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Old Jan 11, 2013, 04:19 PM   #26
ActionableMango
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Honestly it should be an option

I certainly understand why someone would want powerful graphics in the Mini. Better gaming and accelerated graphics. People who need the power of the iMac but don't like the built-in ACD.

On the other hand, there are people like me who don't even have a monitor.

For me, low power consumption and heat are far more important than the speed of a GPU that isn't even hooked up to a screen.
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 04:32 PM   #27
ybz90
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@OP, I'm sorry these are not the answers you wanted to hear, but you asked a question, and you got our opinions. Not a chance in a blue moon for this to happen. The reasons again are differentiation and profit margin from reduced product lines and input costs, and the need is further diminished by the reported vast increases in integrated graphics in the coming years.
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 04:36 PM   #28
philipma1957
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@OP, I'm sorry these are not the answers you wanted to hear, but you asked a question, and you got our opinions. Not a chance in a blue moon for this to happen. The reasons again are differentiation and profit margin from reduced product lines and input costs, and the need is further diminished by the reported vast increases in integrated graphics in the coming years.
This and well written btw.

I would prefer for you to be wrong but 95% + that you are correct.
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 04:39 PM   #29
ybz90
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And what would have happend with the discrete graphics performance in that "change to another paradigm"? It's not like their development will stop or halt.

Have you tried gaming on integrated graphics? Integrated is just not close to the performance of discrete graphics.
Also, I am strongly inclined to agree with the person you quoted about paradigms; I believe in a few years, though it's impossible to know for sure, that the dGPU market will be dead except the high-end market. Though high-margin, it is a very low-volume segment of the industry for gamers, professionals, and those simply who want the latest and greatest. We've already reached the point where the low-end dGPU market has been all but destroyed by Intel and AMD's steady march toward serviceable iGPUs, and if the rumors and roadmaps are to be believed (and again, they may not come true), the mid-end will be decimated in a few years simply because the performance will be good and acceptable, eliminating the need for a separate GPU for most users. The high-end will likely exist for years to come, but I could even theoretically see a future where super-high end graphics are merged with the CPU as well, but now we're just speculating with no basis for reality.

It's important to remember that what we perceive as fixed now is itself only a nascent at best. The entire computer industry as we know it has only existed for a few decades and is constantly in flux as far as paradigms. That's why the forward thinking generally succeed (but sometimes fail, if they're too far ahead of their time). To expect our current model of modular motherboards and add-on cards to continue in its current form forever is misguided. Just look at network cards and sound cards. The same could theoretically happen to the GPU industry. It may not, but I think it's more likely than not.
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 05:13 PM   #30
Tanax
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I don't get why I have to try a HD4000 to prove any "credibility"? There are numerous benchmarks and videos on YouTube that shows that integrated graphics are quite okay.. but nowhere near a discrete graphics chip.
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 10:54 PM   #31
paulrbeers
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I don't get why I have to try a HD4000 to prove any "credibility"? There are numerous benchmarks and videos on YouTube that shows that integrated graphics are quite okay.. but nowhere near a discrete graphics chip.
Well you seem to think it is a requirement to do certain things such as image editing with a discrete card which if you had ever tried it with an hd4000 you would realize it handles it quite well. The only things the Mac Mini doesn't do well is gaming (professionals would not buy a mini anyway). To be honest, I used to have crazy powerful desktops, but realize they were a complete waste for anything I did but gaming and frankly I have too much work, family, and other responsibilities to game anymore so the Miji is perfect as is.
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Old Jan 12, 2013, 09:56 AM   #32
Rapscallion
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Next Gen. Mini

This may be of interest to some of you on this thread.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6600/i...eforce-gt-650m

It seems like the next mini, if it comes with Haswell, will be on par with todays graphics performance, not bad really.
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Old Jan 12, 2013, 10:27 AM   #33
Ice Dragon
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Originally Posted by Rapscallion View Post
This may be of interest to some of you on this thread.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6600/i...eforce-gt-650m

It seems like the next mini, if it comes with Haswell, will be on par with todays graphics performance, not bad really.
I saw that and personally I am skeptical. It would be great if true though.
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Old Jan 12, 2013, 10:41 AM   #34
philipma1957
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I saw that and personally I am skeptical. It would be great if true though.
I did not like the discrete only mini at first. But the 4000 is almost good for me. If the haswell discrete is as good as it is said to be I may go back to all mac. I would need to see it and play with it for a bit.



thread hijack


Right now I am setting up a 2012 quad 2.3 refurb with 16gb ram and a 1.5tb diy fusion.I will test it and run it for a while. This is the first 2010-2012 mini that I broke something during disassembly . While I was pulling the mobo out it moved a full 2 inches instantly thus breaking the plug on the ir cable. I ordered a replacement cable at this link.

http://www.powerbookmedic.com/Mac-Mi...e-p-21818.html
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Old Jan 12, 2013, 11:11 AM   #35
OS-SEX
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I recently bought an inexpensive 2011 mini because I didn't like any of the new systems currently available. I'm hoping that the 2013 mini with it's integrated HD5000 or whatever they put in it will be significantly impressive enough that I'll want to upgrade.
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Old Jan 12, 2013, 01:23 PM   #36
Tanax
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Originally Posted by paulrbeers View Post
Well you seem to think it is a requirement to do certain things such as image editing with a discrete card which if you had ever tried it with an hd4000 you would realize it handles it quite well. The only things the Mac Mini doesn't do well is gaming (professionals would not buy a mini anyway). To be honest, I used to have crazy powerful desktops, but realize they were a complete waste for anything I did but gaming and frankly I have too much work, family, and other responsibilities to game anymore so the Miji is perfect as is.
Not at all, the HD4000 is a very potent graphics chip but for gaming it just isn't enough. Not saying I'm a hardcore gamer, quite on the contrary. It's just that when I do want to game, I don't want to feel like the game is lagging because my graphics isn't good enough.

On top of that, when I buy a Mac, I want to future-proof it as much as possible. The internal graphics in the processor might be OK for today. But in a year it might already feel too slow. And I like to keep a Mac for at least 3 years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rapscallion View Post
This may be of interest to some of you on this thread.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6600/i...eforce-gt-650m

It seems like the next mini, if it comes with Haswell, will be on par with todays graphics performance, not bad really.
The GT 500M is definitely better than the internal HD4000 but will that be enough performance to last for 3-4 years?
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Old Jan 13, 2013, 02:40 PM   #37
53x12
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Originally Posted by philipma1957 View Post
I did not like the discrete only mini at first. But the 4000 is almost good for me. If the haswell discrete is as good as it is said to be I may go back to all mac. I would need to see it and play with it for a bit.


I already thought you were all Mac? Don't you have a few mini's (at least 1 i5 and 1 i7)?

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanax View Post
But in a year it might already feel too slow. And I like to keep a Mac for at least 3 years.

Nice thing with the mini is that you can probably upgrade it every 12-18 months without having to fork out much more than $100-150 for a completely new system if you sell your old mini. To stay current, that is a fair deal.
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Old Jan 13, 2013, 03:41 PM   #38
philipma1957
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Originally Posted by 53x12 View Post
I already thought you were all Mac? Don't you have a few mini's (at least 1 i5 and 1 i7)?

----------




Nice thing with the mini is that you can probably upgrade it every 12-18 months without having to fork out much more than $100-150 for a completely new system if you sell your old mini. To stay current, that is a fair deal.
right now i am running a large pc/gpu bitcoin operation so I have quite a few pc's.

plus 4 mini's here are some pc's

these are the smallest full sized pc's


(i73770k, hd7970 gpu , full size power supply)

they are the biggest reason That Apple annoys me.
as they refuse to make a like product.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthre...192&highlight=
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