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Old May 5, 2013, 06:06 AM   #101
Rogifan
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Originally Posted by ericinboston View Post

On a side note, iOS is not broken and nor does it need a complete overhaul. If Apple would just add more functionality (that I've listed on this site) such as many of the features Jailbroken iPhones, there probably wouldn't be as many complaints about iOS being old. The look and feel of iOS is just great...let's add all the missing features.
So basically if Apple does what you think is important (and doesn't focus on things you think are "just great") than they're not doomed. Ok got it.
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Old Apr 3, 2014, 08:42 AM   #102
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So here we are, almost 2 FULL years later from my original post...what has Apple produced that is earth shattering or innovating? Please don't say the Mac Pro that practically nobody/no consumer can afford while Apple manufacturers 1000/week to make you wait 5-6 weeks for delivery.

For those of you quick to talk about stock price, Apple's price has been a rollercoaster for the past 2 years.

For those of you also quick to say I'm bashing Apple...I'm not. I'm merely looking for your thoughts on why Apple hasn't innovated in years and what you might think is around the corner. You are welcome to re-read my original post and ponder how relevant & accurate it is after 2 years.
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Old Apr 3, 2014, 09:41 AM   #103
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There has been a number of discussions over Apple's innovation, Tim Cook's promise the past couple of years about new products (but not much to show for those promises) and apple's competition rolling stuff out

Here's my $.02 on the top.
First many people say you cannot schedule innovation and R&D budgets have no bearing on innovation. There's some validity to those comments but by the same token we have Samsung, Google, Microsoft and Amazon rolling out multiple products (some are a hit some are not) but nothing from Apple.

We don't know what's in the pipeline for apple, but if its just a larger iPhone and a few bells and whistles in iOS8, I'll be sourly disappointed.

I disagree with you over the Mac Pro, that is in fact innovative, its immaterial to say it shouldn't be considered because its so expensive. Its a radical new design that has caused a lot of talk. Whether its something that professionals find useful is a different topic.

Overall, Apple has had some great successes but we've not really seen much from them since the iPad. They've made their phones, iPads and computers thinner but I don't consider that innovative.

Siri on paper seemed like a great product but execution has fallen short where as Google (and now possibly MS) has a superior product.
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Old Apr 3, 2014, 02:43 PM   #104
ericinboston
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Originally Posted by maflynn View Post
I disagree with you over the Mac Pro, that is in fact innovative, its immaterial to say it shouldn't be considered because its so expensive. Its a radical new design that has caused a lot of talk. Whether its something that professionals find useful is a different topic.
I agree with your entire reply except for the above point...I am not stating that the Mac Pro is non-innovative due solely on its price...I'm saying it's non-innovative due to all of the below factors:

1)price...and starting price for that matter
2)the supply is extremely thin...Apple clearly knows that they are selling thousands a Quarter...not hundreds of thousands a Quarter like other Macs...but to make Prosumers wait 5-6+ weeks is INSANE!
3)the Mac Pro has been around for quite awhile...this is just a refresh with a new shape. Big deal. That doesn't qualifiy as innovative. Some new technology in it?...sure...but that happens to every computer line every few years. Apple products are all about technology.
4)similar to #3, this is not a new product...it's not even a new line or spin-off (like the iPad Mini was from the iPad)...Apple, as a company, is not impressing me, in general, with their lack of innovation and new products over the past several years.
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Old Apr 3, 2014, 03:00 PM   #105
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Originally Posted by ericinboston View Post
I agree with your entire reply except for the above point...I am not stating that the Mac Pro is non-innovative due solely on its price...I'm saying it's non-innovative due to all of the below factors:

1)price...and starting price for that matter
2)the supply is extremely thin...Apple clearly knows that they are selling thousands a Quarter...not hundreds of thousands a Quarter like other Macs...but to make Prosumers wait 5-6+ weeks is INSANE!
3)the Mac Pro has been around for quite awhile...this is just a refresh with a new shape. Big deal. That doesn't qualifiy as innovative. Some new technology in it?...sure...but that happens to every computer line every few years. Apple products are all about technology.
4)similar to #3, this is not a new product...it's not even a new line or spin-off (like the iPad Mini was from the iPad)...Apple, as a company, is not impressing me, in general, with their lack of innovation and new products over the past several years.
How about if you want to discuss "innovation", you give us a specific definition that you'd like to use? Because you've clearly made up a definition of your own that changes and adapts as you make different arguments.
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Old Apr 3, 2014, 03:10 PM   #106
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12 years ago when i had an ipaq, i dreamed of something like an iphone with wifi and cellular access

today i can't think of one product i want to have but isn't available. i don't think there is anything to innovate until we have another huge breakthrough in computer hardware
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Old Apr 3, 2014, 03:58 PM   #107
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Apple is a great company, no doubt. But it really feels like they're now a lumbering giant.

I'm sure lots of time is burned up building the new office and additional retail locations, but as a company they're losing excitement in the market. The collective awe of the marketplace is moving on due to Apple's inaction.

Outside of releasing new products, I wish they'd do anything to garner gossip/rumors/or excitement. Anything at all.
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Old Apr 3, 2014, 04:04 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by prizm View Post
Apple is a great company, no doubt. But it really feels like they're now a lumbering giant.

I'm sure lots of time is burned up building the new office and additional retail locations, but as a company they're losing excitement in the market. The collective awe of the marketplace is moving on due to Apple's inaction.

Outside of releasing new products, I wish they'd do anything to garner gossip/rumors/or excitement. Anything at all.
Sounds like you're projecting your own feelings onto the market as a whole.
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Old Apr 3, 2014, 04:16 PM   #109
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I was asking myself "who revived this pointless old thread?" and of course...it's the OP.

You know who hasn't released anything earth-shattering since 1886?

Coca-Cola.

Surprisingly, they seem to do alright.
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Old Apr 5, 2014, 08:22 AM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ericinboston View Post
So here we are, almost 2 FULL years later from my original post...what has Apple produced that is earth shattering or innovating? Please don't say the Mac Pro that practically nobody/no consumer can afford while Apple manufacturers 1000/week to make you wait 5-6 weeks for delivery.

For those of you quick to talk about stock price, Apple's price has been a rollercoaster for the past 2 years.

For those of you also quick to say I'm bashing Apple...I'm not. I'm merely looking for your thoughts on why Apple hasn't innovated in years and what you might think is around the corner. You are welcome to re-read my original post and ponder how relevant & accurate it is after 2 years.
Your original post is still accurate, however what has any company produced to really redefine or create a consumer needs category in this time frame? Samsung, Nokia, Google - they've all done the exact same things as Apple: updated, their cellphones/computers hardware/software annually and have tried create niche products that don't land. You'd likely have to go back to the Newton to find an Apple product that really bombed the way products bomb today from big companies who release items just to stay relevant and create buzz. Google Glass, Samsung Smart Gear, those are the two that jump to my mind that has essentially bombed in the last 6 months.

I posted something very similar yesterday in another thread, but it's just as accurate here. Since October 23, 2001 we've been spoiled. The computer and technology industry as a whole was very rapidly finding ways to improve chips, drives, and board to create better and faster, while being smaller and more efficient. This allowed items which were once only pipe dreams to quickly become reality and allow multiple consumer categories to be turned on their heads - Cell phones, laptops, tablets, MP3 Players. Technology definitely hasn't hit a plateau as it's still improving exponentially, but the available technology of today has finally surpassed the needs of the general consumer populace. There is no category that's screaming "UPDATE ME", and Apple isn't one to create for the sake of creation.

I'd say Apple has done an AMAZING job over the last 15 years, and maybe the consumer market doesn't need to be dazzled every quarter decade because what we have lasts longer, and stays relevant MUCH longer.

If you want a comparison of items staying relevant longer take this for example:
2001 Powerbook G4: 400Mhz Processor, 10GB HD, 128MB RAM. 8MB VRAM
2004 Powerbook G4: 1.33Ghz Processor, 60GB HD, 256MB RAM. 64MB VRAM
In 3 years that computer gained approximately 3.5x processing power, 6x more storage, and 8x VRAM

Now take today:
Current: 2014 Macbook Pro Retina: 2.3GHz quad-core,16GB RAM, 512GB SSD, 2GB VRAM
Early-2011 Macbook Pro: 2.2Ghz quad-Core, 4GB Ram, 250GB HD, 1GB VRAM.
In these 3 years you've gained minimal processing improvements, more ram (although the 2011 could be upgraded to 16GB), faster standard HDs, and 2x Video processing power.

Maybe it's time we stop blaming Apple and take a look at the industry as a whole. It's not 2001 anymore, times have definitely changed and we're in a golden era where the consumer's technology needs have been surpassed by available technology. I have no doubt they'll have a next big thing, since the introduction of the original Apple they've always eventually had the "one more thing...", but lets not forget there was a period where year by year they had marginal updates.

1976 - Apple
1984 - Macintosh
1992 - Powerbook
1993 - Newton (mostly a failed adventure)
1998 - iMac
2001 - OS X, iPod, Apple Store
2002 - XServe
2006 - Macbook
2007 - Apple TV, iPhone
2010 - iPad

Now I may be missing your logic, but in the first 20 years of Apples existence they really only redefined the industry 3 times. Apple, Macintosh, and Powerbook. In the Last 20 years they've done it 8 times already (not counting Xserve, Stores, or Newton). What exactly are you wanting - them to average a ground breaking product every other year? If that's the case you will be sorely disappointed going through life.
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Old Apr 5, 2014, 08:42 AM   #111
Carl Sagan
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Apple release new categories roughly every 4-7 years. Complaining about the lack of them over the last three years is idiotic. Getting concerned if they don't have anything new in 2014 is reasonable but still not the end of the world.

Not one company in the world innovates with a brand new industry defining category every single years.

Not one.
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Old Apr 6, 2014, 01:53 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nickwell24 View Post
Your original post is still accurate, however what has any company produced to really redefine or create a consumer needs category in this time frame? Samsung, Nokia, Google - they've all done the exact same things as Apple: updated, their cellphones/computers hardware/software annually and have tried create niche products that don't land. You'd likely have to go back to the Newton to find an Apple product that really bombed the way products bomb today from big companies who release items just to stay relevant and create buzz. Google Glass, Samsung Smart Gear, those are the two that jump to my mind that has essentially bombed in the last 6 months.

I posted something very similar yesterday in another thread, but it's just as accurate here. Since October 23, 2001 we've been spoiled. The computer and technology industry as a whole was very rapidly finding ways to improve chips, drives, and board to create better and faster, while being smaller and more efficient. This allowed items which were once only pipe dreams to quickly become reality and allow multiple consumer categories to be turned on their heads - Cell phones, laptops, tablets, MP3 Players. Technology definitely hasn't hit a plateau as it's still improving exponentially, but the available technology of today has finally surpassed the needs of the general consumer populace. There is no category that's screaming "UPDATE ME", and Apple isn't one to create for the sake of creation.

I'd say Apple has done an AMAZING job over the last 15 years, and maybe the consumer market doesn't need to be dazzled every quarter decade because what we have lasts longer, and stays relevant MUCH longer.

If you want a comparison of items staying relevant longer take this for example:
2001 Powerbook G4: 400Mhz Processor, 10GB HD, 128MB RAM. 8MB VRAM
2004 Powerbook G4: 1.33Ghz Processor, 60GB HD, 256MB RAM. 64MB VRAM
In 3 years that computer gained approximately 3.5x processing power, 6x more storage, and 8x VRAM

Now take today:
Current: 2014 Macbook Pro Retina: 2.3GHz quad-core,16GB RAM, 512GB SSD, 2GB VRAM
Early-2011 Macbook Pro: 2.2Ghz quad-Core, 4GB Ram, 250GB HD, 1GB VRAM.
In these 3 years you've gained minimal processing improvements, more ram (although the 2011 could be upgraded to 16GB), faster standard HDs, and 2x Video processing power.

Maybe it's time we stop blaming Apple and take a look at the industry as a whole. It's not 2001 anymore, times have definitely changed and we're in a golden era where the consumer's technology needs have been surpassed by available technology. I have no doubt they'll have a next big thing, since the introduction of the original Apple they've always eventually had the "one more thing...", but lets not forget there was a period where year by year they had marginal updates.

1976 - Apple
1984 - Macintosh
1992 - Powerbook
1993 - Newton (mostly a failed adventure)
1998 - iMac
2001 - OS X, iPod, Apple Store
2002 - XServe
2006 - Macbook
2007 - Apple TV, iPhone
2010 - iPad

Now I may be missing your logic, but in the first 20 years of Apples existence they really only redefined the industry 3 times. Apple, Macintosh, and Powerbook. In the Last 20 years they've done it 8 times already (not counting Xserve, Stores, or Newton). What exactly are you wanting - them to average a ground breaking product every other year? If that's the case you will be sorely disappointed going through life.

I completely agree, couldn't have been stated better. That's why I think that the major innovation these days is going on in the software field. Look how many app startups there are around. Apps seriously change our lives every day whether they are service apps or simply social media or something else.

Could we blame Apple software-wise? Maybe. I love iOS 7.1 on my 4S. It is not exciting I'll give you that but it's stable and gets the job done. What about Mavericks? I think it's the best release of OS X since Snow Leopard.

However, if they don't have major software innovations coming out in a couple of months with the WWDC we can be grumpy.

Hardware is of course not less important but there is less room for improvement than say 10 years ago, as you have stated. Apple has done minor innovations hardware wise in this past couple of years. Look how thin the iMac is(albeit being non-necessary) or how small and efficient Mac Pro is. How light and thin the iPhone 5S and the iPad Air is. They sure are doing a great bit of engineering. They just don't have the excitement they used to have and that's normal. That hype just couldn't have been sustained for 10+ years.

Lastly, I still believe they have the next big thing with the iWatch and the well-rumored HealthBook. hope they can implement it right. I don't know about you but I would prefer waiting in silence and getting it right than giving in to the media pressure and releasing it in a half-assed way. I want to believe Tim Cook knows what he is doing and Ive's monopoly will yield good results.

We'll see...
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Old Apr 14, 2014, 04:24 PM   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl Sagan View Post
Apple release new categories roughly every 4-7 years. Complaining about the lack of them over the last three years is idiotic. Getting concerned if they don't have anything new in 2014 is reasonable but still not the end of the world.

Not one company in the world innovates with a brand new industry defining category every single years.

Not one.
Cook has been relatively open about the fact that new stuff should be coming out in 2014. From the investor (or consumer with thick wallet issue) point of view they really need to push it out the door this year, since its already promised. It's kind of hard to see how the rumored Apple TV could change much, but the iWristThing could certainly kickstart the whole wearables thing that is going to hopefully replace the excess touch-tapping.
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Old Apr 14, 2014, 04:32 PM   #114
Carl Sagan
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They do but not every year. That's an idiot argument.
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