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Old Aug 1, 2014, 01:04 PM   #51
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Better question: How IS this a Republican/Democrat issue?

They are supposed to be the ones coming up with a solution to the problem. That's how it is a rep/dem issue. The laws are old and outdated, and they don't care about border security since it doesn't really effect them in their nice cushy offices
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:13 PM   #52
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Gang members just want a better life too.
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:19 PM   #53
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Gang members just want a better life too.
And sometimes they get it too, different times, but still a gangster.
Lucky Luciano

During World War II, the U.S. government struck a secret deal with the imprisoned Luciano. In 1942, the U.S. Office of Naval Intelligence was concerned about German and Italian agents entering the United States through the New York waterfront. They also worried about sabotage in these facilities. Knowing that the Cosa Nostra controlled the waterfront, the Navy contacted Meyer Lansky about a deal with Luciano. To facilitate negotiations, the State of New York transferred Luciano from Clinton prison to Great Meadow Correctional Facility in Comstock, New York, which was much closer to New York City.[39]

The Navy, the State of New York and Luciano eventually concluded a deal. In exchange for a commutation of his sentence, Luciano promised the complete assistance of his organization in providing intelligence to the Navy. Luciano ally Albert Anastasia, who controlled the docks, allegedly promised no dockworker strikes during war. In preparation for the 1943 allied invasion of Sicily, Luciano allegedly provided the U.S. military with mafia contacts in Sicily.[37]

The value of Luciano's contribution to the war effort is highly debated. In 1947, the naval officer in charge of Operation Underworld discounted the value of Luciano's wartime aid.[40] A 1954 report ordered by Governor Dewey stated that Luciano provided many valuable services to Naval Intelligence.[41] The enemy threat to the docks, Luciano allegedly said, was manufactured by the sinking of the SS Normandie in New York harbor, supposedly directed by Anastasia's brother, Anthony Anastasio.[42][43] However, the official investigation of the ship sinking found no evidence of sabotage.[44]

On January 3, 1946, as a presumed reward for his alleged wartime cooperation, now Governor Thomas E. Dewey reluctantly commuted Luciano's pandering sentence on condition that he did not resist deportation to Italy.[45] Luciano accepted the deal, although he still maintained that he was a U.S. citizen and not subject to deportation. On February 2, 1946, two federal immigration agents transported Luciano from Sing Sing prison to Ellis Island in New York Harbor for deportation proceedings.[46] On February 9, the night before his departure, Luciano shared a spaghetti dinner on his freighter with Anastasia and five other guests.[47]

On February 10, 1946, Luciano's ship sailed from Brooklyn harbor for Italy.[47] This was the last time he would see the United States. On February 28, after a 17-day voyage, Luciano's ship arrived in Naples. On arrival, Luciano told reporters he would probably reside in Sicily.[48]

Luciano was deeply hurt about having to leave the United States, a country he had considered his own ever since his arrival at age ten. During his exile, Luciano frequently encountered US military men and American tourists during train trips in Italy. Luciano enjoyed these meetings and gladly posed for photographs and signed autographs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucky_Luciano
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:21 PM   #54
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Because the dems want those voters to keep them in office. There's no reason national guard members haven't been sent there months ago. It's all a show trying to blame the other side. Something would be done if these politicians were forced to take in some of these illegals
This entire discussion about deploying more law enforcement or National Guard entirely misses the point.

The family units and unaccompanied minors are heading right to the nearest border authority they can find, in some cases, smugglers are bringing people right to the border in full-view of US authorities.

Sending troops to provide security won't solve this because all of these people are under arrest and in deportation proceedings.

What we need are more judges and lawyers to handle the huge backload of cases and make good assessments on the large number of children and families who have genuine asylum claims that we must address by law and UN Treaty.

Putting troops along the border is expensive pandering.
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:27 PM   #55
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They are supposed to be the ones coming up with a solution to the problem. That's how it is a rep/dem issue. The laws are old and outdated, and they don't care about border security since it doesn't really effect them in their nice cushy offices
Except everything you said doesn't mention how this is an issue that is because of parties. And none of this supports the initial claim that you made. Please try to keep a consistent line.
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:28 PM   #56
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gang members entering U.S.: ‘Why are we letting him in here?’

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Except everything you said doesn't mention how this is an issue that is because of parties. And none of this supports the initial claim that you made. Please try to keep a consistent line.

The rep/dems are the ones we the people elect to figure out issues like this. So it is "their" being rep/dem job to solve. This isn't an issue expected to be handled by some Joe Schmo on the street. Not to mention the party values and constant fighting between parties and in congress so nothing passes or gets done. Not sure how much more clear I need to be for you to see and understand this.

Last edited by Premium1; Aug 1, 2014 at 02:32 PM. Reason: added info
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:37 PM   #57
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since it doesn't really effect them in their nice cushy offices
How does it affect you?
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:39 PM   #58
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How does it affect you?

Well let's see. My tax dollars pay for those illegals when they need healthcare, or any other programs that are funded by my tax payer dollars. And that's just to start..
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:44 PM   #59
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Gang members entering U.S.: "Why are we letting him in here?"
Because American gang members are too lazy to jack people anymore?

"Der takin' our jerbs!"
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:46 PM   #60
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The rep/dems are the ones we the people elect to figure out issues like this. So it is "their" being rep/dem job to solve. This isn't an issue expected to be handled by some Joe Schmo on the street. Not to mention the party values and constant fighting between parties and in congress so nothing passes or gets done. Not sure how much more clear I need to be for you to see and understand this.
Except your original point was something about how the Democrats aren't doing anything to get votes. Now you're saying the problem lies with both parties because they can't agree on anything. Which is it? Please stick with a reason, any reason.
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:47 PM   #61
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Except your original point was something about how the Democrats aren't doing anything to get votes. Now you're saying the problem lies with both parties because they can't agree on anything. Which is it? Please stick with a reason, any reason.

Clearly the "conflicting views" and fighting among parties part flew right over your head...
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:49 PM   #62
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Clearly the "conflicting views" and fighting among parties part flew right over your head...
No, clearly you aren't making a coherent argument.
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:50 PM   #63
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They are supposed to be the ones coming up with a solution to the problem. That's how it is a rep/dem issue. The laws are old and outdated, and they don't care about border security since it doesn't really effect them in their nice cushy offices
That would mean it's a Congressional problem, which would be correct. But it's not a partisan problem.

This is only going to continue until we start hiring more immigration judges and start speeding up the pace at which we do these asylum hearings before we decided if we're going to deport these people or not.

Blaming anything else is futile because that's what's causing the backlog and causing us to house all these people until we can give them their hearing.
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:50 PM   #64
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No, clearly you aren't making a coherent argument.

Ok whatever you say. If you still don't see it I'm not gonna waste more time trying to state it another 3-4 times for you. Well just have to agree to disagree.
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:51 PM   #65
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That would mean it's a Congressional problem, which would be correct. It's not a partisan problem.

This is only going to continue until we start hiring more immigration judges and start speeding up the pace at which we do these asylum hearings before we decided if we're going to deport these people or not.

Blaming anything else is futile because that's what's causing the backlog and causing us to house all these people until we can give them their hearing.
Thank you.
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:53 PM   #66
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Well let's see. My tax dollars pay for those illegals when they need healthcare, or any other programs that are funded by my tax payer dollars. And that's just to start..
Your tax dollars aren't any more important than anyone else's. God forbid 50 cents of your tax dollars go to help an immigrant child get some ****ing medicine.

For the record. No person is "illegal." They are human just like me and you. You were lucky enough to be born in America, that's the only difference. You don't have any privilege over anyone else, nor do you get to judge who has the "right" to be in America.
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:54 PM   #67
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Your tax dollars aren't any more important than anyone else's. God forbid 50 cents of your tax dollars go to help an immigrant child get some ****ing medicine.

For the record. No person is "illegal." They are human just like me and you. You were lucky enough to be born in America, that's the only difference. You don't have any privilege over anyone else, nor do you get to judge who has the "right" to be in America.
I wouldn't bother if I were you.
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 02:57 PM   #68
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Your tax dollars aren't any more important than anyone else's. God forbid 50 cents of your tax dollars go to help an immigrant child get some ****ing medicine.

For the record. No person is "illegal." They are human just like me and you. You were lucky enough to be born in America, that's the only difference. You don't have any privilege over anyone else, nor do you get to judge who has the "right" to be in America.
Spot on.

We are all a nation of immigrants.

On top of that, many of these kids are more than just immigrants. They're essentially refugees fleeing countries with three of the top 5 murder rates in the world. This is a major humanitarian crisis, not just an immigration issue.
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 08:10 PM   #69
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Your tax dollars aren't any more important than anyone else's. God forbid 50 cents of your tax dollars go to help an immigrant child get some ****ing medicine.

For the record. No person is "illegal." They are human just like me and you. You were lucky enough to be born in America, that's the only difference. You don't have any privilege over anyone else, nor do you get to judge who has the "right" to be in America.
You asked how they affect me and I told you. No need to get all defensive and get your panties in a bunch. Never once claimed my tax dollars are any more important than anyone else's. Never claimed I had any "privilege" so maybe next time when you try to put words in someone's mouth make it be something they said. I have no problem with them going through all the steps to become a citizen and be here legally, but the ways that many come into this country and remain here illegally is the issue at hand.
And talking about medicine, we can't even medicate our own people, shouldn't they be first in line? I'm all for medicine for everyone, but when people in your own country can't get care and those just coming into the country are, there is something wrong there.
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 09:13 PM   #70
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You asked how they affect me and I told you. No need to get all defensive and get your panties in a bunch. Never once claimed my tax dollars are any more important than anyone else's. Never claimed I had any "privilege" so maybe next time when you try to put words in someone's mouth make it be something they said. I have no problem with them going through all the steps to become a citizen and be here legally, but the ways that many come into this country and remain here illegally is the issue at hand.
And talking about medicine, we can't even medicate our own people, shouldn't they be first in line? I'm all for medicine for everyone, but when people in your own country can't get care and those just coming into the country are, there is something wrong there.
I have seen ample evidence that illegal immigration puts money back into the average U.S. household. Illegal immigration does hit certain locations hard because the immigrants have a tendency to pool and remain in those areas. But on the balance sheet, they make the country more money than they cost in tax dollars. A good portion of Social Security is funded by their work.

(And yes. I can source that.)
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Old Aug 1, 2014, 09:45 PM   #71
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...
And talking about medicine, we can't even medicate our own people, shouldn't they be first in line? I'm all for medicine for everyone, but when people in your own country can't get care and those just coming into the country are, there is something wrong there.
The reason that people can't get care in this country has a great deal more to do with specific inefficiencies in our health care system.

Largely the care that people in the country illegally receive is the kind of care available to anyone, which is clinic care, cheap vaccinations, or emergency care.

There's no "line" for medicine in the U.S. and the minimal care that, for instance the unaccompanied minors get in Texas is care that all people in detention receive, because all 57,000 unaccompanied minors and the 32,000 family units are all in deportation proceedings.
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Old Aug 2, 2014, 12:27 AM   #72
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You asked how they affect me and I told you. No need to get all defensive and get your panties in a bunch. Never once claimed my tax dollars are any more important than anyone else's. Never claimed I had any "privilege" so maybe next time when you try to put words in someone's mouth make it be something they said. I have no problem with them going through all the steps to become a citizen and be here legally, but the ways that many come into this country and remain here illegally is the issue at hand.
And talking about medicine, we can't even medicate our own people, shouldn't they be first in line? I'm all for medicine for everyone, but when people in your own country can't get care and those just coming into the country are, there is something wrong there.

Our own people should definitely be first in line. The problem is, many Americans are so resistant to any kind of help to the poor that we stay in the state we are in.
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Old Aug 2, 2014, 12:42 AM   #73
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You asked how they affect me and I told you. No need to get all defensive and get your panties in a bunch. Never once claimed my tax dollars are any more important than anyone else's. Never claimed I had any "privilege" so maybe next time when you try to put words in someone's mouth make it be something they said. I have no problem with them going through all the steps to become a citizen and be here legally, but the ways that many come into this country and remain here illegally is the issue at hand.
And talking about medicine, we can't even medicate our own people, shouldn't they be first in line? I'm all for medicine for everyone, but when people in your own country can't get care and those just coming into the country are, there is something wrong there.
If we're just talking about typical immunizations and basic checkups, it's possible for anyone to obtain that. There are even programs that apply to those at the lowest income levels. Providing medical care to a tightly packed group of several thousand people is more an issue of preventing the spread of disease or any potential fatalities within the group. No one has a perfect solution for this, especially when they are from a variety of countries, and their place of residence may not be clear when they are picked up.
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Old Aug 3, 2014, 06:38 AM   #74
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Well let's see. My tax dollars pay for those illegals when they need healthcare, or any other programs that are funded by my tax payer dollars. And that's just to start..
Bwhahahahaha.

Sorry, were you serious?
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