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Old Sep 8, 2013, 10:58 AM   #101
token787
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Originally Posted by Liquorpuki View Post
$400-500 means it's a midrange phone. On top of that it's pretty expensive for midrange

For comparison, the Lumia 520, which is the hottest budget smartphone in India, retails for about $160. Midrange phones like the Galaxy Core and Lumia 625 sell for $300

Marketshare will swing a little, but that Android dominated budget market is not going anywhere

I have to strongly agree, Android is dominating the phone market. I see more and more people talking and buying the Galaxy. In my opinion Apple need to do something fast! Apple coming out with colors, really? If people want colors they would just put a color case on the iphone, OMG! That price for that iphone is not cheap.
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Old Sep 8, 2013, 12:01 PM   #102
GuitarDTO
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Originally Posted by nikaru View Post
Ok, why do you need larger screen? To see more content? What miss you in the 4 inch format? You watch movies maybe? Do you have problems with typing messeges or making calls? Do you have problems with the readability of the display?

Seriously, I respect your opinion, but Im sick of people asking the same thing over and over again. Some people want 4 inch display and other a bigger display. Apple offer what they think is the best. Its their job, not yours. If you dont like it, dont buy it. I do want 19 inch iMac and 17 inch Macbook Pro with retina but I dont cry in the forums about it.

The iPhone has 4 inch display, period. If Apple think that is the best for mi as a consumer, I respect that, because as I said, its their job to know what is the best for me.
Wow. I'm going to paraphrase your last statement. "its their job to know what is the best for me". What you actually just said is "whatever they release, I'm going to believe its best for me because they said so, even if it isn't the best for me".

In any regard, I'm glad we agree. If I don't like it, I won't buy it. If they aren't going to give consumers the choice of a larger screen, then they aren't offering what I believe is best for me. I would like them to, because I like everything else the iPhone offers, particularly the ecosystem...., but at this point I believe phones like the Note 2/3 are bringing functionality that people want more and more each day.

Don't get your feelings hurt, it's just a phone kid.
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Old Sep 8, 2013, 12:04 PM   #103
harlemexplosion
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Originally Posted by Ryth View Post
...and one of the last strongholds/strangleholds of Android is about to fall.

Folks...the marketshare % is about to take a drastic swing worldwide.

It already had shifted in the US when T-Mobile finally got the iPhone 5 in the spring leaving Android in the USA no place to hide.

With the iPhone appearing on more and more carriers where Android has had exclusivity is going to bring their % tumbling down.

Can't wait for the analysts to try to spin this one.
It will take more than that to take over China. Remember that Xiaomi dominates there, and it is cheap and more powerful than many contemporary Androids. Plus, it is a local brand. People won't simply jump right on Apple just because of one major carrier.
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Old Sep 8, 2013, 01:08 PM   #104
nikaru
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Originally Posted by GuitarDTO View Post
Wow. I'm going to paraphrase your last statement. "its their job to know what is the best for me". What you actually just said is "whatever they release, I'm going to believe its best for me because they said so, even if it isn't the best for me".

In any regard, I'm glad we agree. If I don't like it, I won't buy it. If they aren't going to give consumers the choice of a larger screen, then they aren't offering what I believe is best for me. I would like them to, because I like everything else the iPhone offers, particularly the ecosystem...., but at this point I believe phones like the Note 2/3 are bringing functionality that people want more and more each day.

Don't get your feelings hurt, it's just a phone kid.
Seems you understand my words but not the meaning.

Apple is 400 bilion worth company. They have designers and engineers who work 14 hours a day and its their job to understand your needs and to offer you the best product. Ofcourse there are other companies, so its not like you dont have a choice. And then its you, someone who dont have a clue about design, funcionality and technology (or maybe you have, dont know) come to this people and say to them they are all wrong and that the display should be bigger.

Did someone ask for the iPhone in the first place? Did someone asked about the iPad in 2010? No, nobody. Apple found by themself, what you need and they did it without lisenting your needs. Because it was their job, not yours.

Its your job to decide wheter to buy it or not. Hate it or love it, but not tring to "fix" it, because you can only make it worst about other people.

And im not a kid.
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Old Sep 8, 2013, 01:39 PM   #105
GuitarDTO
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Originally Posted by nikaru View Post
Seems you understand my words but not the meaning.

Apple is 400 bilion worth company. They have designers and engineers who work 14 hours a day and its their job to understand your needs and to offer you the best product. Ofcourse there are other companies, so its not like you dont have a choice. And then its you, someone who dont have a clue about design, funcionality and technology (or maybe you have, dont know) come to this people and say to them they are all wrong and that the display should be bigger.

Did someone ask for the iPhone in the first place? Did someone asked about the iPad in 2010? No, nobody. Apple found by themself, what you need and they did it without lisenting your needs. Because it was their job, not yours.

Its your job to decide wheter to buy it or not.

And im not a kid.
You are correct again, I don't understand your meaning because you aren't communicating it well and you are contradicting your own points. You state that it's all Apple's engineers job to understand "my needs", but that they "did it without listening to my needs" in products like the iPhone or iPad.

What you don't seem to understand is that any product starts with a set of requirements that are defined based on market research into what the customer will want, within the limits of technology that exists or will exist. You imply Apple just defines those requirements because they magically "know best" without listening to the customer, but you've got it completely reversed, they define the requirements based on exhaustive research and systematic processes to define what features are most important to the people they intend to sell the product to. They did this with the original iPhone, iPad and every other product.....and while great products, as technology improves and consumer preferences change, the system engineering side of keeping up with the consumer remains one of the most important aspects. Preferences change, competitive companies typically identify these trends first either through trial and error or research, and others follow suit.

Dell is a great example of the link between the technology and customer needs with the original Dell Streak. They saw the desire for large screen devices, but the technology wasn't there yet and compromises were made in screen resolution, physical size of the device, etc.

The galaxy note 3 is a perfect example that Apple is keenly aware of the shift to larger phones. It's no coincidence that a single day after the announcement of the Note 3 the rumors were all back to the fact that larger iPhones are being tested. There is no question of "if" Apple will come out with a larger phone, but when...and the reason for that is people are spending their hard earned money on larger phones such as the Note instead of the iPhone.

For the record, I am a mechanical design engineer, and have conducted several QFD trade studies in my career to better understand customer requirements and refine a design appropriately. So yes, maybe I do have a clue about design and functionality.
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Old Sep 8, 2013, 05:42 PM   #106
xofruitcake
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Originally Posted by token787 View Post
I have to strongly agree, Android is dominating the phone market. I see more and more people talking and buying the Galaxy. In my opinion Apple need to do something fast! Apple coming out with colors, really? If people want colors they would just put a color case on the iphone, OMG! That price for that iphone is not cheap.
heh heh, the question is what does dominating those low end smartphone market do to anyone? It does not look like those low end smartphone are being use for surfing the web or mobilecommerce. If we look at the data regarding commerce using mobile device, IOS has major lead. And the low end smartphone does not make any money for the manufacturer either.

My 2 cents is taht low end smartphone is a waste land right now as it become a replacement for feature phone with camera, down load for movie (free/pirated cheap entertainment), free music etc. But it is not being used as a mobile device with user paying major buck for the data service. Think of it this way, if someone pay 100-200 for a no contract mobile phone, would he/she be willing to spend $100-200 dollars a month on their data plan? Would they be willing to spend $50 on their data plan? The reality is that if someone is spending so little on their smartphone, they would be spending majority of time on their Wifi and not buying much of anything anyway.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by harlemexplosion View Post
It will take more than that to take over China. Remember that Xiaomi dominates there, and it is cheap and more powerful than many contemporary Androids. Plus, it is a local brand. People won't simply jump right on Apple just because of one major carrier.
Why would Apple need to take over China? All it want is to take over the most profitable segment (may be the top 20 to 30% of the market there). The low end market has no profit margin in it for either the manufacturer or software developer. If someone is buying a $100-200 unlocked smartphone, they are not going to spend tons of money to customize them (buying apps), or spending much money buying stuff online.

A lot of these low cost Chinese phone has problem with patents (i.e. they don't license all the necessary patents), they are able to sell it in China because the government won't enforce patent laws. But if they want to export those phone into the developed countries, the have to start licensing all the appropriate patents and avoiding patent infringment. It bring price of their phones in parity to the other manufacturer like LG, Samsung, Apple, HTC. Microsoft will be the winner for this patent royalty stream as they has been able to collect anywhere between 15-30 a smartphone of patent payment from those that signed licensing agreement with them. And the rest are having court date with Microsoft legal..
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Old Sep 8, 2013, 06:04 PM   #107
Aeribis
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Originally Posted by topper24hours View Post
iPhone 5S will likely be $650. If the 5C comes in at $450, that is (wait for it...) $200 less! If you don't think that a $200 price difference to somebody that makes $900/month is significant.. I'm sorry for your lack of world perspective.
I would like to point out that the iPhone 5c is rumored to be an avenue to break into a larger but more cost conscious Chinese market... It is not that I lack world perspective. I am simply pointing out the fact that the iPhone 5c, may come at a lower cost, however the cost will be marginal for most USA consumers and will probably lack the discount needed to break into more cost driven consumer segments.

P.S. Please refrain from resorting to personal attacks on the web instead of the point of the discussion especially when you have no idea what the other persons background is... Thanks for the discussion!

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by GuitarDTO View Post
You are correct again, I don't understand your meaning because you aren't communicating it well and you are contradicting your own points. You state that it's all Apple's engineers job to understand "my needs", but that they "did it without listening to my needs" in products like the iPhone or iPad.

What you don't seem to understand is that any product starts with a set of requirements that are defined based on market research into what the customer will want, within the limits of technology that exists or will exist. You imply Apple just defines those requirements because they magically "know best" without listening to the customer, but you've got it completely reversed, they define the requirements based on exhaustive research and systematic processes to define what features are most important to the people they intend to sell the product to. They did this with the original iPhone, iPad and every other product.....and while great products, as technology improves and consumer preferences change, the system engineering side of keeping up with the consumer remains one of the most important aspects. Preferences change, competitive companies typically identify these trends first either through trial and error or research, and others follow suit.

Dell is a great example of the link between the technology and customer needs with the original Dell Streak. They saw the desire for large screen devices, but the technology wasn't there yet and compromises were made in screen resolution, physical size of the device, etc.

The galaxy note 3 is a perfect example that Apple is keenly aware of the shift to larger phones. It's no coincidence that a single day after the announcement of the Note 3 the rumors were all back to the fact that larger iPhones are being tested. There is no question of "if" Apple will come out with a larger phone, but when...and the reason for that is people are spending their hard earned money on larger phones such as the Note instead of the iPhone.

For the record, I am a mechanical design engineer, and have conducted several QFD trade studies in my career to better understand customer requirements and refine a design appropriately. So yes, maybe I do have a clue about design and functionality.
Well put from someone who understands hardware/software design life cycles!
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Old Sep 8, 2013, 08:21 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by Aeribis View Post
I would like to point out that the iPhone 5c is rumored to be an avenue to break into a larger but more cost conscious Chinese market... It is not that I lack world perspective. I am simply pointing out the fact that the iPhone 5c, may come at a lower cost, however the cost will be marginal for most USA consumers and will probably lack the discount needed to break into more cost driven consumer segments.

P.S. Please refrain from resorting to personal attacks on the web instead of the point of the discussion especially when you have no idea what the other persons background is... Thanks for the discussion!

----------



Well put from someone who understands hardware/software design life cycles!
Ok, maybe you just don't understand enonomics... my bad.
$200 is significant in China AND in the USA.
Especially, if (after subsidy) 5S comes in at $200 & 5C comes in FREE! That would make it the one that parents buy for kids and the one old people and first time smartphone buyers choose.
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Old Sep 9, 2013, 08:23 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by FreudianSlap View Post
No you're not, I think it's looks a hell of a lot better than the 5 or 5s. Perhaps not in one of the brighter colours. Pure white would be nice.
I dunno. The bright colors seem fun. I liked the colors of the clamshell ibooks when they came out, lime, tangerine etc. and those desktop macs before that with the colors. It's okay to have something playful in a smartphone, maybe high time for it.
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Old Sep 10, 2013, 10:37 AM   #110
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Just hope they keep selling iPhone5.
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