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Old Mar 11, 2013, 07:03 AM   #76
samcraig
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sir1963nz View Post
But while you're at it ask why your playstation games wont work on the Mac or Xbox.
This is an analogy so far removed from the scenario being discussed here. It's also a bad analogy unto itself.
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 07:04 AM   #77
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They need all thier resources to focus on their desktop browser. Once they learn to make that one decent then they can start to branch out. Has anyone used it on Android? It's junk
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 07:12 AM   #78
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Originally Posted by 0dev View Post
Chrome for iOS is just a (slightly slower) wrapper for Safari, not a proper browser.

What Mozilla is saying here is they don't want to just make a wrapper for Safari, they want to do things properly and make a full browser, which Apple won't let them do. I think that's perfectly fair of Mozilla and pathetic of Apple.
A lot of people would argue that the "Wrapper" (ie, the "chrome", no pun intended) is as important as what's being rendered in the rendering window. Some people would say it's even more important. One look at browsers like iCab or Atomic web says there are a HUGE amount of features to be added to a browser that have nothing to do with the rendering engine. Whether Mozilla has anything to add here to UIWebView on iOS is the question of course.
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 07:15 AM   #79
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Yet, the one on my Xperia arc s is still as slow as 56k. Fix that before whining about iOS please...
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 07:41 AM   #80
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Originally Posted by unlinked View Post
Don't see that ever happening. iOS is (probably) never going to have enough of a monopoly to justify it.
I can see it happening for chrome and firefox (and maybe internet explorer, but I doubt ms wants to).
Not this year, but the ios users will get the option to choose the brand of web browser they want in ios.
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 07:49 AM   #81
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Another reason why HTC One or Samsung S IV may be next phone instead of the iPhone 5S.
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 08:10 AM   #82
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Another horrible block of innovation to the developers of the Apple community.

I really like Apple, but at these times just makes me want to think that Apple is a bit too paranoid.
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 08:16 AM   #83
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Originally Posted by sir1963nz View Post
Totally different situations. Apple don't have 90% of the phone market for a start.
Microsoft didn't get sued for having 90% of marketshare, they got sued because they abused their market position.
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 08:46 AM   #84
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Originally Posted by MassiveAttack View Post
iOS users lose yet again. As always Apple frowns upon their users having a choice.
THe real question is why isnt the iphone powerful enough to run mozilla?
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 09:17 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by maxosx View Post
Mozilla's no dummy.

They know of the proprietary advantage Apple reserves for Safari, so as to make themselves look superior.

Why should Mozilla waste time with the cards stacked against them. Even more impressive is they spoke out and called Apple on it.

Google is a confident organization and doesn't resort to such games. Thus we Android users have a wonderful selection of competing apps like browsers & keyboards to choose from.

Viva le choice!

Thanks Google!
Google not only allows you to install competing browsers, but they allow you to install ad blockers from their own Play Store. A company that literally makes all of its money from advertising allows its users to install ad blocking software on their own OS!

Yet Apple, a company which makes virtually all of its money from hardware sales, won't even let you install a different browser on that hardware you paid for.

Go figure
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 09:27 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtOfWarfare View Post
This isn't the same. Nintendo works within the limitations that they give their developers. The Wii's hardware doesn't magically improve when you insert a Nintendo disk instead of another developer's disk.

Apple, however, uses a faster JS interpreter in Safari than they allow developers to use in UIWebView. Thus Safari will always be a better browser from a JS performance perspective than any other browser.

Having said that, I am working on a browser for iOS and OS X which looks nothing like any web browser before it as a school assignment.
Except my example is extremely relavent.

Nintendo only gives access to one core of their CPU and limited memory to devs to work with on both their 3DS and Wii U, whereas Nintendo's first party devs have full access to the system resources.
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 09:39 AM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by camnchar View Post
I agree with Mozilla. Open up the APIs and let the developers have at it. Benefits based on artificial constraints hurt everyone.
Apple needs the artificial constraint. Otherwise, third-party browsers would make Safari look bad.

Apple knows what it is doing. If they could profit by opening up the APIs, then they would be all over it like stink on sheet. As it is, they think that making Safari look better yields higher profits.

And my guess is that they are correct.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by irDigital0l View Post
Apple..its time for option to chose default browser.
That is way too confusing for the typical member of Apple's target market.

Apple stuff Just Works. If you want something that just "works the way you want it to work" then Apple products are NOT for you.

With Apple, you get products that just "work the way Apple knows best". Again, why pay extra for Apple to make choices for you if you just want to over ride them anyways?

That is very un-Apple-like.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
iOS doesn't even need any more wrapped browsers.
True that.

Firefox needs iOS a WHOLE lot more than iOS needs Firefox. When will these morons learn?
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 09:43 AM   #88
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Anyone saying you have multiple browsers, btw, is wrong.

You don't have multiple browsers.

You have multiple Safaris with different names and some slight modifications. But 90% of their innards? Safari.
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 09:51 AM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anthony11 View Post
Seriously? Examples of people who don't give a rat's ass about which of two Javascript things is used instead of the other:
o My wife (that's right, there are actual *GIRLS* in the world outside your mom's basement)
o 99+% of everyone else
See, that's the thing people forget. Apple does not make products for sophisticated users. Apple makes products for technological illiterates.

And there's a WHOLE lot more moolah to be made selling to them than there is selling to self-styled uber geeks. The very few people who care about that stuff buy Android.

And that is why Apple sells so much more then Android does.
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 09:51 AM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreenBastard View Post
Except my example is extremely relavent.

Nintendo only gives access to one core of their CPU and limited memory to devs to work with on both their 3DS and Wii U, whereas Nintendo's first party devs have full access to the system resources.
Source? I've never heard of this before...
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 10:01 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by iGrip View Post

And that is why Apple sells so much more then Android does.
This statement doesn't make sense....Android has more market share. Sure, there's fragmentation, but it's still Android.

Android is not a brand...you cannot compare an OS to a company. If you said: Apple sells more iPhones than Samsung Galaxy SIII's, then yes, they do and that's fair.

If not, though, you're just being biased and incorrect. You should only compare iOS to Android as an OS per se.
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 10:55 AM   #92
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Originally Posted by Paradoxally View Post
Lame-ass Android POS? Android 4.2.2 on the Nexus 4 runs circles around iOS on any device you can put it on + offers total personalization and features. I have an iPhone, I'm not against Apple in any way. I see an amazing device that could be so much more if the OS was open. I see it from a developer standpoint, because I too am one - this is a technology forum, not just a user place to chill and where noobs gather to feast in the latest ignorant comments about their beloved iOS by the mighty Apple.

iOS is limited, it won't let you do anything interesting apart from the limitations imposed by Apple. I agree with Mozilla, but they won't ever open up.

As a regular Joe, I prefer iOS for its simplicity, but as a developer and tech enthusiast, Android is my preferred platform because it allows total customization.

People shouldn't be shading Android just because it's open and allows users to do stuff. Seriously, demo a Nexus yourself, see what you can do with it, and then talk crap about Android if you're still not happy.
I would totally agree if you didn't say Android ran circles around iOS. Honestly, it seems more like a hobbyist OS with every release coming closer to an actual final version. My iPhone 5 and new iPad run great from a performance standpoint and the apps I use work flawlessly. My SIII on the other hand is the only phone I have owned where the "phone" part routinely crashes. It's a phone, the one part that should always work, is the phone app.

Aside from Samsung's devices, most Android systems are crap, not because of the OS, but the modifications made by each manufacturer, and sometimes even the carrier.

Yeah, yeah, we would all like to see a more open iOS with the same stability and security it currently has. Unfortunately Android isn't that. It's completely open, which is fun to play with, but if you want to actually play ON your phone or tablet, you will have less headaches with the way Apple has set up their ecosystem. It doesn't take a Genius to restore an iPhone/iPad.

Mozilla has consistently rolled out version after version of security flaws and poor performing browsers since version 4 of Firefox. Their CSS3 rendering is lacking when it comes to display even compared to the Metro ie10 in many ways, you get the information but it rarely looks as intended. Why would I ever want to run this on any mobile device, iOS, Android or Windows based?

I used to love Firefox, but as far as I'm concerned, good riddance. I rather use a webkit based browser any day. What was once a non-profit that was amped about making the web fast, useable and compliant is now more about whining about limitations and convincing users each new version is better. Fix your memory issues, support more HTML5 & CSS3 and innovate again so people really care, otherwise just call yourself Netscape.

Last edited by beatlemike; Mar 11, 2013 at 11:13 AM.
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 11:16 AM   #93
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Angry It’s Time to Declare War Against Apple’s Censorship

"The unwanted" list goes longer and longer: Java, Flash, Google Maps, Online Magazines, Firefox... What's next Apple? More proprietary connectors?
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 11:41 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by lukasz74nj View Post
"The unwanted" list goes longer and longer: Java, Flash, Google Maps, Online Magazines, Firefox... What's next Apple? More proprietary connectors?
Google Maps is on iOS, it just isn't the default.

And this isn't because "Apple decided you didn't want it", it's because Google was wanting more and more information. They made a business decision based on the fact that their contract with Google was about to expire.
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 01:08 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by bb426 View Post
That didn't stop Google from releasing Chrome.

Innovation, people. Don't let a limitation stop you from working with all the resources you have.
This is one of the more bizarre comments I have read recently.

So, Apple puts a bunch of roadblocks to ensure that it effectively strangles all third-party browser competition, but in your mind this twists around in some rather weird ways, to lead you to the conclusion that Mozilla is at fault, because it doesn't "innovate."

Wow!
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Old Mar 11, 2013, 04:22 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by Paradoxally View Post
Lame-ass Android POS? Android 4.2.2 on the Nexus 4 runs circles around iOS on any device you can put it on + offers total personalization and features. I have an iPhone, I'm not against Apple in any way. I see an amazing device that could be so much more if the OS was open. I see it from a developer standpoint, because I too am one - this is a technology forum, not just a user place to chill and where noobs gather to feast in the latest ignorant comments about their beloved iOS by the mighty Apple.

iOS is limited, it won't let you do anything interesting apart from the limitations imposed by Apple. I agree with Mozilla, but they won't ever open up.

As a regular Joe, I prefer iOS for its simplicity, but as a developer and tech enthusiast, Android is my preferred platform because it allows total customization.

People shouldn't be shading Android just because it's open and allows users to do stuff. Seriously, demo a Nexus yourself, see what you can do with it, and then talk crap about Android if you're still not happy.
If Android can indeed run circles around iOS, so be it, it's a motorcycle vs a tank. I'd rather be sitting in a tank than fiddling with a bike. It's my day-to-day communication device, not my computer at home or at work. I need rock solid stability and reliability. By the way, watch out for the logs and oils on the road while you do the circles.
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Old Mar 12, 2013, 02:01 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by blackcrayon View Post
A lot of people would argue that the "Wrapper" (ie, the "chrome", no pun intended) is as important as what's being rendered in the rendering window. Some people would say it's even more important. One look at browsers like iCab or Atomic web says there are a HUGE amount of features to be added to a browser that have nothing to do with the rendering engine. Whether Mozilla has anything to add here to UIWebView on iOS is the question of course.
Exactly. The rendering engine doesn't matter as long as the result = showing a web page. Firefox's majority set of features are not based on its rendering engine.
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Old Mar 13, 2013, 12:39 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by thehustleman View Post
It's a computer, the should be no restrictions that the user themselves didn't place.

Stop being a turd and open up
Oh come on now... just ask APPLE and they will tell you that they are all about OPEN Source

Still cannot figure out how APPLE has not been sued by the OPEN SOURCE Community for the onslaught of B.S that they get away with considering it is based off of FREE BSD

I don't care what anyone says, I am a web developer and hands down, FIREFOX has been the best browser available on the internet since it was released in 2004!
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Old Mar 14, 2013, 08:25 PM   #99
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If Android can indeed run circles around iOS, so be it, it's a motorcycle vs a tank. I'd rather be sitting in a tank than fiddling with a bike. It's my day-to-day communication device, not my computer at home or at work. I need rock solid stability and reliability. By the way, watch out for the logs and oils on the road while you do the circles.
No, it's not. Android is solid too, look at 4.2.2 on the Nexus. But it's the ONLY device (bar Samsung Galaxy S2-S3 and some other high-ends) that I would go with an Android. I prefer Google's version of Android, no mods. Clean as can be. It's stable, it's fast, it works. Just like iOS. But it allows customization. So I can install custom ROMs + kernels. Anything I want. So if I want to do something bold, it will let me. iOS would just go 'ahhh, well, you gotta jailbreak and then see if there's a tweak...'.

And for features, Android is still better. You can't even put a weather or mail widget on iOS without a jailbreak, come on now Apple. iOS needs a SERIOUS refresh or one day you will be joining me on my shiny bike as your tank falls apart.
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Old Mar 14, 2013, 09:52 PM   #100
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Not too concerned that Mozilla won't release a browser known for memory leaks on iOS.
I have to force quit Firefox nearly every day on both my Mac and my PC because of memory leaks. Stay off my iPad, please....
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