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Old Aug 6, 2013, 05:57 AM   #26
gnasher729
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thekev View Post
It's not limited to any one tech company. In terms of savings, it comes in the form of providing lower bids that do not account for the cost of handling things properly, or just poor management of funds. Either way our tech companies are likely to keep themselves well separated from any of this.
That must be why Apple is auditing hundreds of suppliers every year, is giving employees in of suppliers in China a way to report directly to Apple when their company causes damages to the environment, and has actually acted on such tip-offs.
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Old Aug 6, 2013, 07:21 AM   #27
RightMACatU
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... and my local grocery stores sells vegetables from China
Now you know why I refuse to buy them.
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Old Aug 6, 2013, 11:37 AM   #28
togg
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Thank you all guys and girls. This was a really instructive discussion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MR.Raul View Post
Why not have Apple fix all the worlds problem while we're at it, even if it's not their fault,
It is their fault, and I've already explained why. They WANT that intermediary exploit both humans and earth, so that they can make more profits. It's the corporations who have come up with this strategy, it's not God who say "Corporations have to go in China/Bangladesh/ecc, make someone else to destroy the world for them and making profits."

Quote:
Originally Posted by carlgo View Post
The Chinese are going to have to deal with this
Because God told them to go to China. And of course when they've answer the call to go to China they've use their enormous influence to make things go better...

Quote:
Originally Posted by macs4nw View Post
it remains the responsibility of FOXCONN and the Chinese authorities to stop these crimes against the environment.
And who want the Chinese authorities to be corrupted? Ah! Such a difficult questions, my brain is going to explode!


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Originally Posted by wyrmintheapple View Post
This is the same faulty liberal argument I have with my partner. "Apple are so rich so they should fix the ills of the world....."

You can't create a fair and just world by unfairly apportioning blame.
Capitalism can not create a fair world. Apple is so rich (AND THE OTHER CORPORATIONS) by creating the ills of the world.
These ills are:
1) People who live their lives working to survive and built the last shining product.
2) Exploiting of natural resources etc.
3) Overproduction potential crisis (you don't actually need to have the overproduction to have the crisis).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aidyn's X View Post
Give me a solution. Point me to a company that produces a product that is as well built and as well functioning as an iPhone/MacBook Air/Mac Mini that doesn't create waste.
Capitalism is not a system that you can fight *only* with good buying practice. Of course this helps, if you don't waste they will make less profits but this is not enough. The solution is not to live in the forest with bows but to fight the system from the inside. There's no other way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gnasher729 View Post
That must be why Apple is auditing hundreds of suppliers every year, is giving employees in of suppliers in China a way to report directly to Apple when their company causes damages to the environment, and has actually acted on such tip-offs.
Auditing are just propaganda. It's a tool that they've refined and used only because they know that it can't be really effective.

They used to make audits too ----> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Sa...lding_collapse
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Old Aug 6, 2013, 12:40 PM   #29
gnasher729
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So let's summarize togg's argument:

1. Apple is evil.
2. Apple is lying to us.
3. We are all stupid for believing anything that Apple says.

Now I'll summarise all the evidence that he has other than his prejudices:
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Old Aug 6, 2013, 03:35 PM   #30
bedifferent
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aidyn's X View Post
Give me a solution. Point me to a company that produces a product that is as well built and as well functioning as an iPhone/MacBook Air/Mac Mini that doesn't create waste.
That's exactly my point. We "need" to move on from a never ending race, educate people on what companies do not want us to know, and begin pushing for electronic reformation and development in green tech. Israel is the most green nation on the planet, a fact I had no idea of until my friend moved there ~2 years ago to work in marketing for green tech. You'd be surprised how much can be accomplished with a small amount of funding. However, it is up to the general consumer to push for change by voting with their dollars, writing their local politicians and companies.
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Old Aug 6, 2013, 04:26 PM   #31
Aidyn's X
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gnasher729 View Post
So let's summarize togg's argument:

1. Apple is evil.
2. Apple is lying to us.
3. We are all stupid for believing anything that Apple says.

Now I'll summarise all the evidence that he has other than his prejudices:
First time I have laughed out loud on this forum in a long time.
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Old Aug 7, 2013, 05:01 AM   #32
togg
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gnasher729 View Post
So let's summarize togg's argument:

1. Apple is evil.
2. Apple is lying to us.
3. We are all stupid for believing anything that Apple says.

Now I'll summarise all the evidence that he has other than his prejudices:
You're not so good on summarise.

1) Capitalism is evil, I've already explained why. But it seems than you don't read posts, you just try a way to demonize arguments and confuse readers.
2) All the corporations lie, they do it to defend their profit.
3) Just talk for yourself. The world is bigger than troll on macrumors.


The evidence that we have?

" 2. They once held the record as the most irresponsible labor rights and environmental offender of all 29 major tech companies working with suppliers in China. A report published in August 2011 by a collection of Chinese NGOs included findings from a study of suppliers associated with the 29 biggest tech companies operating in China. While environmental and labor violations were found at suppliers across the board, of all the tech companies contracting work to them, Apple was least responsive to requests from NGOs that it address chronic environmental and labor violations at 27 of its suppliers. As of the publication of the report, Apple had been completely unresponsive to requests for action. Violations at suppliers included hazardous water runoff containing heavy metals waste that pollutes lakes, rivers, and groundwater in and around rural Chinese communities; and noxious emissions of gasses that cause nearby residents respiratory illness, chronic headaches, and dizziness. Some residents of villages near suppliers reported a sharp increase in cancer rates in the decades since tech companies began producing in their regions. In January of this year a third report on Apple was released by the NGO group that revealed that Apple has responded to some of the most egregious environmental violations cited in the previous report, and that effective improvements have been made at a few suppliers. However, the report points out that while labor and environmental violations are systemic, most of the Chinese supply base remains unexamined by Apple. Rather than proactively managing its supply chain, and taking responsibility for its role in shaping what happens at suppliers as a result of the very low cost schedule Apple affords them, the company remains irresponsibly reactive."

http://21centurynomad.com/2013/08/01...w-about-apple/
http://www.ipe.org.cn/Upload/Report-IT-Phase-VI-EN.pdf

Last edited by togg; Aug 7, 2013 at 05:06 AM.
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Old Aug 8, 2013, 09:50 AM   #33
otismotive77
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wow, that's a big blow to the reputation of apple, i never thought that a company like apple would be related to something like this, this is bad, i remember the unfortunate event when dozens of japanese villagers died because of eating contaminated fish (toxic metals were found in the fish)
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 10:15 AM   #34
Ray J
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This is from a country that spray-paints mountains green rather than just plant grass. Oh, the irony.
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