public spec released within weeks, but perhaps they never said public.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 11:45 AM   #30
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New hardware categories for 2014? Done!

Tim Cook: Phew, I almost had to release iWatch or something!
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 12:26 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by rols View Post
No Bluetooth doesn't require pairing for all operations. And the iBeacon uses one of the minimum spec pieces of bluetooth LE, non-directed, non-connectable advertising, which means technically an iBeacon doesn't even need to have a receiver, just a transmitter.

Odd the way this has developed. When first announced at WWDC a couple of years ago it was stated the spec would be made available 'within a week or two'. In fact the spec was never made publicly available and ended up under Apple's MFi program, which is annoyingly hard, and not inexpensive, to join. That means you can't sell something as iBeacon compliant without Apple approving it either. Now Apple it seems is producing its own iBeacons which will put a dent in the fortunes of the companies which are trying to compete making them.

Perhaps I understood the original intent at the WWDC talk incorrectly, but I thought this was originally supposed to be an open technology anyone could implement.
IBeacon is an Apple trademark and implementation but there is nothing that stops any device from receiving iBeacon messages so long as it has Bluetooth 4.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 12:36 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by projectle View Post
You mean like AirPlay and FaceTime?
Airplay was never meant to be open. FaceTime was announced as open but has not been implemented on any non ios devices. All FaceTime standards are also open so it is not clear if Apple doesn't want to spread FaceTime or is it other developers who are hesitant.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 12:45 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by MacRumors View Post
While it is unknown as to whether Apple will actually launch iBeacon hardware or not, the product could integrate with the company's other platforms and services.
Ow, my brain hurts.

How about, "Whether Apple will actually launch iBeacon hardware is unknown, but the product could integrate with the company's other platforms and services."
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 02:00 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by stridemat View Post
So if Apple can release these very cheaply to business then we could really see iBeacon take off.

Apple really are trying to make their ecosystem one of a kind.
The problem with Apple is that they never want to release anything very cheaply.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 02:09 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by JoeG4 View Post
Is that a microUSB port?!

On an Apple device?
Oh hello, time traveller from 1998.

Yeah, you have a lot to catch up on here in 2014, but one of those things is that Apple abandoned that whole not-made-here mentality a very long time ago. They will occasionally break with the rest of the industry in terms of hardware if they see something that will work better for their product but it's no longer a religious thing. You should probably be aware of that.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 02:15 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Robert.Walter View Post
Once Ibeacons proliferate and are ubiquitous, how, pray tell, will Apple prevent the iPhone from becoming a constant disturbing annoyance?

Because if it works at all, every vendor in a store is going to want their own Ibeacon.

Going to be interested to see how this develops.
No praying necessary; Apple will probably implement something whereby you simply tap 'No thanks!' when walking into a store, and no other store of the same chain will message you again unless you change some settings.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 02:16 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by robinp View Post
Over 5 inches seems very big to me. How big are other ibeacons? I'm sure they are much smaller

Edit
Actually, having looked more closely at the the drawing, the dims look to be in mm. Assuming that someone extrapolated these dims to work out 5.46 it seems most likely that it is 5.46cm which sounds much more like it!
Simple math:
5.46" is over 138 mm. Dimensions on the drawing indicate the device is about 60 mm, which converts to an overall dimension of less than 2.5 inches. So, you're close.

Last edited by RichardH1; Jul 13, 2014 at 04:56 PM.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 02:17 PM   #38
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i wonder what the price point will be for it...
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 02:25 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by Thunderstrike76 View Post
I'm not sure I see a clear path for apple in the ibeacon home automation market. Not sure it will pay off in the long run, even though they are just now laying the ground work for it. Should be an interesting market in the next 5 to 10 years.

Based on this MacRumors report, iBeacons seem to be on a fairly fast adoption path:
http://www.macrumors.com/2014/07/10/...-second-phase/
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 02:31 PM   #40
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Don't you get the feeling that every time apple release something lately its...
a) overpriced and out of date as soon as it reaches the consumer
b) has some form of lock in that means apple will try to make even more money out of the users
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 02:47 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by PocketSand11 View Post
The problem with Apple is that they never want to release anything very cheaply.
I'm not sure I see where this is a problem.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 02:55 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by IJ Reilly View Post
I'm not sure I see where this is a problem.
iBeacons won't spread if they cost a fortune to implement. Apple's "low marketshare, high profit margin" thing won't work when they're trying to spread a standard.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 03:16 PM   #43
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 04:34 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deepshade View Post
Don't you get the feeling that every time apple release something lately its...
a) overpriced and out of date as soon as it reaches the consumer
b) has some form of lock in that means apple will try to make even more money out of the users
a) overpriced is a matter of opinion. Some may find value and price equitable.

b) I've never known a for profit business that didn't try to lock in consumers beyond a primary purchase. It's how they stay in business.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 05:18 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by PocketSand11 View Post
iBeacons won't spread if they cost a fortune to implement. Apple's "low marketshare, high profit margin" thing won't work when they're trying to spread a standard.
I don't see it costing a fortune, especially if Apple isn't the only hardware supplier. It's more likely that they offer a premium implementation.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 05:20 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PocketSand11 View Post
iBeacons won't spread if they cost a fortune to implement. Apple's "low marketshare, high profit margin" thing won't work when they're trying to spread a standard.
Don't you worry. Either Google will copy it and call it Android/Chrome something or Samsung will copy it and call it S-something.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 05:52 PM   #47
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iBeacon to operate at 2.4ghz? Does no one at Apple see a problem with this? Not only does water resonate at this frequency to block any signal (think high humidity areas and outside venues where it may be foggy, sprinkle or rain), but a lot of businesses use internal comms and wifi modems on this frequency.

I would have picked anything other than 2.4ghz.

----------

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Don't you worry. Either Google will copy it and call it Android/Chrome something or Samsung will copy it and call it S-something.
Why would Google want to copy something so limited when they already have geo-fencing and pay pass built in? Both are more robust and don't need any additional hardware to be built, maintained, installed and paid for. iBeacon is another Maps failure in the making.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 06:00 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by IJ Reilly View Post
I don't see it costing a fortune, especially if Apple isn't the only hardware supplier. It's more likely that they offer a premium implementation.
Well, considering Apple's strict control or closed-ness with:
- AirPlay
- Lightning
- Face Time
- iMessage
- App Store
- all their operating systems
Apple isn't on a course for allowing other hardware suppliers to do this.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by iOSaddict View Post
Don't you worry. Either Google will copy it and call it Android/Chrome something or Samsung will copy it and call it S-something.
But that IS the reason to worry. Apple starts ahead and ends up behind, just like AirPlay and Chromecast.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaximus View Post
Apple TV has one.
Yeah, that's the reason I wasn't able to restore my Apple TV for two weeks. Got lots of mini USB cables, no micro USB.
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 06:56 PM   #49
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Old Jul 13, 2014, 07:10 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by Lloydbm41 View Post
iBeacon to operate at 2.4ghz?

I would have picked anything other than 2.4ghz.
It runs on standard bluetooth, which is at 2.4ghz.
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