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Old May 14, 2013, 04:23 PM   #101
woodekm
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Had every iphone since 2007 except for the iPhone 5. I need a wider phone for the internet etc. . I have ZERO confidence that Apple will get a wider/larger screen, so I moved on. Couldn't be more thrilled with my HTC one.

Seems like every 3 or 4 months Samsung, HTC or (believe it or not blackberry) puts out larger phone, so there MUST be a market for them.
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Old May 14, 2013, 06:58 PM   #102
beosound3200
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woodekm View Post
Had every iphone since 2007 except for the iPhone 5. I need a wider phone for the internet etc. . I have ZERO confidence that Apple will get a wider/larger screen, so I moved on. Couldn't be more thrilled with my HTC one.

Seems like every 3 or 4 months Samsung, HTC or (believe it or not blackberry) puts out larger phone, so there MUST be a market for them.
there is, but its a relatively small one.

but really guys, you honestly think that phones above 4.5 inches came to fruition because the designers thought its a perfect size?

or was it the engineers who couldnt compete with iphone benchmarks (their main selling point - numbers)?

if apple is good at something, its miniaturisation. others just cant compete in the same size category. nonsense? check out this

think about it
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Old May 14, 2013, 08:15 PM   #103
lordofthereef
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beosound3200 View Post
there is, but its a relatively small one.

but really guys, you honestly think that phones above 4.5 inches came to fruition because the designers thought its a perfect size?

or was it the engineers who couldnt compete with iphone benchmarks (their main selling point - numbers)?

if apple is good at something, its miniaturisation. others just cant compete in the same size category. nonsense? check out this

think about it
In another thread, that chart was explained. It is very misleading. "Normal" encompasses up to a 4.8" screens, if I am not mistaken. Making the calculation even more vague, pixel density also plays a role.

Edit: I found te quote that I was referring to...


Quote:
Originally Posted by kdarling View Post
That's not correct for Normal. It goes more like 3.5" to 4.8". The charts are tricky to read, and more importantly, each manufacturer sets what their device displays.

When programming for Android, here are the categories that developers actually use:
  • Galaxy Mini (3.1") - small, ldpi
  • Galaxy Ace (3.5") - normal, mdpi
  • Galaxy S (4.0") - normal, hdpi
  • Galaxy S2 (4.3") - normal, hdpi
  • Galaxy S3 (4.8") - normal, xhdpi
  • Galaxy Nexus (4.65") - normal, xhdpi
  • Galaxy Note - large, xhdpi
  • Galaxy Nexus 7 - large, tvdpi
  • Galaxy Tab 10.1 - xlarge, mdpi

Notice that screens from 4.0" to 4.8" use the "normal/hdpi" and "normal/xhdpi" categories. Looking at the Android dashboard for those stats, you'll see that (37.9% + 25.0%)

= 62.9% of devices using the Play Market in the past two weeks are probably between 4.0" and 4.8".

However, the thing to remember is that the dashboard doesn't show "market share" or sales. It only shows who's currently hitting the Play Market, numbers which ... like those web / ad page hit stats that people often quote... do not tell us what is selling the most. So the actual percentage of those devices being sold is likely much less.

All I'm saying is, Market stats and web/ad stats, are all worthless when it comes to figuring out sales share. In fact, you need to already know the sales share in order to make sense of those access stats.
From this thread:http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1574695

At the time this was posted, it was news to me. Since then I learned xda devs site lists how google actually classified each handset connecting to the play store. Simply find the device on their site and it tells you screen size and dpi categories.
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Last edited by lordofthereef; May 14, 2013 at 08:39 PM.
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Old May 14, 2013, 09:01 PM   #104
kdarling
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Thank you, lordofthereef.

In addition, we constantly see the claim that "most Android phones sold are the cheap ones".

Well, first it depends on what we call "cheap". Heck, Android phones from $220 on up often have 4"+ screens. To me, "cheap" (as in inexpensive for emerging countries) is below $200.

Last quarter, Samsung had $29B in revenue for about 120 million phones, about 70 million of which were smartphones (24m Galaxy high end, 46m non-Galaxy). Using industry average for the dumbphones, we get:
  • $03B from 50 million dumbphones @ $60 avg
  • $13B from 24 million Galaxy @ $540 avg wholesale
  • $13B from 46 million non-Galaxy @$280 avg wholesale

Even if we claimed that half of the 46 million sold for $150 (= $3.5B), then the other half would have to average $420 apiece! No matter how we try to slice it, their average wholesale smartphone price is now much higher than what many people think. ( It's gone up a lot in just a year.)

Another note: Samsung is having a hard time fighting homegrown China & India smartphones, which sell for as low as $68. So even their low end sales are drying up in comparison, since Samsung smartphones start at around $125 wholesale.

Which begs the question, is it really necessary for Apple to build a super low priced phone? Apparently not. Nobody can defeat the native manufacturers, and the average for Samsung is much higher anyway. So those who predict around $350 might have the right idea after all.
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Old May 14, 2013, 09:06 PM   #105
beosound3200
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lordofthereef View Post
In another thread, that chart was explained. It is very misleading. "Normal" encompasses up to a 4.8" screens, if I am not mistaken. Making the calculation even more vague, pixel density also plays a role.

Edit: I found te quote that I was referring to...




From this thread:http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1574695

At the time this was posted, it was news to me. Since then I learned xda devs site lists how google actually classified each handset connecting to the play store. Simply find the device on their site and it tells you screen size and dpi categories.
then its smaller than i thought...

...based on a presumption that a buyer of a high-end phone (in android world that means larger) would be more likely to hit the play store, and taking into account the vast number of low end (small) android phones used as feature phones

maybe huge phones aren't as popular as they want us to think

can anyone remember when was that 50 million galaxy s3 sold mark?
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Old May 14, 2013, 09:14 PM   #106
lordofthereef
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beosound3200 View Post
then its smaller than i thought...

...based on a presumption that a buyer of a high-end phone (in android world that means larger) would be more likely to hit the play store, and taking into account the vast number of low end (small) android phones used as feature phones

maybe huge phones aren't as popular as they want us to think

can anyone remember when was that 50 million galaxy s3 sold mark?
I am not sure you can make that presumption. There are plenty of free apps on the store. The budget conscious can easily grab almost anything they need for free.

I hate to be the "Samsung apologist", but the fact of the matter is that there are various other android devices right on par with the S3. So the s3 isn't only competing with the iPhone, but every other android (I am not counting other os's with market share not even in the double digits). So the difference is simple. I want an iOS device, I am limited to three devices currently. I want an Android device, and my choices are virtually endless. A quick google search shows the sgs3 topped 40 million sales in January of this year. Frankly, that's an astounding number, all factors considered.
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Old May 14, 2013, 09:19 PM   #107
maxosx
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The long narrow display sets the iPhone apart from the competition. Apple likes to be different. This current display achieves that goal & avoids upsetting the rank & file.

If Apple reuses this same size again, the accessory case makers will hit the jackpot. There's thousands of choices. So both Apple & the companies that profit off the iPhone win big. That's what commerce is about. The customers will accept anything Apple tells them is the best. It all works out great.

It also provides a consistent experience & those who cannot afford to upgrade to the newest model aren't going to miss anything.
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Old May 14, 2013, 09:22 PM   #108
beosound3200
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lordofthereef View Post
I am not sure you can make that presumption. There are plenty of free apps on the store. The budget conscious can easily grab almost anything they need for free.

I hate to be the "Samsung apologist", but the fact of the matter is that there are various other android devices right on par with the S3. So the s3 isn't only competing with the iPhone, but every other android (I am not counting other os's with market share not even in the double digits). So the difference is simple. I want an iOS device, I am limited to three devices currently. I want an Android device, and my choices are virtually endless. A quick google search shows the sgs3 topped 40 million sales in January of this year. Frankly, that's an astounding number, all factors considered.
im just trying to gauge the large smartphones market, are they really that popular

but those numbers would be naturally skewed because no one but apple makes a high-end small phones

i just cant get across that throw it to the wall and see what sticks mentality and i wanna know do people really want huge phones or they just dont want apple and have no other choice
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Old May 14, 2013, 09:25 PM   #109
kdarling
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Re: screen sizes and prices. I ran across a report of the top UK phones sold last quarter:

Name:  2013q1_uk_sales.png
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First thing we note is that over 27% of the total phones sold were iPhone models.

The next is that at least 40% of the total phones sold had 4" or larger screens (it could be.. and probably is... more, since this only lists the top ten). At least 18% were 4.3" to 4.8". That's a pretty good market chunk.

Click image for larger version

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Then I decided to chart the relative popularity of only the Android phones in the top ten. Turns out the overwhelming majority of the most popular models are $400 and up.

Click image for larger version

Name:	uk_price_graph.png
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Here, the relative popularity of just the five Samsung phones in the top list:

Click image for larger version

Name:	uk_price_samsung.png
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ID:	412268

Now, this leaves out the other phones that didn't make it to the top ten list, and this is only for the UK, but it's still interesting to chart the most popular individual models.
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Old May 15, 2013, 10:09 AM   #110
n1pabs
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My 2p...

I've came back from a S3 and Nexus 4 to the iPhone 5...

I'll never look back, the iPhone size is just about right for ME. The Galaxy S2 was a good size at 4.3" but really that was stretching it (not a pun) anything bigger was uncomfortable.
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Old May 16, 2013, 10:53 AM   #111
Interstella5555
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Originally Posted by macingman View Post
You do know up to a bit a year before the 5 everyone said the iPhone would never get larger right?
And Bill Gates said no one would ever need more than 640k of memory, times change.
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