70D or 6D

have a look over this thread about the 6d in low light

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1754418/

Nickwell24 said:

Okay everybody, I've been going back and forth between these two cameras (or a used 7D) for the last two months, I've read all the specs on both, so now it comes time I ask for the communities input. Currently I'm shooting with a T2i doing mostly landscape and portrait photography. Eventually I want to get into time-lapse photography including star trails.

The 70D has many benefits: Cheaper, EF-S compatibility, 19 AF cross-point, touchscreen.
The 6D's main benefit is the sensor. It has less AF point, not EF-S compatible.

The main reason I'm looking at the 6D is the sensor, as I'm sure is the main reason for most. I've shot a few night shot already and even at ISO 100 the T2i has noise issues with the crop sensor, I don't want to have similar issues with a new crop sensor.

Any input is appreciated and valued, especially if you've also debated between these cameras. I have a bit of time before this purchase so I am hoping for a good discussion - the 70-200 f/2.8 is the next purchase.
A few sample shots:
Image

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The digital noise of the T2i you have referred to can be easily removed without significant loss of IQ using the NIK's noise removal plugin. But for the types of photography styles you are planning to get into, the 6D offers you perhaps the best low noise/high ISO sensor out there. The lenses is where most of the money will go, but for night sky photography you can buy lenses that are cheaper than Canon L or Zeiss'. For example, for super wide you could use a relatively cheap lens such as the 14mm f/2.8 Rokinon. It is a manual lens, but this should not be a problem for taking photos of the sky at night since you would have to adjust the focus manually. Then there are other lenses you can use with the 6D such as the Tokina 16-28mm f/2.8 (for FF cameras). This lens costs around $700.00, but has no provisions for using filters. However, if you don't know how to build a home-made filter adapter, you can always buy a FotoDiox WonderPana filter adapter for around $265.00. Canon just released a UW 16-35mm f/4L, but I imagine that it too would need a filter adapter, which should bring the cost of both to perhaps $1,600.

For portraiture or weddings where you don't want to use a flash, the 6D and its center focus point is just about perfect, but you will need other lenses for that. Also, about your next lens purchase: that lens is highly regarded as being outstanding and desired by a lot of photographers. If you can afford it, go for it

I use a Tokina 11-16 for my 7D to take pictures of the Auroras in Alaska, and a Tokina 16-28 for my 5DII. Both are wonderful lenses, and very sharp.

You can see plenty of photo samples taken with the 6D in here:
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=1252637&page=830

Some "out of the box" thinking,.. The 6D is the right way to go but you can leap front that and go up a few levels. The difference between T2i and 6D is noticeable to a skilled photographer but not many clients see the difference.

For most people the T2i is the best option. but in your case, carefully composed landscape that I assume are being made into large scale fine art print the larger sensor is really going to help.

The key assumption is that you are making large prints. The noise issue don't show up at all if you look at the images on-screen at normal size because after all, LCD monitors are roughly only about two megapixels and down sizing hides noise. Large prints are different.

But then why use an SLR? The example photos you showed are not action shots. You would not believe the jump in quality you get with even larger sensors. The difference is greater than the different between full frame and crop frame Canon SLRs. Cost is a huge difference too.

Back to SLRs: If you can add lighting then the camera body hardly matters. Any old Canon body can do great portrait work if you have light. You might keep your T2i SLR for action and people and move to large format for fine art landscape. You might even find the cost of the large format gear is LESS than a full frame SLR.

Film scans from 4x5 are about like a 120 megapixel RAW image. MUCH better than anything you can get out of an SLR. Entry cost is about $500 or so. Film cost is trivial because the process is so slow.

I see by the water marks this is a business. Moving out of SLR to larger format also moves your work up into a different price class. 36" prints because possible. It might even pay and the competitive space you work in is reduced.

Or just buy the 6D. It will make YOU happy but will client pay double for you work if you swap SLR bodies? Likely not.

Hi Nickwell24, if your mainly shooting Landscape/Portraits the 6D would be the best way to go,combined with the 70-200 f2.8 II or some nice prime L glass you will be blown away by the results,
the low light performance of the full frame sensor is worth it alone, why not rent a 6D and 70-200 lens, good luck with your decision

You haven't really explained what you need from the camera.

Are you printing often? You complain about noise but web previews show little noise from the shots you posted.

You mention the 6Ds inability to use EF-S lenses. What lenses do you see in the lineup that you need to use?

Nickwell24 said:

The main reason I'm looking at the 6D is the sensor, as I'm sure is the main reason for most. I've shot a few night shot already and even at ISO 100 the T2i has noise issues with the crop sensor, I don't want to have similar issues with a new crop sensor.

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Noise issues at iso100? Examples please.

acearchie said:

You haven't really explained what you need from the camera.

Are you printing often? You complain about noise but web previews show little noise from the shots you posted.

You mention the 6Ds inability to use EF-S lenses. What lenses do you see in the lineup that you need to use?

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ef-s 18-55mm f3.5-5.6 IS is my daily go-to lens

needfx said:

ef-s 18-55mm f3.5-5.6 IS is my daily go-to lens

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Tamron 24-70mm with VC job done!

I was in similar boat as you, 70D vs 6D, went with the 70D as step up from my 5 year old Ti1.

Now, in those 5 years od Ti1 usage I've upgraded from kit lens to Canon 15-85 and also 70-200 L mkII f2.8. It was not till recently that I felt the T1i was holding me back.

I do suggest you consider your lens and possibly upgrade from that ef-s 18-55mm f3.5-5.6 IS to possible a faster zoom like acearchie said.

What I really like about my 70D over the T1i is the more control and information I have on the top and back screen, as well as the more direct ability to change exposure parameters easily.

Check out this Canon 70D RAW High ISO Field Test
http://www.slrlounge.com/canon-70d-raw-high-iso-field-test/

the 70D does seem to put ISO 3200 / 6400 “on the map” for Canon crop sensors, with what we feel are the first professionally acceptable results for things like wedding photography and low-light photojournalism / sports

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If for pure low light high ISO then 6D over 70D no doubt.

needfx said:

ef-s 18-55mm f3.5-5.6 IS is my daily go-to lens

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Ha, I am really glad you said that. It's my go-to lens too (on a T3i), because I think the image quality is quite sharp 18-35 stopped down a 1-3 stops (and I don't like dropping money...) **IS II version.

What about the rumors of a new 70D? I would wait to buy that one, for sure. 6D is sweet... but the next-gen 70D might be a really sweet crop body, might not. Worth waiting though.

P.S. a 30 sec. exposure @ ISO 100 does ok for me, especially with noise reduction in LR5 set around 25-30. Very sharp. Color fringing is an issue because of the 18-55, but LR fixes that quite well too.

Also, compliments to your photography, I am always very impressed. (especially as a compact crop body shooter myself).

suprakc said:

Ha, I am really glad you said that. It's my go-to lens too (on a T3i), because I think the image quality is quite sharp 18-35 stopped down a 1-3 stops (and I don't like dropping money...) **IS II version.

What about the rumors of a new 70D? I would wait to buy that one, for sure. 6D is sweet... but the next-gen 70D might be a really sweet crop body, might not. Worth waiting though.

P.S. a 30 sec. exposure @ ISO 100 does ok for me, especially with noise reduction in LR5 set around 25-30. Very sharp. Color fringing is an issue because of the 18-55, but LR fixes that quite well too.

Also, compliments to your photography, I am always very impressed. (especially as a compact crop body shooter myself).

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hi mate and many thanks for the compliments! how about posting in the POTD and contest threads some of your work too?

Sorry to burst your bubble but I was a bit ironic regarding that lens. I bought a 100D kit with that lens as a present for my grandmother, I can't say I really appreciate it. On the other hand, I really appreciate the 100D, I have one myself as secondary along with my 6D, but most of my photographs are with the 6D. That's not to say great photographs cannot be made with the 18-55, it's really mostly up to the photographer and conditions upon taking the photograph (if not studio photography with artificial lighting)

Come to think of it, I think the forum needs one more monthly competition.

The best you can do with the cheapest possible hardware. Maybe even single use film cameras...!

For me the 6D plus a faster crop sensor body (like the 50d, 60d, 7D) is a good combo. You won't see that much of a noise improvement from the T2i on the 70d. Especially if you're pixel peeping.