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Old Mar 18, 2013, 08:33 AM   #1
anonicon
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Exclamation Bloated M4V Files from DVD

Howdy.

I've run into a weird issue. I'm backing up my Rocky & Bullwinkle DVD collection to m4v using Handbrake. I'm using the same settings I've always used in Handbrake for all my other DVDs, namely RF: 18 and Audio: 256K. Well, unlike any other DVD I've ever encoded, the Rocky & Bullwinkle DVDs are coming out as 4.5-9.5 GB m4v files. That's not a typo.

Normally, when I feed Handbrake a 3 hour video folder, the resultuing m4v comes out as a 2-3GB file using the settings above. Any ideas why these newly encoded m4v files are coming out larger than their source DVDs?

FWIW, I've googled this issue and haven't found any prior results dealing with this issue.

Thank you.
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Old Mar 18, 2013, 08:46 AM   #2
mic j
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Originally Posted by anonicon View Post
Howdy.

I've run into a weird issue. I'm backing up my Rocky & Bullwinkle DVD collection to m4v using Handbrake. I'm using the same settings I've always used in Handbrake for all my other DVDs, namely RF: 18 and Audio: 256K. Well, unlike any other DVD I've ever encoded, the Rocky & Bullwinkle DVDs are coming out as 4.5-9.5 GB m4v files. That's not a typo.

Normally, when I feed Handbrake a 3 hour video folder, the resultuing m4v comes out as a 2-3GB file using the settings above. Any ideas why these newly encoded m4v files are coming out larger than their source DVDs?

FWIW, I've googled this issue and haven't found any prior results dealing with this issue.

Thank you.
Film grain is usually the culprit when this happens. You will probably need to lower your RF down to 20. For animation, that should be sufficient.
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Old Mar 18, 2013, 09:12 AM   #3
anonicon
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Thanks mic j, I'll try that out when I get home. Hopefully film grain is the culprit since Rocky & Bullwinkle originally aired from 1959-1964 and the animation was outsourced to Mexico.

Again, thanks!
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Old Mar 18, 2013, 09:56 AM   #4
mic j
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Originally Posted by anonicon View Post
Thanks mic j, I'll try that out when I get home. Hopefully film grain is the culprit since Rocky & Bullwinkle originally aired from 1959-1964 and the animation was outsourced to Mexico.

Again, thanks!
God, I loved R&B when I was a kid! Worked on so many levels. Most of which I was totally unaware of at the time.
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Old Mar 18, 2013, 10:17 AM   #5
dynaflash
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Imo rf 18 for dvd's is overkill. in much testing I have never been able to see a perceivable visual quality difference between rf 19 and 18. In other words the visual quality should be pretty much transparent across a variety of sources.

There again, just an opinion, I am not surprised your file size (therefore bitrate) blew up on a grain source with rf 18.
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Old Mar 18, 2013, 10:24 AM   #6
anonicon
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Originally Posted by mic j View Post
God, I loved R&B when I was a kid! Worked on so many levels. Most of which I was totally unaware of at the time.
I feel the same way, which is why I bought them pretty cheaply at Amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/Rocky-Bullwinkle-Friends-Complete-Series/dp/B00465I1BA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1363620165&sr=8-1&keywords=rocky+%26+bullwinkle+dvd

FWIW, I highly recommend them, I've watched the first season on plain old DVD. Now to get them down to manageable size. :-)
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Old Mar 18, 2013, 10:58 AM   #7
vatter69
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Originally Posted by dynaflash View Post
Imo rf 18 for dvd's is overkill. in much testing I have never been able to see a perceivable visual quality difference between rf 19 and 18. In other words the visual quality should be pretty much transparent across a variety of sources.

There again, just an opinion, I am not surprised your file size (therefore bitrate) blew up on a grain source with rf 18.
Actually i did some long tests before i started backing up my blu-rays and RF20 for Blu-ray delivers good results. Even with software image comparison software the difference was so small, im good with that.

As far as film corn goes, that's is exactly the issue. If you want to get rid of the filesize AND the film corn, you could as well set the Denoise to Medium. That will get rid of like 20-30% of filesize too.
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Old Mar 19, 2013, 11:34 AM   #8
dynaflash
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As far as film corn goes, that's is exactly the issue. If you want to get rid of the filesize AND the film corn, you could as well set the Denoise to Medium. That will get rid of like 20-30% of filesize too.
Very true, Denoise will definitely lower the file size considerably as the denoise filter happens prior to sending it to the encoder. That said ... for someone new to denoise I might suggest testing a chapter first. Denoise is kind of a sledgehammer in a way and you can easily go overboard on it. It can make the output look like its "plastic".

I suggest a test in the live preview window to see if its doing what you want. That said I do agree it can be a solution. However in the OP's case I think using an rf of 20 or at most 19 would help quite a bit without removing the source grain. Good point though.

Also, its worth noting that the RF scale is logarithmic, not linear. Therefore the bitrate / file sized diff as a percentage between say ... 20 to 19 will be smaller than the difference between 19 to 18.
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Old Mar 19, 2013, 12:22 PM   #9
vatter69
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Yea - that's why i suggested to start with medium setting for the denoiser.

Some movies like Alien 2 are pretty heavy on filmcorn, setting it to medium on this movie cut down the filesize form 13 to 8 gig.
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Old Mar 19, 2013, 12:56 PM   #10
dynaflash
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imo, weak is the best way to start. but ... roll your own
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