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Old Aug 11, 2013, 02:51 PM   #26
cambookpro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CelestialToys View Post
Giff gaff doesn't offer true unlimited with tethering
Doesn't offer tethering, I'll give you that, but their data is truly unlimited.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 03:08 PM   #27
CelestialToys
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Originally Posted by cambookpro View Post
Doesn't offer tethering, I'll give you that, but their data is truly unlimited.
if it doesn't include tethering it's not true unlimited in my book, it's restricted to only my phone. Besides that three uk offer twice the amount of minutes for the same price...

There's a reason why three are the only company giff gaff don't compare to on their website
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 03:09 PM   #28
cambookpro
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What's so good about buying an iPhone outright?

Quote:
Originally Posted by CelestialToys View Post
if it doesn't include tethering it's not true unlimited in my book, it's restricted to only my phone. Besides that three uk offer twice the amount of minutes for the same price...
Yeah, 3 provide great value but their coverage is sub-par in my experience compared to O2/gg, at least when I last tried it last year.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 03:21 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by cambookpro View Post
Yeah, 3 provide great value but their coverage is sub-par in my experience compared to O2/gg, at least when I last tried it last year.
I can't disagree with you there, O2/gg definitely have better general coverage, however their networks are often choked ( probably because it's shared between O2, giffgaff, and Tesco)

I'm fortunate in that I live in an area with good 3 coverage so it doesn't really cause me any issues apart from when I visit my gran, but she lives in a deadspot for every carrier except Vodaphone, and I won't ever go back to them.

anyhow we've strayed well off topic so we best leave this here
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 03:23 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by cambookpro View Post
Yeah, 3 provide great value but their coverage is sub-par in my experience compared to O2/gg, at least when I last tried it last year.
Do a lot of travelling? I'm also in berks and find 3 better than vodafone who have their head office just down the road and are meant to have the best(?) coverage! Better is probably a little biased, to be perfectly honest, they both work 99.9% of the places I go.
I did convince a local friend to switch to 3 a while ago, who cancelled quite quickly after discovering his reception was non existent while inside his home (which didn't on his previous O2 account).
Then again, I get a single bar with 3 at my dads in remote Surrey, while his O2 handset and my vodafone handset get nothing.

My point? No idea! You're screwed whatever you do I think, need to try before you buy with a load of sims in whatever handset you're planning on using!
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 03:27 PM   #31
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Do a lot of travelling? I'm also in berks and find 3 better than vodafone who have their head office just down the road and are meant to have the best(?) coverage! Better is probably a little biased, to be perfectly honest, they both work 99.9% of the places I go.
I did convince a local friend to switch to 3 a while ago, who cancelled quite quickly after discovering his reception was non existent while inside his home (which didn't on his previous O2 account).
Then again, I get a single bar with 3 at my dads in remote Surrey, while his O2 handset and my vodafone handset get nothing.

My point? No idea! You're screwed whatever you do I think, need to try before you buy with a load of sims in whatever handset you're planning on using!
I know what you mean, it's impossible to tell really what kind of signal you're going to get

Although I'm in Berks in the Reading area, I found that at my school I only get three bars max and a lot of buildings I get nothing. With giffgaff, it hovers around three bars but I always have service. At home with 3 (only 3ish miles away from school) it was fine.

O2/gg also seem much better in Alton, where I go fairly often to see my grandparents. However, I did find 3's 3G to be quicker.

It all boils down to where you go and what you need, unless you want to take 5 SIMs wherever you go



Sorry Squilly, back on topic.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 03:30 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by VoR View Post
Comes off a little isolated and arrogant? I don't know your situation there too well either, I'm trying to help - Maybe you should read my posts carefully, because as I stated getting a great deal on a phone contract isn't 'the norm' for everyone outside of the US, it's the exception - Truth is, most people don't know how to shop (or even that these deals exist). I pay less than a quarter of what the vast majority of my friends do, and get far more. I normally get 'searching for a deal or getting cashback is too much effort' excuses, but for anyone that posts on a tech forum, we're literally talking a few minutes for potentially 100's of savings.
Sorry, did not mean it like that. I guess if I was outside of the USA I too would buy off contract.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 03:36 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by tmagman View Post
if you have plans to travel internationally and just want to flip a sim card in, or don't want to be tied down to a carrier, buying it outright directly from apple means you get an unlocked unit and is the only way i'll buy any phone.
This. Some people don't live all of their life in a single region.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 05:26 PM   #34
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It depends OP. I for one will go another two year contract (Pay $199.00, and save a bundle on paying full) since Verizon in my area is good, do not like paid plans on carriers not up to par, Verizon is usually very good around the U.S. and I for one do not plan on leaving the country, and if I did I will leave the phone at home. Been over the pound a couple of times and never needed a smartphone.... Ever.

If you are the same, go the contract rout. If not...You know
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 05:55 PM   #35
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Unfortunately in US, those who pay full price, pay twice for it. First you have initial cost. Then you have the same monthly payment to Verizon, AT&T, etc, for service as those who bought it with a subsidy. So those who got it for $199 with contract come out ahead on the cost of the phone. Sure with full price you can walk away anytime and go to a different carrier, but you pay the same price on a month to month basis. Then you have incompatible LTE between the carriers, so if you want to switch and have LTE, you have to sell your current phone, and then pay full price again.
Most people in the USA are on family plans and most also have corporate discounts.

I have 4 lines plus 24% discount. My total cost including unlimited data on 4 smartphone lines was $210 a month for post paid plan.

That works out to about $52 per line for unlimited text/data and 700 min plus rollover plus any mobile (essentially unlimited minutes).

Plus ATT also gives me upwards to a $400 subsidy per line every 24 months.

Don't think Americans are stupid. $52 a line that includes taxes and a subsidy is a good deal.

In Europe and Asia there aren't any true family plans that offer significant savings like in the USA.

The stats don't lie. Something like 60% of Americans are on family lines and 88% are on family lines and or also have corporate discounts.

When Verizon and ATT brag about have 100 million customers. That has come back to haunt them cause many of those lines 2-5 are really family lines which generate far less revenue than the primary line yet lines 2-5 all receive the same $400 subsidy as the primary lines.

The big carriers are trying to figure out a way to generate more revenue yet their hands are tied since their real growth in customers have been through family lines.

But if they make family lines expensive than they risk losing customers to prepaid like Tmobile USA and straight talk etc.

They are in a catch-22 situation. Those is reason they are trying to make upgrades 24
Months instead of 12-18 months in the past. 12 month upgrades for their best customers used to be the norm but they got rid of that almost 2 years ago.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 06:16 PM   #36
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For me, there is no good reason to buy an iPhone or any other phone outright.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 08:00 PM   #37
darster
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Originally Posted by aneftp View Post
Most people in the USA are on family plans and most also have corporate discounts.

I have 4 lines plus 24% discount. My total cost including unlimited data on 4 smartphone lines was $210 a month for post paid plan.

That works out to about $52 per line for unlimited text/data and 700 min plus rollover plus any mobile (essentially unlimited minutes).

Plus ATT also gives me upwards to a $400 subsidy per line every 24 months.

Don't think Americans are stupid. $52 a line that includes taxes and a subsidy is a good deal.

In Europe and Asia there aren't any true family plans that offer significant savings like in the USA.

The stats don't lie. Something like 60% of Americans are on family lines and 88% are on family lines and or also have corporate discounts.

When Verizon and ATT brag about have 100 million customers. That has come back to haunt them cause many of those lines 2-5 are really family lines which generate far less revenue than the primary line yet lines 2-5 all receive the same $400 subsidy as the primary lines.

The big carriers are trying to figure out a way to generate more revenue yet their hands are tied since their real growth in customers have been through family lines.

But if they make family lines expensive than they risk losing customers to prepaid like Tmobile USA and straight talk etc.

They are in a catch-22 situation. Those is reason they are trying to make upgrades 24
Months instead of 12-18 months in the past. 12 month upgrades for their best customers used to be the norm but they got rid of that almost 2 years ago.
Most don't have 24% discounts. 10% to 15% is probably the norm. A $210 phone bill per month is crazy, no matter how many lines you have. $2500 yearly phone bill is absurd for a family. And many families that pay that price also say they can't afford health insurance at that same price.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 08:02 PM   #38
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Most don't have 24% discounts. 10% to 15% is probably the norm. A $210 phone bill per month is crazy, no matter how many lines you have. $2500 yearly phone bill is absurd for a family. And many families that pay that price also say they can't afford health insurance at that same price.
Do you live in the States?
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 08:15 PM   #39
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I don't plan leaving ATT and will spend the same on my monthly bill anyway so why not let ATT help pay for my phone? Silly not to in my situation IMHO.

But for those that company jump a lot it's a no brainer to purchase outright.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 08:20 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by darster View Post
Most don't have 24% discounts. 10% to 15% is probably the norm. A $210 phone bill per month is crazy, no matter how many lines you have. $2500 yearly phone bill is absurd for a family. And many families that pay that price also say they can't afford health insurance at that same price.
Don't look at the $210 number.

Look at the average cost per line. $52-53 per line with data and text.

In the old days many families would pay $30-40 for a landline plus pay long distance costs. So I remember our family landline bill being $60-70 routinely each month.

Now landlines are dying. I only have one because its inclided in triple play package or else i wouldn't need it at all except for a few faxes i use each month.

Imagine a young adult in old days having to have landline and paying $40 a month. Now most young adults are on their family plans. So $52-53 isn't a lot per individual plus the subsidy.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 08:28 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by darster View Post
Most don't have 24% discounts. 10% to 15% is probably the norm. A $210 phone bill per month is crazy, no matter how many lines you have. $2500 yearly phone bill is absurd for a family. And many families that pay that price also say they can't afford health insurance at that same price.
I agree. As a military personnel I got %15 from att. Still paying 90 a month with the discount. Had to move to aio prepaid for 40 bucks a month.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 08:33 PM   #42
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This is the unlocking part. In the U.S., that's not a reason to buy unsubsidized. The U.S. carrier, after a couple of payments will unlock it for you for International travel, but NOT unlock for domestic, direct-competition carriers.

And then third-party unlock seems easy and cheap enough.



I really don't buy this, for most people. So how many choices of carriers do you have, and every carrier has goods and bads. U like a carrier, u tend to stay with it. You make it sound like switching fast good outlets.
I called AT&T about this and they said they do not unlock in-contract phones regardless of reason, not even for international travel. (Unless you're getting deployed in the military.)
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 08:48 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by 12vElectronics View Post
Lets be real.. the average joe buying an iPhone is not traveling all their lives.
IMO, the Average Joe is also not buying their iPhone outright, either.

Paying AT&T or Verizon's international data fee when traveling internationally for just one week a year is expensive enough to warranty buying an iPhone outright, to get it unlocked.

A quick forum search for "prepaid SIM" shows the topic usually comes up several times a month.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 09:26 PM   #44
darster
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Originally Posted by 12vElectronics View Post
Do you live in the States?
Yes
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 09:56 PM   #45
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I called AT&T about this and they said they do not unlock in-contract phones regardless of reason, not even for international travel. (Unless you're getting deployed in the military.)
AT&T is stupid, lots of times their left hand doesn't know what their right hand is doing. So the heck with them and use a third party unlocker.
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Old Aug 12, 2013, 09:12 AM   #46
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Originally Posted by Squilly View Post
Don't carriers still get their full contract prices but the difference is you can leave whenever you want?
Covered in prior posts but to sum up:
  • Not subject to ETF
  • Can use cheaper prepaid services
  • Typically fully unlocked for domestic and international use
  • Can retain grandfathered plan/features

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squilly View Post
Side note: if I sold my current phone under contract, could I deactivate it, buy another, and add it to my current contract or am I subject to a cancellation fee?
Yup. Contract is always on the service -- not the device. Contract comes with the subsidized device but it's on the service.

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Originally Posted by Mrbobb View Post
I really don't buy this, for most people. So how many choices of carriers do you have, and every carrier has goods and bads. U like a carrier, u tend to stay with it. You make it sound like switching fast good outlets.
You don't have to. One person not seeing the point in something doesn't mean that others don't see the point. The universe doesn't revolve around any one single person despite how that one perspective may make it appear so.
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