Worth Ave Group & snatched iPhone

[shenan1982]

Originally Posted by cwheatley

No bragging, just an offer of assistance. If you have any questions or issues yourself, I would be more than willing to hear you out. Again, PM please.

The terms and conditions are not confusing in the least and nothing you could say would supersede them.

[cwheatley]

Originally Posted by shenan1982

The terms and conditions are not confusing in the least and nothing you could say would supersede them.

I would be much more comfortable discussing this over PM, as I've said twice... anyway... I will say that most of WAG's customers find their policies very straight-forward and easy to understand. I would never claim the ability to supersede the terms and conditions of their policies, however I could point you in the direction of someone who could answer any questions you may have about them. I can also personally attest to parts of their operations, but that's something I will only discuss over PM.

[shenan1982]

Originally Posted by cwheatley

I would be much more comfortable discussing this over PM, as I've said twice... anyway... I will say that most of WAG's customers find their policies very straight-forward and easy to understand. I would never claim the ability to supersede the terms and conditions of their policies, however I could point you in the direction of someone who could answer any questions you may have about them. I can also personally attest to parts of their operations, but that's something I will only discuss over PM.

I don't care about your personal opinions, nor for you to point me toward someone who can explain anything. I agree, their policies are very straight forward, they CLEARLY state they may cancel a policyholder after 1 claim, there's nothing less clear than that in their terms. Nothing you, nor anyone you could refer me to could say or do anything that would override their contract. You could give me the number of the CEO and if I call him and he tells me don't worry, he'll cover 4 claims... doesn't matter. The contract still supersedes that.

Bottom line is Worth Ave is a small fish in a big pond, and they clearly don't have their act together. Their marketing is shady to say the least, but they cover their butt in their terms by voiding the advertising claims. Just saying it's shady. I want nothing to do with them, and I'm sorry you work for or with or "associated with them" as hopefully you enjoy that. I have no further intention in discussing.

[stridemat]

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[WorthAveGroup]

My name is Aaron Cooper. I am the Director of Marketing for Worth Ave. Group.

I'm going to speak somewhat Frankly, because I have a difficult time with PC, "company line" types of responses. I hate them, and I'm sure you do too. I am speaking on behalf of the company, however they may rather I use a bit different tone.

I've been monitoring this post since the beginning because I like to keep up with the pulse of our target market and while it's apparently run its course for the most part, I feel the need to respond to some misinformation that is being spread by user "Shenan1982". I do not know if it is his or her agenda to defame Worth Ave. Group or spread misinformation about our reputation, our policies and procedures, or the fine print of our insurance policy, but I am going to address each and every statement that this person has made so that it will be clear to everyone reading.

First of all, they seem to be someone with an agenda, possibly in the employ of another competitor. That is irrelevant to the topic, however it is disheartening to see that someone would be so dead set against a company they have never dealt with that they would go to such lengths to spread misinformation as fact.


I have quoted the individual below however I am going to respond above the quotes with most of the information so that it is easily available here and then I will refer back to it after the quotes, or I might get lazy and just start responding after the quotes.

Our policy, on page 7 of the following link available on our website at: Insurance Policy, clearly states

No policy which has been in effect for sixty days or more will be canceled
by us except for one of the following reasons:
a) nonpayment of premium;
b) fraud or material misrepresentation made by you or with your
knowledge in obtaining the policy, or in presenting a claim under the
policy;
c) any insured violating any of the terms and conditions of the policy; or
d) the risk originally accepted has substantially changed.
When cancellation is for nonpayment of premium, we will give at least 10 days’
written notice of cancellation accompanied by the reason for cancellation.


What does that mean?

It means that we absolutely will not cancel your policy for ANY other reason. I will go over each of the listed reasons individually:


a) nonpayment of premium;

Pretty straight forward. You failed to pay for your insurance.

b) fraud or material misrepresentation made by you or with your
knowledge in obtaining the policy, or in presenting a claim under the
policy;

Fraud. This happens A LOT, especially with our college student policy. Fraud is pretty straight forward. And in case said user wants to debate our leeway here, we do not have the ability simply to call something fraud and not pay and be done with it. There are lots of i's to dot and t's to cross and it's simply more work than it's worth to try and get out of paying a single claim in that manner. Quite frankly, we are in the business of taking care of our customers, not finding ways of getting out of paying them. But if you commit fraud, and we can prove it, we are not going to pay your claim, and we are going to cancel your policy. But hey, we're also going to refund your premium pro rated for the length of time you've had the policy of course.

c) any insured violating any of the terms and conditions of the policy; or

That's pretty self explanatory but the only reason I can think of that fits this item falls under fraud. There's surely a reason for it or it wouldn't be there, but I asked the claims manager and the owner of the company and we came to the same conclusion.

d) the risk originally accepted has substantially changed.

This does not apply to iphones, or ipads, or any of our individual policies really. You will find this in ANY "real" insurance policy. It would apply to our college plus policy, in that if you were insuring your college dorm room but then moved out into a different type of residence that no longer met the requirements of the policy. I can't think of anything for an example, because it has yet to have happened.

Originally Posted by shenan1982

I love how on their comparison, it says "Unlimited Claims" per 2 year policy period, yet when you actually read the policy, it states "Under certain circumstances, we may cancel a policy. This happens on rare occasions but an example of such is if you were to file multiple claims during one policy period"

To me, Worth Ave group is a scam. Even Apple Care gives you 2 for almost half the price.

I hate to hear that ANYONE would think we are a scam. However if I tell you that we are underwritten by Hanover, a multi billion dollar insurance company who has been around since Adam and Eve, and that we have an A+ BBB rating, and that we are the largest insurer of technology in the Education sector, and that our parent company has been doing business since 1971, and you still want to believe that we are a scam, well, I've pretty much done all that I can do. As long as my response prohibits others from believing the false accusations you have made against us, I'll sleep a little better.

Originally Posted by shenan1982

I dunno, I don't like a company who says "Unlimited Claims" on the advertisement, and then in the contract says "May be cancelled after 1 claim" ... to me there's got to be protection (so someone isn't using their phone as a frisbee), but to threaten cancellation after 1 claim is absurd when you're trying to compare yourself to AppleCare, who is up front in saying 2 claim limit, and Square which is a 4 claim limit.

They won't get my business with that language.

I've addressed this in detail above, but I'll also add here that we have not to my knowledge, EVER canceled a policy after one claim unless fraud was involved. I asked the owner if we have ever done that, and I asked the claims manager if we have ever done that. Both of them responded that we have never done that nor would we.

Trust me, it is not worth saving a few hundred dollars by canceling a claim when someone can simply go on the internet and tell their story to unlimited numbers of people. Look at this post alone. Who knows how many people will see only Shenan1982's first couple of responses and leave with a negative opinion about Worth Ave. Group that is COMPLETELY baseless and unfounded. I have enough trouble worrying about things like this. The last thing I want is a policy within our company that creates or promotes it. It doesn't happen, and it never will.

Originally Posted by shenan1982

Yeah, like you said they may cancel if you ... "get robbed five days in a week" which would be after 5, which to me would be excessive, or after... "the second time dropping from a bridge" which I'd say excessive. The point was if they said "excessive claims" or "may be dropped after multiple claims" it's different.

And you do realize that all of the other companies are directly or indirectly insurance companies as well, don't you? The bottom line is to say "UNLIMITED" then have the absolute minimum possibly claims "1" as the potential limit is shady. Not saying insurance companies aren't shady often, I'm just not putting MY money into someone doing business that way.

Not only will we NOT CANCEL you after multiple claims, unless there is fraud that we can prove, we aren't going to cancel you at all. Will we allow you to renew your policy after 5 questionable claims in one year? THAT is a different story, but we aren't going to cancel you.

Originally Posted by shenan1982

You're missing the whole point here... first, your home insurance is likely "____ Fire And Casualty" hence the casualty (loss event) part. Of course it covers your items when they're in transit, and the reason they use that terminology is because when you transfer the chain of custody to someone else (ie put it in self storage, or put it in another home, say a weekend cabin, or at work), it's expected that those locations would then also have insurance that would accept responsibility for things happening on their property.

The bottom line is the advertising here. They're trying to say "Look, here's why we're better, we have unlimited claims" and them, the absolutely no-name company, goes and puts in their FAQ's (not even buried in their terms) that they may cancel you after 1 claim.

Why would ANYONE in their right mind go into a contract that gives them such leeway to get screwed? So you go buy a gift card for Starbucks for $100, and then you go to use it, buy a drink, then go back the second day, and they say sorry, the sign says "we may limit you to one drink for the price you paid for the card" ... well technically they're in the right contractually, but from a sales and marketing standpoint that'd be unethical, and likely illegal.

And my guess is the "Worth Ave Group" is not an actual registered insurance company, but rather just an extended warranty company, which is how they can get away with that.

Well I have explained this in regards to us, but let me say that ALL of our competition has limits in place just the same, but some of them take it much, much further.

We are REAL insurance. Our policy absolutely allows unlimited claims. Apple Care+ and SquareTrade are not insurance. They are a warranty, with limits. X number of repairs or unlimited repairs up to x dollar amount, or x number of replacements. (1 replacement with SquareTrade. I think AppleCare+ has 2 but don't hold me to that) They also do not cover theft. I am not knocking either of those products, because they offer something quite different than we do. We do not cover manufacturer defects and they do not cover theft, peripherals, don't have unlimited claims, etc. and we are going to send you a check for replacement. They are going to hand you a refurbished, like model item.

Originally Posted by shenan1982

Well it does say in the first FAQ that they may cancel the policy after one claim. So anything that someone would tell me via email or phone would not supersede the contract which says they may cancel the policy after 1 claim.

You are correct. Nothing I can say can supersede the contract. I pointed out the above reference on page 7 which you can again refer to that states that while we CAN cancel after one claim, we can ONLY cancel for the listed reasons (see: Fraud)

Originally Posted by shenan1982

Pardon me if I laugh out loud at that. Sorry for you. I wouldn't brag about that.

I don't have any idea who this person is...I'm guessing a repair tech at one of our partner repair depots such as iResQ. I stated my position at Worth Ave. Group, and while I'm not going to brag about it, I can't imagine a better job at a better company doing what I do.

Originally Posted by shenan1982

I don't care about your personal opinions, nor for you to point me toward someone who can explain anything. I agree, their policies are very straight forward, they CLEARLY state they may cancel a policyholder after 1 claim, there's nothing less clear than that in their terms. Nothing you, nor anyone you could refer me to could say or do anything that would override their contract. You could give me the number of the CEO and if I call him and he tells me don't worry, he'll cover 4 claims... doesn't matter. The contract still supersedes that.

Bottom line is Worth Ave is a small fish in a big pond, and they clearly don't have their act together. Their marketing is shady to say the least, but they cover their butt in their terms by voiding the advertising claims. Just saying it's shady. I want nothing to do with them, and I'm sorry you work for or with or "associated with them" as hopefully you enjoy that. I have no further intention in discussing.

Worth Ave. Group is certainly not a small fish, but it is most definitely a very big pond. I said it above but I will say it again, nobody insures more technology in the education space than Worth Ave. Group. That is the case now, and it will be the case forever if I have my way. I'm not sure what you constitute as having our act together, so I'll just refer you to the BBB to check our rating.

We are fair. We are honest. We definitely do not employ "shady" marketing techniques. I know, because I'm the guy in charge of every aspect of marketing.

I can assure you that we go above and beyond to try and provide the absolute best service we can to EVERY single customer. Why? Because they matter, and they have a voice and an opinion, and I have an iPhone and an iPad and a Macbook, and my kids have them, etc. I know how bad it sucks to get one broken or stolen or to have to go without one. We have an amazing product that is a great value and in my opinion we are the best at what we do and we will continue to evolve and improve and to be quite honest, because of the value we provide, our competition will continue to evolve and improve and in the end, the consumer wins.

I'm not sure if I addressed all of the concerns in this thread, or if anyone really cares what I have to say, however I care enough about the company I work for and its reputation to come here and respond to these accusations.

Some might say, they MUST be a small fish if the Director of Marketing is coming here himself and replying to the opinion of one guy on the internet. Maybe...or maybe I'm just passionate about the what we do and the reputation of our brand.

That's the crazy thing about the internet. Imagine what kind of negative impact the "United Breaks Guitars" guy and his Youtube video had on United Airlines. They didn't respond to his claims and blew him off. Then he made his video and more than got their attention and now, when I fly, I still think about that. It was catchy for sure, and he conveyed his message. They broke his guitar and neither tried nor cared to make it right. I try and fly Southwest as much as possible, but I digress.

This isn't the same as that, because that guy had a valid claim and musical talent, and this is one anonymous person with a keyboard and no substance, but people tend to believe what they read in email forwards and on facebook so at some point there has to be a response. I guess this was that point.

If you would like a personal response from me, you can call my office number at 800 620 2885 Ext 7917 or email me at my first name at worthavegroup.com.

If you're at Macworld this week, stop by our both and say hi.