The New Structure

[Calidude]

Originally Posted by Comeagain?

Are you saying that it was a bad idea to report Apple news and demo a new Apple product?

Absolutely not. I'm saying simply that the reason the Alternatives forum was created was because of a sour change in popular opinion about the iPhone and iOS, which resulted from Apple's lackluster iOS6 featureset and the lack of a wider screen in the iPhone's leaked casings.

There's always been negative attitudes toward the iPhone, but this was the first time that MANY long-time Macrumors users were discontented with the iPhone and have openly discussed alternatives in such a big way here. We didn't get an influx of signups for people looking to troll, we just got a big change in opinion among many users BECAUSE of recent developments, and the Alternatives forum was created to house those negative opinions.

[dejo]

Originally Posted by Calidude

Which resulted from the evidence being shown that the iPhone would have a taller screen and accelerated when iOS6 was shown off.

I think you're trying to make up some correlation that just doesn't exist. But if you want to believe that, I guess there's nothing I can do about it.

[annk]

Originally Posted by Calidude

...we just got a big change in opinion among many users BECAUSE of recent developments, and the Alternatives forum was created to house those negative opinions.

The Alternatives forum was created as the result of a discussion among mods, admins, and arn, where various things were taken into consideration. Here are just a few examples:

• The feedback discussion in Site and Forum Feedback
• The increasing traffic to the iPhone sub-forum
• Consistent problems with members posting off-topic comments in legitimate discussions of competitors' products.

The timing was a result of the length of time necessary for us to complete our discussion across various time zones all over the world, and - once the decision was made and all details agreed upon - when I personally had the time to make the technical changes.

The forum was not created to house negative opinions or because people are "fed up with the iPhone". It was created to give those who want to discuss the competition a place to do so where they'll hopefully be left alone by members who aren't interested in those topics, and to ease the burden a bit in the iPhone sub-forum.

You can read all you want into the timing and reason behind the new sub-forum, but it was really as simple as that.

[Sir Ruben]

Originally Posted by Calidude

Absolutely not. I'm saying simply that the reason the Alternatives forum was created was because of a sour change in popular opinion about the iPhone and iOS, which resulted from Apple's lackluster iOS6 featureset and the lack of a wider screen in the iPhone's leaked casings.

There's always been negative attitudes toward the iPhone, but this was the first time that MANY long-time Macrumors users were discontented with the iPhone and have openly discussed alternatives in such a big way here. We didn't get an influx of signups for people looking to troll, we just got a big change in opinion among many users BECAUSE of recent developments, and the Alternatives forum was created to house those negative opinions.

If what you are suggesting is correct, then why are there so few people in the newly created sub forum? Most of the threads in the iPhone forum now are perfectly normal topics of conversation.

No the trolls were having a field day and the sub forum ruined the fun for them. If there is such discontentment with the iPhone then the sub forum should be packed full of people which simply isn't the case.

[smithrh]

Originally Posted by Sir Ruben

If what you are suggesting is correct, then why are there so few people in the newly created sub forum?

Looks like I need to break down the distribution again, some people are a bit slow on the uptake:

iOS: 630 viewing
iPhone: 1402 viewing
iPad: 475 viewing
iPod touch: 128 viewing
iPod: 71 viewing
Alternatives: 15 viewing

One very interesting point is that this distribution has held steady - people reading this site continue not to care one whit about the "alternatives."

Originally Posted by Sir Ruben

No the trolls were having a field day and the sub forum ruined the fun for them. If there is such discontentment with the iPhone then the sub forum should be packed full of people which simply isn't the case.

You know, I suppose that it should have been realized that at some point one of the trolls would squeal when they realized what the new organization of topics meant for their audience. Now that I think of it, it took longer than I would have expected, which means I've been over-estimating them.

My bad, I'll adjust...

[annk]

Originally Posted by smithrh

One very interesting point is that this distribution has held steady - people reading this site continue not to care one whit about the "alternatives."

Another very interesting point is that now the people who genuinely like to discuss competing products can do so in peace, without off-topic trolling.

As someone who enjoys following those discussions, I'm very happy about this.

[Hellhammer]

Originally Posted by smithrh

One very interesting point is that this distribution has held steady - people reading this site continue not to care one whit about the "alternatives."

I don't think anyone expected the alternatives forum to be as popular as iPhone forums. The amount of views isn't the only thing that matters, the amount of posts is more important. Judging from a quick look, there's a decent amount of active threads in the alternatives forum, which means it has a purpose.

I would like to emphasize that this is more or less an experiment. If the alternatives forum becomes dead quiet, then we may remove it.

[smithrh]

Originally Posted by Hellhammer

I don't think anyone expected the alternatives forum to be as popular as iPhone forums. The amount of views isn't the only thing that matters, the amount of posts is more important. Judging from a quick look, there's a decent amount of active threads in the alternatives forum, which means it has a purpose.

Exactly right. All I have are the "viewing" numbers - I don't have access to data on how many times threads/posts are actually "read."

However, at some point, there's certainly a proxy relationship between the number of viewers and the number of reads.

There's a different problem at play if you get a mismatch between posting activity being high and the reading activity being low - then it has become a write-only media.

But I'm sure you guys have some benchmarks as to post/read activity that makes sense for a given topic, so you'll be able to judge the worthiness of having the sub-forum.

Again - I'm not at all against having it. In fact, I worked for a long time at a company that made Android/Droid devices. What I never liked was the ability for a minority viewpoint to pollute and vandalize a vastly larger conversation. I view what was done as the perfect solution.

[TB07-NJ]

Originally Posted by utahman130

Don't like the iOS hacks category. I think there needs to be separate categories for iPad, iPhone, and iPod touch because they are such different devices. It is going to be too overcrowded IMO.

Absolutely. Now it's a mish-mosh mess of "what belongs to what." Yes, people should use tags but it's not going to happen. At the least there should be subboards for each device, at most, go back like it was.

[annk]

Originally Posted by TB07-NJ

...Yes, people should use tags but it's not going to happen...

It's disappointing that members aren't always willing to take the time to add a prefix, which is in everyone's interest, but I suppose that's just the way it is.

Prefixes are now required in the iOS Hacks sub-forum, and we've added a "General" tag for threads that can apply to more than one device. Let's see if that adds some order.