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Old Jul 4, 2013, 10:56 AM   #126
GermanyChris
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I dont much think the Egyptian Third Army cared if they were surrounded by 105mm's from Merkava's or M1A's... just how fast can we give up to the Israelis, not the U.S....
You're actual events with perceived events and outcome. The Israelis could take on the entirety of the mid east and win. But they need to do it mostly alone so people see it. If I were king they'd do it without US weapons.
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Old Jul 4, 2013, 11:24 AM   #127
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You're actual events with perceived events and outcome. The Israelis could take on the entirety of the mid east and win. But they need to do it mostly alone so people see it. If I were king they'd do it without US weapons.
Again until October 1973 they did ...



1948 Arab–Israeli War
Reprisal operations (1950s - 1960s) -.
Suez Crisis (October 1956) -
Six-Day War (June 1967) -
War of Attrition (1967–1970) -
Yom Kippur War (October 1973) -

Not a Made in USA anywhere to be found...Plenty of Made in CCP tho..Those pesky jews....
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Old Jul 4, 2013, 11:29 AM   #128
GermanyChris
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Again until October 1973 they did ...



1948 Arab–Israeli War
Reprisal operations (1950s - 1960s) -.
Suez Crisis (October 1956) -
Six-Day War (June 1967) -
War of Attrition (1967–1970) -
Yom Kippur War (October 1973) -

Not a Made in USA anywhere to be found...Plenty of Made in CCP tho..Those pesky jews....
The IDF used then and uses now US aircraft..

Your intentionally missing the point in some vein effort to "prove" me wrong.

Another thing to keep in mind is the most recent conflict is 40 years ago thats not very real to a 20yo.
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Old Jul 4, 2013, 04:53 PM   #129
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The IDF used then and uses now US aircraft..

Your intentionally missing the point in some vein effort to "prove" me wrong.

Another thing to keep in mind is the most recent conflict is 40 years ago thats not very real to a 20yo.
Your right they use US made aircraft now...That certainly was not the case 20 years ago...The built their own aircraft, largly based on the stolen French planes of the Mirage...and of course captured/stolen MIg-21-23's...Today the internals of the F16I's largely built in Israel...
The actual most recent conflict goes on daily, very real to an Israeli 20 year old....Im not trying to prove you wrong at all, trying to show you your misconceptions, and perhaps you will follow it up with a good History of the Middle East..My suggestion(s) would be biased, but Oren Six Days of War is a masterpiece...The Israeli Airlift is another...
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Old Jul 4, 2013, 06:06 PM   #130
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The IDF used then and uses now US aircraft..
In 1948 they used Spitfires.
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Old Jul 4, 2013, 06:22 PM   #131
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In 1948 they used Spitfires.

As well as :

Avia S-199 1948
United States Boeing B-17 1948
United States Boeing F-15I 1998
United Kingdom Bristol Beaufighter

and a holy host of others..

I just didn't see the point...Nor was expecting a neutral response from you on the subject....
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Old Jul 4, 2013, 06:36 PM   #132
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Nor was expecting a neutral response from you on the subject....
Why would you?
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Old Jul 5, 2013, 12:00 AM   #133
GermanyChris
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Your right they use US made aircraft now...That certainly was not the case 20 years ago...The built their own aircraft, largly based on the stolen French planes of the Mirage...and of course captured/stolen MIg-21-23's...Today the internals of the F16I's largely built in Israel...
The actual most recent conflict goes on daily, very real to an Israeli 20 year old....Im not trying to prove you wrong at all, trying to show you your misconceptions, and perhaps you will follow it up with a good History of the Middle East..My suggestion(s) would be biased, but Oren Six Days of War is a masterpiece...The Israeli Airlift is another...
they used various versions of the f4 for all the wars you listed. They currently use F16's (current as of 2011 when I last had contact with IDF types)

You still haven't figured out yet that we're talking two different things.
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Old Jul 20, 2013, 10:33 AM   #134
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This part is true and I know this for a fact. If one day one was walking down a street and was attacked by Gangsters one would have no choice but to fight back and if there were no police around to help ...
I disagree with this analogy, because in the world of international politics there are no 'police'. Though there may be nations that call themselves 'Police' - in reality everybody on the street is a potential 'gangster' and the only help available are from the onlookers... gangsters or otherwise.
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I am quite sure that none of the Syrians wanted any extremists or Jihadists fighting among them or want them in their country...
I would agree that the majority of Syrians didn't want extremist Islamic fighters, but there were obviously enough Syrians who did to make their involvement possible. I think that the extremists also cloak their views behind other less extremist (and in fact laudable) activities. For instance the terrorist Hamas in Gaza is popular with the people because it also maintains a large charitable organization. I would not be surprised if the jihadists in Syria were also giving away bread, along with their militant preachings.
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... but as their people got butchered by their regime they had no choice but to turn to the bad guys for help as the good guys just sat there and watched with a blind eye turned to all the butchering that was taking place. Karma will catch up for those that turned a blind eye to this.
Absolutely agree.
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The Russians clearly and deep in their hearts know that what they are doing is wrong but they have learned from the Americans...
Ah, but who did the Americans learn it from?
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as this is exactly what the Americans did when the Israelis were at war with the Palestinians and Lebanese. ...
Two entirely different situations. Syria is in the middle of Civil War where a small and privileged minority who were not elected democratically are at war to maintain their power over the nation.

But I agree with the main thrust of your argument, I believe. It is the ordinary citizens who are paying the price for the machinations of the large powers. The sacrificial pawns in a bloody game of geopolitical chess.
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