So many tech savies hate iPad 2 why?

[Davichi]

People complain about iPad 2 ram.
People complain about how iPad 2 only starts with 16GB memory. But, yet, everyone says 16GB will be enough.
People complain about iPad 2 has crappy cameras. People will hold 10 inch tablet to take pictures.
People complain about ipad 2's display.
People complain about iOS 4.3, but 5.0 has not been shown yet.

These tech savies talk about how much Xoom is better than iPad 2, but they are not buying xoom, either. So, why do they trash talk about iPad 2 like some of you are doing in this forum?

Why are people so ignorant? Why do you all ask specs that don't even make sense on tablet, but not willing to pay more money for it?

[saving107]

Because people are never satisfied with what they are given, they always want more.

I agree that at $499, their is no way Apple can include a Retina Display, 5MP Back/2MP Front Camera, 1GB Ram and Minimum 32GB of storage. People are just mad that their fantasy wish list didn't come true.

[Imsuperjp]

I think they are more apple haters than actual iPad haters

[fertilized-egg]

Originally Posted by Imsuperjp

I think they are more apple haters than actual iPad haters

Yup that's what I think too. They scream about specs but if Apple has a hardware spec better than others', those haters don't mention it, in this case the GPU and the display quality.

As somewhat of a pseudo techy I'm salivating at the games that'll come out utilizing the iPad 2's GPU which seems absolutely blazing fast.

[53x12]

I have no problems with the iPad 2.

[grawk]

The main thing is the ipad doesn't focus on being "nerd friendly". It doesn't maximize specs for no reason, it doesn't require "skill" to use. It's accessible, attractive, and usable. It works for 90% of what most people need. Even "uber geeks". But it doesn't provide bragging rights for people who like to measure and benchmark.

[RadicalxEdward]

Part of the mentality behind specs is that software can improve after the fact while hardware doesn't.

buy the ipad 2 and you'll always have crappy cams on it (which isn't a big deal for normal photography, but say you wanna scan a barcode or something, there's no autofocus) even if the software gets better

with something like the xoom, (more memory, better cams, etc) the software may be mediocre right now, but it will definitely improve with time and the hardware is there to back it up along the way.

Doesn't mean the xoom is better it's just a different way of thinking about the experience, planning for down the road (xoom), or getting the best of what's out now (iPad 2).

[wfj5444]

A lot of 'nerds' (I can say that since I have a CS degree and too many certs to talk about) care only about specs.

The more experience I get the more I realize its all about function, design, etc. Numbers don't matter, how it works matters.

[urkel]

Originally Posted by Davichi

These tech savies talk about how much Xoom is better than iPad 2, but they are not buying xoom, either. So, why do they trash talk about iPad 2 like some of you are doing in this forum?

Why are people so ignorant? Why do you all ask specs that don't even make sense on tablet, but not willing to pay more money for it?

So you feel its impossible for an Apple fan to also be capable of thinking for themselves or worry about their own consumer needs rather than Apple's bottom line? Maybe you should reconsider who you call "ignorant" since youre the one throwing the blanket statements on everyone.

As for the question on hand, RadicalxEdward has a great answer. As CONSUMERS then we shouldnt settle for specs that are "good enough for now". We should expect a product to last beyond the next generation. So while the iPad does a fantastic job at being future-forward with processor speeds and design, hardware shortcomings like the camera can't be improved through software updates and developers wont write apps for hardware that isn't there.

[fertilized-egg]

Originally Posted by RadicalxEdward

Part of the mentality behind specs is that software can improve after the fact while hardware doesn't.

But there's no question Apple will also keep improving the iPad's software just as they did since the release of the iPad 1 and will be so with the upcoming 5.0.

Also one thing I don't get is that the core Xoom hardware simply isn't that much ahead. It's got the same CPU, more RAM and a slower GPU. If the Xoom had a much more powerful processor I'd think differently, but seeing how the Galaxy Tab and older Tegra2 tablets are now and how the iPad 1 has improved significantly in about a year, I don't really buy that argument the Android tablets have much more headroom for the future.

[drewyboy]

Originally Posted by RadicalxEdward

Part of the mentality behind specs is that software can improve after the fact while hardware doesn't.

buy the ipad 2 and you'll always have crappy cams on it (which isn't a big deal for normal photography, but say you wanna scan a barcode or something, there's no autofocus) even if the software gets better

with something like the xoom, (more memory, better cams, etc) the software may be mediocre right now, but it will definitely improve with time and the hardware is there to back it up along the way.

Doesn't mean the xoom is better it's just a different way of thinking about the experience, planning for down the road (xoom), or getting the best of what's out now (iPad 2).

I normally don't call people out but that statement about upgradability is just plain wrong. What android phone can be updated for 3 continuous years with the newest android? Non that I am currently aware of right now. Yet iPhone 3G has gone through iOS 2.0, 3.0 and now 4.0. Not claiming 4.0 works amazing on it, I don't have a 3G and don't know how well it works with the current 4.3. I am willing to put money down that the XOOM will not be able to handle 3 years of of software upgrading, yet I'm sure the iPad 2 will go 5.0, 6.0 and wouldn't be surprised if it just makes 7.0. My point is, XOOM appears to be upgradable, but I'm sure in a year from now when it's 4.0 or 4.5 however freak'n fast google pumps out new version... so lets just say a year from now, when ppl try to update the software, it'll be like, "I'm having so many problems upgrading to android X.X".

It's a reason I give kudo's to apple and why I like their products is because I know that I will get software updates for quite awhile that will work on my products. Its a beautiful thing to be in control of the software and hardware my friend. Optimization.

[RadicalxEdward]

Originally Posted by fertilized-egg

But there's no question Apple will also keep improving the iPad's software just as they did since the release of the iPad 1 and will be so with the upcoming 5.0.

Also one thing I don't get is that the core Xoom hardware simply isn't that much ahead. It's got the same CPU, more RAM and a slower GPU. If the Xoom had a much more powerful processor I'd think differently, but seeing how the Galaxy Tab and older Tegra2 tablets are now and how the iPad 1 has improved significantly in about a year, I don't really buy that argument the Android tablets have much more headroom for the future.

Apple will keep improving the software but it won't make the back camera have autofocus (that really bugs me)

Android tablets may not have WAY better hardware specs, but they are better. 1GB RAM vs 512MB type stuff. BUT that doesn't mean the software will really improve everything, for instance, an app might run better on an ipad than an android tablet with more memory just because the hardware landscape is so much smaller for apple products that they could be optimized easier.

That's why experience is Apple's #1 concern and not specs.

[RadicalxEdward]

Originally Posted by drewyboy

I normally don't call people out but that statement about upgradability is just plain wrong. What android phone can be updated for 3 continuous years with the newest android? Non that I am currently aware of right now. Yet iPhone 3G has gone through iOS 2.0, 3.0 and now 4.0. Not claiming 4.0 works amazing on it, I don't have a 3G and don't know how well it works with the current 4.3. I am willing to put money down that the XOOM will not be able to handle 3 years of of software upgrading, yet I'm sure the iPad 2 will go 5.0, 6.0 and wouldn't be surprised if it just makes 7.0. My point is, XOOM appears to be upgradable, but I'm sure in a year from now when it's 4.0 or 4.5 however freak'n fast google pumps out new version... so lets just say a year from now, when ppl try to update the software, it'll be like, "I'm having so many problems upgrading to android X.X".

It's a reason I give kudo's to apple and why I like their products is because I know that I will get software updates for quite awhile that will work on my products. Its a beautiful thing to be in control of the software and hardware my friend. Optimization.

I agree with you 100%, I was trying to point out peoples THOUGHTS about specs on android tabs vs the ipad, not the reality. The reality is what you said and that's why I love my iphone and apple products. Cause I know they're not gonna get dropped 6 months after I buy them. We're just now getting to the point where updates aren't really applying to my iPhone 3G (which is basically the same internals as the original iphone) and we're on the verge of iPhone 5. Whereas there's android/winmo phones that come out that won't support the very next version of their os.

[ehoui]

I don't mind reading the various opinions about the Xoom, Tab, rooted Nook Color, iPad and iPad2 here.

What I'm beginning to notice is that:
1) If you favor the iPad instead of [Android Device], then
a) You are a fanboy;
b) You are a sheep;
c) You are wrong;
d) You are afraid;
e) Any of the above

2) You can't criticize [Android Device] for its flaws because it's open, features to be delivered soon, hypocritical because the ipad has/had flaws,...

3) You can't argue that something is better with less "specs" because [Android Device] will ultimately be better in the end, so specs can be the only differentiator[?]

4) It is wrong to say positive things about Apple because
a) Steve Jobs is a horrible man who screws us all every chance he gets
b) Apple "taxes" us ... (without representation???)
c) Apple use substandard components (and damn them for creating a better experience for some of us)
d) Apple doesn't give away things for free.
e) Apple puts a gun to our heads and makes us buy their products
f) They are a monopoly
g) They are anticompetitive
h) They steal from the good honest folks at Microsoft, Nokia, Motorola, etc.
i) Submit patents which are obvious and should be open to all;
j) Any answer from point #1

5) You can't respond to a criticism of [Apple Device] because,
a) Any answer from #1
b) Any answer from #4

Ergo, there is no rational basis to be on this site. So we should close the shop up. Last person turn out the lights on the way out.

[fertilized-egg]

Originally Posted by RadicalxEdward

Apple will keep improving the software but it won't make the back camera have autofocus (that really bugs me)

Sure but that's right now. You don't need better software to take advantage of that feature. Although an iMovie-like app would help.

Originally Posted by RadicalxEdward

Android tablets may not have WAY better hardware specs, but they are better. 1GB RAM vs 512MB type stuff.

First, with different OS we don't really know how the RAM affects the performance since they handle things differently although I would definitely love having more. Second the iPad has a GPU that should be significantly faster than the Xoom's. Tech savies love to argue about GPU specs on video cards and consoles, and the GPU acceleration is a big thing in the tablets in all apps as well as games. How come nobody talks about it?

If the Xoom had a faster GPU, the Apple haters would've been talking about it to no end but all of sudden the faster GPU speed doesn't matter since Apple has the upper hand.

It's just like that in the comment section of tech websites. If an Apple product gets 4/5, 9/10, etc in a review, everyone goes there to bash the writer of being a biased Apple fanboy. When a non-Apple product - Android or even Nokia Symbian, RIM, doesn't matter - product gets high scores, suddenly it's all because of the products' merit, nothing to do with the bias.

[darngooddesign]

Everything's amazing and nobody's happy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r1CZTLk-Gk

[Zcott]

Haters gonna hate.

[leisenstein]

Originally Posted by wfj5444

A lot of 'nerds' (I can say that since I have a CS degree and too many certs to talk about) care only about specs.

The more experience I get the more I realize its all about function, design, etc. Numbers don't matter, how it works matters.

Completely true. I remember before the iPad 1 came out, it was going to be a complete failure unless it had:
1. 2GB RAM
2. Ran Snow Leopard
3. etc

It happens with all electronics. "If this tablet doesn't run a full OS, with 8GB RAM, 1GB video, Photoshop, Halo, under 1lb, and cost under $200,
THEN its obviously a COMPLETE FAILURE, and no one will buy it."

If specs were king, no one would have bought the Nintendo DS over the PSP.
Or the Wii over Xbox
Or VHS over Beta.

[RadicalxEdward]

Originally Posted by fertilized-egg

Sure but that's right now. You don't need better software to take advantage of that feature. Although an iMovie-like app would help.



First, with different OS we don't really know how the RAM affects the performance since they handle things differently although I would definitely love having more. Second the iPad has a GPU that should be significantly faster than the Xoom's. Tech savies love to argue about GPU specs on video cards and consoles, and the GPU acceleration is a big thing in the tablets in all apps as well as games. How come nobody talks about it?

If the Xoom had a faster GPU, the Apple haters would've been talking about it to no end but all of sudden the faster GPU speed doesn't matter since Apple has the upper hand.

It's just like that in the comment section of tech websites. If an Apple product gets 4/5, 9/10, etc in a review, everyone goes there to bash the writer of being a biased Apple fanboy. When a non-Apple product - Android or even Nokia Symbian, RIM, doesn't matter - product gets high scores, suddenly it's all because of the products' merit, nothing to do with the bias.

Dude why are you still going? I AGREE WITH YOU.

FACT: 1GB of ram on the ipad would be nice vs 512mb if it didn't affect price.
FACT: having 1GB of ram doesn't mean anything will work better/run faster.

Man, it's ridiculous trying to have real discussions in these forums without everyone just looking for something to argue over. or maybe that's just the point.

[alt]

Because iOS is VERY LIMITING to people with real tech needs. There are a lot of tools that could be useful for say (network admins) that apple will not allow that are available when jailbroken however. It's dumb. I will still buy one though probably

[drewyboy]

Originally Posted by RadicalxEdward

I agree with you 100%, I was trying to point out peoples THOUGHTS about specs on android tabs vs the ipad, not the reality.

I'm sorry, I didn't realize that. This is why I usually just keep my mouth shut rather than calling ppl out, because when I do, I act the fool. Anyways, press on Apple w/ the iPad 2 & iOS 5.... for the record, I wish a slightly better cam would have been nice, but I was just waiting for any type of camera.

[iserian]

I'd be willing to pay a bit more if it meant they scrapped the CRAP camera's for at least the VIP4 cameras.

[soa]

Originally Posted by ehoui

I don't mind reading the various opinions about the Xoom, Tab, rooted Nook Color, iPad and iPad2 here.

What I'm beginning to notice is that:
1) If you favor the iPad instead of [Android Device], then
a) You are a fanboy;
b) You are a sheep;
c) You are wrong;
d) You are afraid;
e) Any of the above

2) You can't criticize [Android Device] for its flaws because it's open, features to be delivered soon, hypocritical because the ipad has/had flaws,...

3) You can't argue that something is better with less "specs" because [Android Device] will ultimately be better in the end, so specs can be the only differentiator[?]

4) It is wrong to say positive things about Apple because
a) Steve Jobs is a horrible man who screws us all every chance he gets
b) Apple "taxes" us ... (without representation???)
c) Apple use substandard components (and damn them for creating a better experience for some of us)
d) Apple doesn't give away things for free.
e) Apple puts a gun to our heads and makes us buy their products
f) They are a monopoly
g) They are anticompetitive
h) They steal from the good honest folks at Microsoft, Nokia, Motorola, etc.
i) Submit patents which are obvious and should be open to all;
j) Any answer from point #1

5) You can't respond to a criticism of [Apple Device] because,
a) Any answer from #1
b) Any answer from #4

Ergo, there is no rational basis to be on this site. So we should close the shop up. Last person turn out the lights on the way out.

You are right, in a perfect world the device with better specs will be a better product. but that's not the world we live in. In our world, you gotta do more with less, that's how you be competitive. I'm not willing to spend MORE money on something that works LESS well, even if they put the specs through the roof, as long as it doesn't work well, I'm not getting it. therefore, i'm not buying a Xoom, I will buy an iPad 2 tomorrow.

[deeddawg]

Originally Posted by wfj5444

A lot of 'nerds' (I can say that since I have a CS degree and too many certs to talk about) care only about specs.

The more experience I get the more I realize its all about function, design, etc. Numbers don't matter, how it works matters.

Yeah, it's called "growing up".

Specs matter most when the rest of the ecosystem is the same. c.f. Windows PCs.

When the OS and entire app / distribution ecosystem is different, the raw specs don't matter so much as the end-user experience. The simple reason is that the efficiency of using those specs likely differs.

The other factor often overlooked is the end-user's needs. If existing specs are far greater than a user needs, as is true on many laptops/desktops in terms of the general user base, then an increase in the specs is not necessarily meaningful.

The usual counter to this is that people want to "future proof" their purchase by buying more than they need today; something the retailers/manufacturers gladly reinforce. If the user is active in an area where application developers are continually pushing the envelope (such as PC shooter games), then that may make sense. Outside that area, say for general office applications, email, web surfing, etc. that don't tax the system, it doesn't generally make sense.

[King Luis]

Originally Posted by Zcott

Haters gonna hate.

this. people will hate because they can.

"nerds" do not like apple products because they are simple and easy to use. "nerds" use a hacked/customized version of windows or a unix os because they offer a higher amount of customization (in regards to programming) and the ability to tinker easily with the system OS. thats my opinion.
you offer them something like an ipad that is not open based and is simplistic then they will hate it.

i like it because it's fast, responsive, and easy to use. i want to pick it up, go to a website and check some information and put it down.