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Old Jul 5, 2008, 03:34 PM   #2001
DAC47
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first reaction
that was good but not great, left me a bit flat after last weeks build up

also i had a feeling that RTD wouldn't kill of any of the companions, just like Rose was supposed to die at the end of series 2 and didn't. I think he doesn't want to send out that kind of message to the kids watching, but perhaps Donnas fate was worse than death, to be re-chav-ified
oh btw loved the German
Daleks

and it looks like we'll be seeing Micky and Martha in Torchwood next year
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Old Jul 5, 2008, 04:54 PM   #2002
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That was probably the weakest of the new series finales. Still liked the bit about Gwen and the possible fate of Torchwood.
No link to the Christmas special even though it's finished? I guess the lonely man at the end of all those happy goodbyes is a good balance. It's just missing that sad Hulk walking away music.
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Old Jul 5, 2008, 05:02 PM   #2003
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First impressions: Good stuff. Nice and holistic.

But-

Now that everything is wrapped up nicely, and all the threads have been tied up, and we've had the prefect final shot of the doctor alone in the cosmos once more...

... does it not make sense to end there? I mean, a Christmas special and (potentially) more to come seems to spoil all the work that went into this finale.

If you don't end on an episode like that, then when will you end? You can't make a better final Doctor Who than that. I don't want the series just to carry on until it runs out of steam. If they'd quit there, it would have been a masterpiece.
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Old Jul 5, 2008, 05:20 PM   #2004
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Threads?
Wonder if they'll address the whole River Song relationship from Silence in the Library/Forrest of the Dead in the specials next year before Tennant leaves. Because Tennant is obviously her Doctor.
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Old Jul 5, 2008, 05:28 PM   #2005
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Why does this new series of Doctor Who get worse and worse and whats the flippen fascination with London. It seems the graphics effects are pull right out of that blue peter show.
I have seen better from Farscape, Battlestar Galatica(miles better), Startrek TNG(equal and better graphics in some places, worse in some ship models).
Do they actually think what there producing in graphics and plot is any good, though i understand Docter Who's plots were always whimsical the older ones had much better depth even season 1 of this new Docter Who the episode Dalek actually faithfully brought back a Dalek that was scary and able to do damage and the set and effects budget seamed much higher than normal though still below par.
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Old Jul 5, 2008, 06:02 PM   #2006
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Hmm. Hmmmmmm.

I don't know what to make of that. I kinda missed half that episode with a bit of appendicitis (or what felt like it ) but from what I saw-

Very nice with the regen being thrown to the hand like that! Very very nice. Don't call seconds Rels. That engine reactor looked a bit weak really. Reality Bomb? Bad name! Good idea but BAD NAME. Osker Harden key sounded a little weak in the end too, I was hoping for a kind of time lock for the whole planet that left them frozen in time until the Doctor could come and fix all their problems, suppose it was only human tech after all.

It's a big lumpy nutshell of opinions I know. Sorry should probably watch it again.
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Old Jul 5, 2008, 06:47 PM   #2007
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i liked it, the graphics were good, remember this hasn't got the budgets of big studios behind it like Startrek (Paramount Pictures)........ they do have to keep in budgets and it's funded by the license payers.

The weakest bit was the start where we were expecting a new Doctor and the big climax was wiped away after 5 seconds of weak explanation, but all in all a very good episode.

As for the comments about the fascination about London, i Love it!!! why the hell not? London's an amazing city and it's good to have a big show like this use it more
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Old Jul 5, 2008, 06:53 PM   #2008
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Osker Harden key sounded a little weak in the end too
Oscar Hardon?

I heard it as Oster-Haagen but could be wrong - could probably just as easily be Oyster Harden - perhaps one of the next plots will be about Transport for London using the Oyster network as a system of mind control.
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Old Jul 5, 2008, 08:53 PM   #2009
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two doctors, 1 blue suit, 1 brow suit, i think somthing to do with the who hand, it has been in recent shots, look on youtube some kids who live i their mums basements have been filming the filming of the whodence, its has DT in two suits!

Bring on minimum of 700 seeders come 1hr after the episode
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA, i was right about the hand, just picked up the clues along the way, is a whodence thing, just put reminders in, like the bees and marthers family during S3 like being masterised, lol, i was right
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Old Jul 5, 2008, 09:07 PM   #2010
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ooh ooh ooh that was good. Wrapped up an awful lot of loose ends and tied them up, like Gwen being a relative of the girl from the dickens episode of series 1.
Ugh I hated that.

Same with the whole Martha "My cousin worked at Torchwood" thing.

They it be so much better if they just IGNORED it. I don't care if they got slammed for it. Honestly, I wouldn't have known (or cared) if they used the same actor more than once. It would be a fun little easter egg to notice when you watch it again (and it wasn't even like the actress who plays Gwen was really that noticable in the First Series that made you think "Oh yes, that's the same woman that plays Gwen in Torchwood")

Colin Baker was in Doctor Who before he was the Doctor, and it's not like they made a big fuss about that in the show, like "where have I seen my face before? OH YES IT WAS ON THAT PLANET... [lame excuse] ..."

And why didn't they make some lame excuse about the fortune teller in Turn Left being the same person as the Chan Fo lady in Utopia?

It's very, very annoying and ruins the believability, in my opinion.

And as if the Doctor would even remember something as insignificant as the person who lived in Cardiff. As shown by references in the show, it's not like every episode is a follow-on from the last because they occasionally talk about places they've been in their off-screen adventures.

*sigh*

Rant over.

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Threads?
Wonder if they'll address the whole River Song relationship from Silence in the Library/Forrest of the Dead in the specials next year before Tennant leaves. Because Tennant is obviously her Doctor.
Probably not :P I doubt Steven Muffin (or whatever his name is, lol) wants to continue lugging RTD's stories behind him (hence why RTD tied off all the ends with the companions in this episode)

Oh, and does anyone know if RTD is still continuing with Torchwood and Sarah Jane? Or is the new guy taking over those as well?
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Old Jul 5, 2008, 11:22 PM   #2011
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Ugh I hated that.

Same with the whole Martha "My cousin worked at Torchwood" thing.

They it be so much better if they just IGNORED it. I don't care if they got slammed for it. Honestly, I wouldn't have known (or cared) if they used the same actor more than once. It would be a fun little easter egg to notice when you watch it again (and it wasn't even like the actress who plays Gwen was really that noticable in the First Series that made you think "Oh yes, that's the same woman that plays Gwen in Torchwood")

Colin Baker was in Doctor Who before he was the Doctor, and it's not like they made a big fuss about that in the show, like "where have I seen my face before? OH YES IT WAS ON THAT PLANET... [lame excuse] ..."

And why didn't they make some lame excuse about the fortune teller in Turn Left being the same person as the Chan Fo lady in Utopia?

It's very, very annoying and ruins the believability, in my opinion.

And as if the Doctor would even remember something as insignificant as the person who lived in Cardiff. As shown by references in the show, it's not like every episode is a follow-on from the last because they occasionally talk about places they've been in their off-screen adventures.

*sigh*

Rant over.



Probably not :P I doubt Steven Muffin (or whatever his name is, lol) wants to continue lugging RTD's stories behind him (hence why RTD tied off all the ends with the companions in this episode)

Oh, and does anyone know if RTD is still continuing with Torchwood and Sarah Jane? Or is the new guy taking over those as well?
Steven Moffat is a genius - Doctor Who in 2010 is going to the the best yet.
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Old Jul 6, 2008, 12:20 AM   #2012
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and it wasn't even like the actress who plays Gwen was really that noticable in the First Series that made you think "Oh yes, that's the same woman that plays Gwen in Torchwood"...

...And why didn't they make some lame excuse about the fortune teller in Turn Left being the same person as the Chan Fo lady in Utopia?

And as if the Doctor would even remember something as insignificant as the person who lived in Cardiff...
Well Gwen is possibly the ugliest man magnet in wales, and I'd say she was Highly noticeable, being as she was the conduit for the creatures making the dead come to live in Cardiff and gave her life to seal that part of the rift, all of it about 3ft from the Doctors fizzog, and her name was gwen (or some variation thereof) aswell, so I say she's hardly insignifficant.

and they didn't make a deal of the fortune teller/Chan-Tho or the Ghostmaker from torchwood being Davros, mainly because they were covered in honking great gobbs of makeup and prosthetics
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Old Jul 6, 2008, 10:44 AM   #2013
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Well Gwen is possibly the ugliest man magnet in wales, and I'd say she was Highly noticeable, being as she was the conduit for the creatures making the dead come to live in Cardiff and gave her life to seal that part of the rift, all of it about 3ft from the Doctors fizzog, and her name was gwen (or some variation thereof) aswell, so I say she's hardly insignifficant.

and they didn't make a deal of the fortune teller/Chan-Tho or the Ghostmaker from torchwood being Davros, mainly because they were covered in honking great gobbs of makeup and prosthetics
I know but would you remember someone who you barely knew from two years ago so clearly as to recognize one of their descendants when your life is as action packed as the Doctor's?

I know the whole fortune teller/Chan-Tho thing was a bit of a silly example, but I still stand by the idea that it ruins the episodes a little to bring up something as insignificant as the cast playing minor roles in previous episodes.
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Old Jul 6, 2008, 03:13 PM   #2014
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Oh and the Daleks speaking German was a nice touch - even though it sort of reminded me of Nazis.
That may have been intentional, actually. Terry Nation (who originally created the Daleks) grew up during the Second World War and has said that the Nazis were one of his inspirations for them – faceless, dictatorial and xenophobic. I did like them speaking German, though.

That was alright, I thought. Like others I rolled my eyes a bit at the beginning but it did get better as it went on. I thought the ending was a good one, with everyone going off to their lives and families, and the Doctor left alone. The last few shots really emphasised one of the core aspects of the Doctor – despite the adventures, the travels and excitement, deep down he's a very lonely character.
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Old Jul 6, 2008, 05:17 PM   #2015
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We know that while the regeneration is fresh The Doctor can grow new limbs, could a limb grow a new Doctor when regeneration energy is plentiful? Might the hand grow a new Doctor?
I can't believe I was actually right about that one!


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Why does this new series of Doctor Who get worse and worse and whats the flippen fascination with London. It seems the graphics effects are pull right out of that blue peter show.
I have seen better from Farscape, Battlestar Galatica(miles better), Startrek TNG(equal and better graphics in some places, worse in some ship models).
Do they actually think what there producing in graphics and plot is any good, though i understand Docter Who's plots were always whimsical the older ones had much better depth even season 1 of this new Docter Who the episode Dalek actually faithfully brought back a Dalek that was scary and able to do damage and the set and effects budget seamed much higher than normal though still below par.
Doctor Who has always had the poor models and bad rubber suits. I'd actually be somewhat more put off if the effects started getting seamless.
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Old Jul 7, 2008, 10:38 PM   #2016
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Probably not :P I doubt Steven Muffin (or whatever his name is, lol) wants to continue lugging RTD's stories behind him
"Silence in the Library" was a Steven Moffat story...
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Old Jul 7, 2008, 10:47 PM   #2017
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Does this mean that David Tennant is the tenth and eleventh Doctor? Or was this just something completely different and the Doctor still has 3 regenerations left? Because I thought Time Lords only had 13... (although The Master had more).
First of all, the Master has stolen regenerations, so he doesn't count. As for the Doctor, yes, he technically only has 13 lives (12 regenerations), but this doesn't count as one, as he explained in the episode. Also, don't forget about one of my favorite characters, the Valeyard!

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Particularly the guest appearance from K-9 as I've always loved him.
Yeah, good to see him again - haven't seen him since Season 2!

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Oh and the Daleks speaking German was a nice touch - even though it sort of reminded me of Nazis.
I should hope it did - the Nazis were Terry Nation's inspiration for the Daleks. This is very evident in Genesis of the Daleks - you should watch it if you haven't seen it. I'm sure it was completely intentional, just as Nazi overtones have been utilized with the Daleks in all of their appearances.

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Wonder if they'll address the whole River Song relationship from Silence in the Library/Forrest of the Dead in the specials next year before Tennant leaves. Because Tennant is obviously her Doctor.
Keep in mind that River said that her Doctor was a much older Tennant. This makes me wonder if she will have her adventures with the Doctor in an alternate time stream which we will never get to see. After all, the Doctors still exist in their respective regeneration s even after regenerating on the show (i.e. The Three Doctors, The Five Doctors, The Two Doctors, Time Crash) so who knows....

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Probably not :P I doubt Steven Muffin (or whatever his name is, lol) wants to continue lugging RTD's stories behind him (hence why RTD tied off all the ends with the companions in this episode)
His name is Steven Moffat and he is a genius. His era of Who has the potential to be the best ever. He has penned the best Who episodes of the new series (Blink being the best in my opinion) and I look forward to him taking over the reins.

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Doctor Who has always had the poor models and bad rubber suits. I'd actually be somewhat more put off if the effects started getting seamless.
Cheers to that - it's one of the things I love about the show.
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Old Jul 8, 2008, 04:59 AM   #2018
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In the UK, it's shown on the Beeb, which is "free" (taxpayer-funded, but broadcast over the air and not a premium channel
The BBC is not free. It is not funded by taxpayers. The British public have to pay a TV Licence.


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Old Jul 8, 2008, 09:24 AM   #2019
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Keep in mind that River said that her Doctor was a much older Tennant. This makes me wonder if she will have her adventures with the Doctor in an alternate time stream which we will never get to see. After all, the Doctors still exist in their respective regeneration s even after regenerating on the show (i.e. The Three Doctors, The Five Doctors, The Two Doctors, Time Crash) so who knows....
Or it could be the alternate dimension Doctor as well. He is going to age like a human, and Rose may pass on in some tragic accident at Torchwood in the other dimension and he is motivated to get back.

He knows everything he needs to set it all up, and they get past the, how to keep Tenant long enough to age him without having another regeneration.

Of course it could also mean that one of his next regenerations is into an older form.
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Old Jul 8, 2008, 11:23 AM   #2020
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First of all, the Master has stolen regenerations, so he doesn't count. As for the Doctor, yes, he technically only has 13 lives (12 regenerations), but this doesn't count as one, as he explained in the episode. Also, don't forget about one of my favorite characters, the Valeyard!
Ah, I didn't notice. I was too busy screaming "Cop out!" at the TV :P

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Yeah, good to see him again - haven't seen him since Season 2!
I wish he was in it more often... I remember watching a Tom Baker episode once where K-9 was on a space station and went off to do some crazy stuff... I think it was "The Nightmare of Eden" or something. I have it on VHS somewhere but I haven't watched any old Who episodes in about 6 years (I know! Shameful!)

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I should hope it did - the Nazis were Terry Nation's inspiration for the Daleks. This is very evident in Genesis of the Daleks - you should watch it if you haven't seen it. I'm sure it was completely intentional, just as Nazi overtones have been utilized with the Daleks in all of their appearances.
I'm certain I've seen it... It rings a bell, anyway. But I was probably too young to notice. (as I was probably only 8 or 9 years old when I watched it)

I'll have a look through my Who videos that I taped of UKTV Gold. :P

Admittedly, the Dalek and Cyberman episodes were the only ones that really kept my attention, at that age...

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His name is Steven Moffat and he is a genius. His era of Who has the potential to be the best ever. He has penned the best Who episodes of the new series (Blink being the best in my opinion) and I look forward to him taking over the reins.
Hmm I didn't think too much of Blink. It was good but I don't really like the Episodes without the Doctor... just don't feel like they're proper Doctor Who Episodes (although I hated the Peter Kay one because it was terrible, not because the Doctor had very little appearance in it)

But I loved the Library Episode. One of the best Episodes of series 4.
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Old Jul 8, 2008, 12:46 PM   #2021
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Or it could be the alternate dimension Doctor as well. He is going to age like a human, and Rose may pass on in some tragic accident at Torchwood in the other dimension and he is motivated to get back.

He knows everything he needs to set it all up, and they get past the, how to keep Tenant long enough to age him without having another regeneration.

Of course it could also mean that one of his next regenerations is into an older form.
Very good point, that would get around a few obstalces. Still though, River is presumably from the same dimension as the real Doctor, so... hmmm, well anyway, you definitely bring up a good point!

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Hmm I didn't think too much of Blink. It was good but I don't really like the Episodes without the Doctor... just don't feel like they're proper Doctor Who Episodes (although I hated the Peter Kay one because it was terrible, not because the Doctor had very little appearance in it)

But I loved the Library Episode. One of the best Episodes of series 4.
I liked Blink because of its uniqueness in that repsect, and its overall effectiveness and excellent writing, regardless of whether the Doctor was in it or not, but to each their own. I loved the Library epsiodes this year and also loved The Empty Child/Doctor Dances 2-parter and especially The Girl in the Fireplace from Season 2. As I said, Moffat can do no wrong in my books, he is an excellent writer.
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Old Jul 8, 2008, 01:07 PM   #2022
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Very good point, that would get around a few obstalces. Still though, River is presumably from the same dimension as the real Doctor, so... hmmm, well anyway, you definitely bring up a good point!
But they sealed the dimensional rift for good the first time, and there was a way back, so I wouldn't put it past a motivated Doctor to find a way to augment the dimensional jumping tech that the alternate dimension has and come back to hang out with River.

Where he'd get his hands on another TARDIS though would be an interesting story.

Maybe there's going to be another spinoff about Rose's dimension and hers and the Doctor's adventures there...
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Old Jul 8, 2008, 01:22 PM   #2023
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But they sealed the dimensional rift for good the first time, and there was a way back, so I wouldn't put it past a motivated Doctor to find a way to augment the dimensional jumping tech that the alternate dimension has and come back to hang out with River.

Where he'd get his hands on another TARDIS though would be an interesting story.
Yeah, never say never, however the TARDIS requirement would be a bit of a show-stopper.

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Maybe there's going to be another spinoff about Rose's dimension and hers and the Doctor's adventures there...
Oh God please no. I can handle Torchwood, as Season 2 was surprisingly better than I expected (especially after the torture that was Season 1) and I don't watch Sarah Jane as I assume it's more kid-oriented, but regardless, another spin-off is just too much...
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Old Jul 8, 2008, 01:25 PM   #2024
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I was just thinking that this thread is getting past the usual couple of thousand posts where we just start another.

Would someone please create another Doctor Who thread in Community Discussion and I'll close this and sort out the links if necessary?

Cheers. Live long and prosper. Er.
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Old Jul 8, 2008, 01:26 PM   #2025
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I'll scurry off and do that now. Nanoo, nanoo. Or something.
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