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Old Dec 22, 2012, 07:41 AM   #26
charlieegan3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bill-p View Post
Interface scaling on Retina Mac is done via CPU. And CPU can only access RAM.

Also if any app wants to cache interface graphics so as to not have to load it up again every time, then it caches that graphic inside RAM.

So RAM is used up faster than VRAM.
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Originally Posted by Wafflausages View Post
On the 13" the vram is shared with the ram
Yes I know but the max is 512mb which is reach at 8gb, not 16gb of ram.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost...58&postcount=2

Please folks do the research...
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 08:42 AM   #27
JeffiJers
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Originally Posted by charlieegan3 View Post
Yes I know but the max is 512mb which is reach at 8gb, not 16gb of ram.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost...58&postcount=2

Please folks do the research...

from your link "the more ram you have the more vram you get. Apple limits the hd4000 to 512MB which is reached at 8gb."

so what does 16 do if the 4000 is limited at 512? discrete is aloud to use more?
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 08:48 AM   #28
charlieegan3
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Originally Posted by JeffiJers View Post
from your link "the more ram you have the more vram you get. Apple limits the hd4000 to 512MB which is reached at 8gb."

so what does 16 do if the 4000 is limited at 512? discrete is aloud to use more?
No it just stops at 512mb, that is the max amount it seems. 8gb will be more than enough.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 09:52 AM   #29
bill-p
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charlieegan3 View Post
Yes I know but the max is 512mb which is reach at 8gb, not 16gb of ram.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost...58&postcount=2

Please folks do the research...
I think you're misunderstanding something here.

I wasn't talking about VRAM all this time. I was talking about RAM. Retina-ready apps use up more RAM in order to cache interface graphics.

And the CPU also uses up more RAM to do interface scaling.

Both of those have almost nothing to do with VRAM.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 10:38 AM   #30
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I don't think so. All graphics are being stored in the Vram and alle temporary datas which are being processed by the cpu like integers are being stored in the ram (or cache). The images and all the pixels are being processed by the gpu. And therefore all graphics need to be stored in the vram.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:37 AM   #31
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To the op, must it be a macbook pro? Have you considered the Macbook Air?
Me personally i would go for the 13" MBA with 8gb ram... But thats just me
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:50 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by nill1234 View Post
I don't think so. All graphics are being stored in the Vram and alle temporary datas which are being processed by the cpu like integers are being stored in the ram (or cache). The images and all the pixels are being processed by the gpu. And therefore all graphics need to be stored in the vram.
Not every graphics asset is stored within video RAM.

If that was the case, you'd need 3-4GB VRAM just to run Photoshop.

No... certain graphics that are not displayed on the screen are stored inside RAM as cache. They can be pushed to the GPU when they need to be displayed. Caching in RAM also reduces the overhead of having to read the graphics from storage again. Retina graphics assets are 4x bigger than regular assets in raw size, so RAM used for caching is also blown up proportionately.

Also on the Retina MacBooks, certain resolutions are upscaled to a virtual framebuffer before being downscaled to fit the native screen resolution. The upscale part can only be done on the CPU since there is no hardware processor made to do the task. The downscale part may then be done on the GPU later, but for what it's worth, the upscale process done on the CPU still takes up some amount of RAM on top of whatever RAM is taken up by caching.

Bottom line: Retina MacBooks use up more RAM to do the same tasks. If you don't believe me, just ask any Retina owner.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 04:44 PM   #33
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How much do you really love the Retina Display? I've used Retina MacBooks at school and with pixel doubling, I barely notice at all. Plus, when using as a desktop replacement, my keyboard/mouse and monitor take over the experience anyway.

The problem I have is that the SSD on the 13" Retina is way too small. It's 128GB that would fill up especially fast if you're using it for Virtual Machines and as a desktop replacement.

I say go with a fully specced Classic MacBook Pro. Buy the i7 version, a 16GB DDR3 kit from Newegg ($60) and a 256GB Vertex 4 OCZ SSD ($200 or so). With the remaining money left over from the 13" MBP purchase, pick up an iPad and you'll be REALLY set.

By the way, I have a MBP 13 and I love it. I love being able to upgrade the ram/hard drive and most of the components myself. The issue with the Retina 13" and 15" is that you cannot upgrade. What you get from the store is what you're stuck with.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 05:24 PM   #34
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^^ Agreed. I lug my 15" around weekly (I travel too much for work) and it's a piece of cake.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 08:33 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by JeffiJers View Post
Early Xmas present from the woman, wont see her over the holidays.

Apple Gift card worth 1450$

Student priced Retina 13 or 15?

As much as i dislike the value of the 13, i dont have any complaints about the base model. I dont keep large amounts of media on any computer (NAS/external)

Travel a lot, always on the go weather it be for business or grad school.

Would be my desktop replacement.

Main uses; VM windows for accounting and small data base programs.
Chrome, minor web development, minor photoshop (could change fast if i pull the trigger on a D600).


13inch would nto cost much out of pocket, 150-200? (like that it was just released, no replacement anytime soon)
15inch would be bigger and a lot more powerful but cost near 600$ out of pocket. (will i be pissed they release a new one come 3 months from now?)

Would be base model. no need for upgrades with my use as of now.

Would possibly get a thunderbolt display down the road.


sorry i know these threads come along all the time but hey how else would we spend our time on this forum! thanks.
rMBP 15". IMO it's a much better value for the money vs. the 13" Air (i7/256gb/8gb ram) or 13" rMBP. You mentioned grad school, so with the student discount, the price difference with both 13's become even smaller.

I find the 15" rMBP to be incredibly portable. It weighs slightly less than a 13" MBP, which many carry around daily.

With the student discount.....

rMBP 15” - $1999
i7 Quad Core
8GB Ram
256GB flash storage
Intel HD Graphics 4000
NIVIDIA 650m with 1GB
7hr battery life

rMBP 13” - $1899
i5 Dual Core
8GB Ram
256GB flash storage
Intel HD Graphics 4000
7hr battery life

With the i7 the 13” rMBP is $2079 (More expensive than the 15”!)

MB Air 13” - $1539
i5 Dual Core (ULV processor)
8GB Ram
256 flash storage
Intel HD Graphics 4000
7hr battery life

With the i7 (ULV) the 13” MBA is $1629
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Old Dec 24, 2012, 10:16 AM   #36
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little update,

Spent some time in the apple store on a bunch of mac books.

I have more or less ruled out the Retina 13, for the price i dont feel its worth it. Pulled up a thread of pictures (every post) and it really lagged scrolling through them where as the 15 did not.

replaced my want of a 13R to the MBA i5/8/256

or man up and get the 15R

I am afraid i wont want to bring the bigger 15inch with me everywhere or it might get in the way (otherwise love everything about it)

Feel like the 13Air is great all around. (i think the screen is fine) Good value too, but for the times i am using it at my desk at work it might be a bit small.


This is more of a personal preference now. never been so stuck on a decision before.
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Old Dec 24, 2012, 11:53 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffiJers View Post
little update,

Spent some time in the apple store on a bunch of mac books.

I have more or less ruled out the Retina 13, for the price i dont feel its worth it. Pulled up a thread of pictures (every post) and it really lagged scrolling through them where as the 15 did not.

replaced my want of a 13R to the MBA i5/8/256

or man up and get the 15R

I am afraid i wont want to bring the bigger 15inch with me everywhere or it might get in the way (otherwise love everything about it)

Feel like the 13Air is great all around. (i think the screen is fine) Good value too, but for the times i am using it at my desk at work it might be a bit small.


This is more of a personal preference now. never been so stuck on a decision before.
The air definitely isn't shabby at all. If it suits your needs, get it. If I had a free $1400 towards a computer, I would surely get the best though. No reason not to. Either way though, I think you will be happy with the MBA or the pro.
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