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Old Apr 22, 2013, 02:32 PM   #26
bradl
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Yes some would.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_McVeigh

People screamed for his blood too. Couldn't send him to Gitmo because this was pre-9/11.
But the point here is that both McVeigh and Nichols were residents/citizens, and as such, entitled to due process. BTW, Guantanamo existed will prior to 9/11, though not totally as a detention site.

So all of a sudden, despite being a resident and citizen, Tsarnaev isn't entitled to that? What if his name was Jason Neidler (I just made that name up, nothing significant about it)? Does it really have to come down to what is in a name?

Either way, the AP just reported that the White House re-issued a statement stating that Tsarnaev will not be treated as an enemy combatant, as well has officially charged, and as being charged, has been read his Miranda Rights.

Again, an over-reactive jaunt by a bloodthirsty Senator.

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Old Apr 22, 2013, 03:11 PM   #27
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So how do you decide what to jurisdiction (city/county/state/fed) to charge someone under? Honest question.
Believe it or not, some things illegal at the state level do not also have a Federal statute against them. A good example is simple murder against an ordinary citizen. Timothy McVeigh was charged and convicted in Federal court of murdering Federal agents; the Federal court had no jurisdiction to charge him for the other victims. For those deaths, he would have been charged under Oklahoma law.

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So all of a sudden, despite being a resident and citizen, Tsarnaev isn't entitled to that? What if his name was Jason Neidler (I just made that name up, nothing significant about it)? Does it really have to come down to what is in a name?
As I understand it, they're invoking an "imminent threat" clause to avoid reading him his Miranda rights, presumably to find out whether there are any other bombs anywhere, any plans by any of his associates to carry out any more terroristic acts, etc. None of this means that he doesn't actually have those rights, simply that they're not going to encourage him to use them.
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Old Apr 22, 2013, 03:18 PM   #28
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Terrorist acts do harm the nation.
But your definition says it has to be furthering the interests of another nation. This is clearly not furthering the interests of either Dagestan or Chechnya.
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Old Apr 22, 2013, 03:34 PM   #29
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This guy should just shut his mouth and let the people who's job it is to do this do their jobs.

What's up with senators trying to stick their nose into everything lately? It's not like they have a job they should be doing or anything.
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Old Apr 22, 2013, 03:40 PM   #30
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This guy should just shut his mouth and let the people who's job it is to do this do their jobs.

What's up with senators trying to stick their nose into everything lately? It's not like they have a job they should be doing or anything.
Got him lots of airtime, and media attention...no?

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Old Apr 23, 2013, 01:07 PM   #31
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But your definition says it has to be furthering the interests of another nation. This is clearly not furthering the interests of either Dagestan or Chechnya.
Valid point. Whether we want to execute him for a terrorist act, treason and murder, the end result will be the same. As a rule I don't support Capital Punishment.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 01:33 PM   #32
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Valid point. Whether we want to execute him for a terrorist act, treason and murder, the end result will be the same. As a rule I don't support Capital Punishment.
As a rule? How very indefinite of you.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 02:09 PM   #33
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The guy was shot in the mouth, the bullet exited the back of his neck. He's going to be very popular in prison.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 02:24 PM   #34
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The guy was shot in the mouth, the bullet exited the back of his neck. He's going to be very popular in prison.
If. I say IF he survives my guess would be in a special prison for these types.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 02:27 PM   #35
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If. I say IF he survives my guess would be in a special prison for these types.
Although total speculation on my part, my guess is wherever he goes, he will spend his time in Segregation, not General Population...where his life expectancy would be measured in seconds.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 04:48 PM   #36
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As a rule? How very indefinite of you.
Yes, if you ask me about capital punishment, I'm against it. Just leaving a crack for consideration purposes.
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Old May 2, 2013, 02:32 PM   #37
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Old May 4, 2013, 04:23 PM   #38
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Believe it or not, some things illegal at the state level do not also have a Federal statute against them. A good example is simple murder against an ordinary citizen. Timothy McVeigh was charged and convicted in Federal court of murdering Federal agents; the Federal court had no jurisdiction to charge him for the other victims. For those deaths, he would have been charged under Oklahoma law.



As I understand it, they're invoking an "imminent threat" clause to avoid reading him his Miranda rights, presumably to find out whether there are any other bombs anywhere, any plans by any of his associates to carry out any more terroristic acts, etc. None of this means that he doesn't actually have those rights, simply that they're not going to encourage him to use them.
What's funny, is that conservatives often quote statements regarding liberty, and that liberty should not be sacrificed for safety.

Yet in cases like this, they're willing to have liberty be thrown out the window for "safety".
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Old May 4, 2013, 06:21 PM   #39
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...they're willing to have liberty be thrown out the window for "safety".
I don't know whom you're talking about. He wasn't denied any of his rights; he just wasn't informed of them. As I understand it, if he were to have spoken up about any other hypothetical devices, that information could not have been used against him. In the end, I suppose they felt as if they had enough evidence to convict him on the Marathon bombings.
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Old May 4, 2013, 08:33 PM   #40
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I don't know whom you're talking about.
The "rights" being referred to were probably not his miranda rights since he has in fact been mirandized after being formally changed. However if he was sent to Cuba as an enemy combatant he would be deprived of rights to a trial and such which he gets as an American citizen. That is what Graham wants.
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