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Old Jan 19, 2014, 02:14 PM   #176
osx11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neddyteddy View Post
I just read this entire tread and to put it bluntly, and I'll go ahead and apologize now, you've pretty much proven my theory about Mac users right. Macs are for idiots.

And what I mean, specifically, Macs are for Windows idiots.

Sure, less viruses blah blah blah but of course Windows will have more. It's a more widely used and compatible system, hands down. That's a no brainer. I have a lot of experience with Windows XP, Vista, 7, and 8. Linux Mint and Ubuntu, and of course Mac in various flavors. I'm a hardcore, HARDCORE, Windows user. I abuse the heck out of my systems. Why? Because they can handle it.

That's not to say Mac can't but I've been a primary Windows user since 3.1 and I've never had an issue with malware, viruses, or "bugs" -- at least not bugs that I could control.

The problem for many of you, it would seem, is that you're too stupid to properly operate the compatible and expandable system that Windows provides. Probably visiting the wrong websites to download some piece of software or not getting the good (and often free) AV scanners with web shields, and many other variables to consider.

Again, I've never had any of the issues you guys have been complaining about here.

So use your Macs, they're great machines. No doubt about it. But I'll keep firing away at my Windows... gaming, using Office, and all the other joys that come with using the world's most used system.

This turned more into a flame reply and I apologize. It's not meant to be that way. But my point stands. Mac is obviously more for users who don't know what they're doing.
While I generally agree with you (as a Mac user) I still think you should look more closely at your argument. First off, you should ask yourself whether or not all this knowledge that you presumably have should be necessary to operate a PC. There are still quite a lot of people with your level of knowledge but I think those type of people are simply getting less and less. Apple's "it just works" marketing is mostly true and many people would never bother with serious learning. Macs can do less than PCs, I'll give you that. But the things they do are generally more intuitive and dumbed-down, if you will. However, for many people this is enough.

Now in terms of reliability, Macs ARE more reliable than Windows machines. Mac OS is built on the Unix kernel. This IS a more stable foundation than Windows. It's why all seriously important software like power company energy management systems are almost exclusively run on Unix and not Windows. Windows does become slower with use and this is not really the case for Macs (or any Unix or Linux systems for that matter). Windows and its directories are a PITA and the systems does become bogged down over time.

Now a thought experiment: assume Macs cost the same as Windows PCs. Why should an ordinary user (Internet, Mail, Photos, Office....etc.) not buy a Mac?

All of my family has now switched to Macs and they couldn't be happier. I you constantly want to tinker with your system and worry about a lot of things then go the windows route. If you're short on time and simply want to actually use your computer then go with a Mac.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Astroboy907 View Post
In terms of price, hardware, and upgradability, I'm certainly considering a move to windows in my future. If apple won't let me upgrade a hard drive or RAM anymore, and expects me to spend $3k+ every two years, forget it. Razer blade 17" is looking pretty darn good ATM, even if it's expensive I can at least use it for a long while.
Why do you need a new $3000 Mac every two years?

If you're a serious Video/Photo/3D user and you're mostly submerged in these applications, then a Mac makes no sense. The Mac is great for everyday-use because of it's great interface and great usability. If you're just using Photoshop, for instance, then I don't think it's going to matter if that App is running on a Windows or Mac machine.
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Old Jan 21, 2014, 02:50 AM   #177
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In 1996 I tried a total shift to a Mac with awful results, keep in mind after 2006 the Mac version of Quicken is a castrated edition so you're stuck either running a virtual machine solution for Quicken or settle with a cheap PC.
Personally I gave up trying to stick with one OS over the other, if developers stopped butchering their software it wouldn't be a painful decision.

I only keep a PC around for three reasons:
--Quicken, cheaper to buy a PC w/Windows license than be held hostage with upgrading VMWare/Parallels every two or three years and waste $100 for a Windows license.
--Games, not all games have decent Mac ports and Wine wrappers are a crapshot if a new OS update/version breaks it (The Sims 3 & Spore are great examples)
--Pro Tools, I don't want to waste disk space on my Mac with this bloated piece of crap which only two friends of mine actually use.
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Old Jan 21, 2014, 04:40 PM   #178
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sometimes, but not really
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Old Jan 24, 2014, 01:34 PM   #179
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Since I use Windows at work

I know it's not something I'd want to use exclusively. It is fine for work and that's where it stays.

I admit when I was having trouble getting a good iMac in 2010, the thought crossed my mind for a day or two.

I love the simplicity of Apple's OS, and I like some knowledge of both platforms, but for personal use, Apple wins.
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Old Jan 27, 2014, 09:31 AM   #180
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sometimes. but then i remember all the bad things and laugh.
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Old Feb 3, 2014, 11:32 AM   #181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neddyteddy View Post
I just read this entire tread and to put it bluntly, and I'll go ahead and apologize now, you've pretty much proven my theory about Mac users right. Macs are for idiots.

And what I mean, specifically, Macs are for Windows idiots.
Untrue. I have tons of Windows experience, and, I still use Windows frequently because I am forced to to get access to certain software. Nevertheless, OS X is far superior from the ground up right to the GUI.

Quote:
Sure, less viruses blah blah blah but of course Windows will have more. It's a more widely used and compatible system, hands down. That's a no brainer. I have a lot of experience with Windows XP, Vista, 7, and 8. Linux Mint and Ubuntu, and of course Mac in various flavors. I'm a hardcore, HARDCORE, Windows user. I abuse the heck out of my systems. Why? Because they can handle it.
I guess by "compatible" you mean bug-for-bug, vulnerability-for-vulnerability compatible? Because OS X security for ordinary users is obviously superior.

Quote:
Originally Posted by osx11 View Post

Now a thought experiment: assume Macs cost the same as Windows PCs. Why should an ordinary user (Internet, Mail, Photos, Office....etc.) not buy a Mac?
There is a reason, and, I partly blame Apple for it. There is much more third-party software on Windows, and, even when there is an OS X package, such as Quicken, it isn't file-for-file feature-for-feature compatible. Apple could do much more to support and encourage third-party software developers like Intuit to support Mac users equally and compatibly with Windows. It is for this reason that I am stuck with a Windows machine alongside the Mac.

Quote:
Originally Posted by happyfrappy View Post
In 1996 I tried a total shift to a Mac with awful results, keep in mind after 2006 the Mac version of Quicken is a castrated edition so you're stuck either running a virtual machine solution for Quicken or settle with a cheap PC.
Personally I gave up trying to stick with one OS over the other, if developers stopped butchering their software it wouldn't be a painful decision.

I only keep a PC around for three reasons:
--Quicken, cheaper to buy a PC w/Windows license than be held hostage with upgrading VMWare/Parallels every two or three years and waste $100 for a Windows license.
--Games, not all games have decent Mac ports and Wine wrappers are a crapshot if a new OS update/version breaks it (The Sims 3 & Spore are great examples)
--Pro Tools, I don't want to waste disk space on my Mac with this bloated piece of crap which only two friends of mine actually use.
Precisely. I wish Apple would do more to work these issues with developers so that there would be interoperable, equivalent packages for Macs.
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Old Feb 3, 2014, 11:46 AM   #182
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Maybe for playing certain games but for everyday things, no.
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Old Feb 3, 2014, 08:15 PM   #183
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OS X just works. It is simple and elegant. Windows works, but sometimes in a clunky way.

However, not everything will work on a Mac. On Windows, you can make about everything work.
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Old Feb 4, 2014, 01:57 PM   #184
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I'll never switch back to the inefficient mess that is Windows. At least never for my personal computer. I enjoy not having to check for viruses, terrible battery life, and constant "updates" everytime I get on my computer. I just need it to work and that's what a Mac does.
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Old Feb 4, 2014, 02:46 PM   #185
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I am actually trying very hard to move from Windows to OSX.
My personal experience with Windows has been more than fine especially with XP and 7. But I do like the idea of a more elegant OS, the manner that installed software is not spread across everywhere as in Windows, that Windows does slow down due to bog over time. No real need for AV is cool too.

My hardware experience with a Win machine has been great. Yes I build my own gaming rigs, but laptops are great, never a hardware issue or failure. Yes, the odd freeze for 10 secs, that a Win thing that as crept in on my current laptop, probably due to uTorrent

The issue I have with a Mac is hardware quality control, it really is getting poor. I don't read MR to seek out hardware issues, but I see them a lot. Im scared to buy a retina MBP/Air due to the retention issues. Then there are the yellow tinge issues. PC's and Mac share the same hardware, they are Intel based machines using same CPU range, chipset range, etc, etc, but when Apple adds their own stuff or design. such as Retina, the quality control is poor. I just dont see hardware issues like this in the PC world. BTW I spent 3 years building PC's so I am aware.

My conclusion is that I realise I don't really need a Mac, or currently want one
due to the hardware issues, off course I would like one. I actually only WANT OSX. Its nice, elegant, and as above superior to the way Windows manages itself.

I may buy a refurb, I may buy an older MBP, but OSX yes, Mac no, at the moment
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Old Feb 5, 2014, 09:53 PM   #186
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Purchased Mac desktop in 2010 and had it partitioned into two 500 gigs with Windows 7 on one partition. I go to the Win side maybe once a month to catch up on an Access 7 database & couple of small Excel spreads. Do not like Windows, although used Win PCs from 1993 till 2010! Had I known in 2010 (first iMac) what I know now, I would have saved the needed data and recreated or converted to Mac apps. My next desktop will have no partitions... or minimal, at most, for other purposes. I find this Mac to be much more intuitive to use with many less problems. I've had some issues needing tech support to resolve, yet they've been few compared to previous experiences. I'm sold on the Apple family of products and have found peace with the proprietary nature of hardware & applications. I hope to remain an Apple fan for as long as possible.

This is a great site, btw!
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Old Feb 7, 2014, 05:32 PM   #187
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I switched for the time being. I was saving for a MacBook Pro (to replace my aging Mac mini) and then I found out some bad news from the school I'm going to in a couple months... They only allow students in the ITCS course to have Windows 8 laptops, and specifically said no MacBooks with Boot Camp. I don't understand their reasoning towards that but I won't fight it. I spent the MacBook Pro savings on an Asus Q301LA laptop which is a decent looking and performing laptop for the price.

Windows 8 isn't terrible to be honest. I'm enjoying the experience for the most part but still miss OS X.
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Old Feb 7, 2014, 05:37 PM   #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronm01 View Post
Purchased Mac desktop in 2010 and had it partitioned into two 500 gigs with Windows 7 on one partition. I go to the Win side maybe once a month to catch up on an Access 7 database & couple of small Excel spreads. Do not like Windows, although used Win PCs from 1993 till 2010! Had I known in 2010 (first iMac) what I know now, I would have saved the needed data and recreated or converted to Mac apps. My next desktop will have no partitions... or minimal, at most, for other purposes. I find this Mac to be much more intuitive to use with many less problems. I've had some issues needing tech support to resolve, yet they've been few compared to previous experiences. I'm sold on the Apple family of products and have found peace with the proprietary nature of hardware & applications. I hope to remain an Apple fan for as long as possible.

This is a great site, btw!
Nice post. You appear (correct me if I am wrong) to be referring more to OSX and Windows rather than hardware? I will, when I get a MBP/MBA not run Windows on it al all. I ill take the full conversion, and not use Bootcamp, I do have a high spec gaming rig running Win 7 if needed, but I like the idea of a full migration to OSX. Off course, for some users, there is a need for Windows
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Old Feb 7, 2014, 07:30 PM   #189
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Maybe I don't like change but the only Windows version I still enjoy using is Windows 2000. Everything seems so much more out of the way and more friendly to navigate.
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Old Feb 7, 2014, 09:27 PM   #190
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Went back to Mac

I have never owned a Windows computer, and have little experience of the environment.

The first computer I used was the original Mac, at university 1985 - 87. We also used pre Windows MS-DOS machines.

Upon leaving university it was nearly decade before I had anything to do with computers again, but that was intermittent, battling with Windows 95 & 98. It was mainly for e-mail at internet cafes. It wasn't till I started my present job in late in 2003 that I started to use computers regularly at work. They were, and still are Windows XP.

I soon wanted my own computer to work from home more. I didn't want a portable (still don't) but, having moved a lot in my live, I did want something that was easily transportable.

When the Mac Mini came out, it fitted my needs exactly. The first computer I owned was an early 2005 Mac, on which I used Microsoft Office for Mac.

Interestingly, those apps I used 20 years previously also came from Microsoft.

I am on to my second Mac, also a Mini. I installed iWork, which is what I use for most of my work. I also had Mac Office 2008 installed, but have only occasional call to use it. Last week, for instance, I took my Mini to work to set up with a projector for students to give presentations. Many used PowerPoint.

I reckon my future will remain Windowsless, and largely free of Microsoft. If I did look elsewhere, it would be Linux.

Last edited by Micky Do; Feb 7, 2014 at 09:36 PM.
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Old Feb 10, 2014, 11:57 AM   #191
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Originally Posted by Micky Do View Post
I have never owned a Windows computer, and have little experience of the environment.

The first computer I used was the original Mac, at university 1985 - 87. We also used pre Windows MS-DOS machines.

Upon leaving university it was nearly decade before I had anything to do with computers again, but that was intermittent, battling with Windows 95 & 98. It was mainly for e-mail at internet cafes. It wasn't till I started my present job in late in 2003 that I started to use computers regularly at work. They were, and still are Windows XP.

I soon wanted my own computer to work from home more. I didn't want a portable (still don't) but, having moved a lot in my live, I did want something that was easily transportable.

When the Mac Mini came out, it fitted my needs exactly. The first computer I owned was an early 2005 Mac, on which I used Microsoft Office for Mac.

Interestingly, those apps I used 20 years previously also came from Microsoft.

I am on to my second Mac, also a Mini. I installed iWork, which is what I use for most of my work. I also had Mac Office 2008 installed, but have only occasional call to use it. Last week, for instance, I took my Mini to work to set up with a projector for students to give presentations. Many used PowerPoint.

I reckon my future will remain Windowsless, and largely free of Microsoft. If I did look elsewhere, it would be Linux.

Do you have anything against Microsoft or Windows?

I think you should have some Windows experience some time in your life. More than 90% computers in the world run Windows, and you should consider using it as well, at least for gaining familiarity with a hugely popular platform. It will only add to your experience.

Said that, I never found Windows to be bad. I always managed to use it. Linux is the one I never managed to handle, no matter how hard I tried.
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Old Feb 11, 2014, 12:53 AM   #192
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Ehhhh..........no
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Old Feb 11, 2014, 09:48 AM   #193
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Originally Posted by skaertus View Post
Do you have anything against Microsoft or Windows?

I think you should have some Windows experience some time in your life. More than 90% computers in the world run Windows, and you should consider using it as well, at least for gaining familiarity with a hugely popular platform. It will only add to your experience.

Said that, I never found Windows to be bad. I always managed to use it. Linux is the one I never managed to handle, no matter how hard I tried.
Nothing against Windows or Microsoft, but I have little call to use them. I am not interested in 90% of the computers in the world (a figure that is in retreat now anyway). I just know the Mac and the Apple apps i use work fine for me…… and the Windows / Microsoft apps I have experienced have been a hassle by comparison.

Last edited by Micky Do; Feb 11, 2014 at 10:00 AM.
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