Hex 3.2 update from 2010 quad 2.8 photos new! CPU to use!

[Joshuarocks]

Originally Posted by sskino

Thanks! I'll definitely have to check it out. I downloaded another tool called Temperature monitor and tested my temp ranges. At idle the CPU sits around 97-100 degrees (F) and using the CPU Test tool that you used above it maxed out around 129 degrees (F). Not too bad. Seems to be holding up well.

Not much of an increase from what you got out of the 3.2GHz CPU, but I like that I can use my DDR-1333 memory and I get a 6.4GT/s QPI rating. Over all, I'm happy!

Not sure if I want to offload my original 2.8GHz CPU. I may just hang on to it just in case! Maybe I'll use it to build another machine for a file server or something.

Now the question is whats in it for those like me w/ w3680? 3.46 looks nice, but from 3.33 doesn't really yield any major benefit. Note: I am referring to those like me w/ the w3680 already, and not 2.8 or 3.2

[vvrinne]

Thanks for this. Just bought a quad 2.8 Mac Pro and the hexa-core upgrade would have been 1200 euros here in Finland. Going to be coming to the US in a couple of weeks and looks like I can get the 3.2ghz cpu for about 450 euros which is quite a difference.

I have a question regarding memory: Does the 3670 work with 1066mhz memory or does it require 1333mhz?

[sskino]

Originally Posted by vvrinne

Thanks for this. Just bought a quad 2.8 Mac Pro and the hexa-core upgrade would have been 1200 euros here in Finland. Going to be coming to the US in a couple of weeks and looks like I can get the 3.2ghz cpu for about 450 euros which is quite a difference.

I have a question regarding memory: Does the 3670 work with 1066mhz memory or does it require 1333mhz?

The W3670 should work fine with 1066MHz memory.. Only the W3680 and W3690 will utilize 1333MHz memory.

[sskino]

Originally Posted by Joshuarocks

Now the question is whats in it for those like me w/ w3680? 3.46 looks nice, but from 3.33 doesn't really yield any major benefit. Note: I am referring to those like me w/ the w3680 already, and not 2.8 or 3.2

There really is no cost benefit to upgrading from a 3.33GHz CPU to a 3.46GHz CPU. You really won't see much of a speed increase. I purchased my 2.8GHz system with the intentions of upgrading it myself and it just so happened that the CPU pricing for the 3.33GHz was the same as a 3.46GHz, so I went that route instead.

[sskino]

Is there anyone out there with an OEM 2010 Mac Pro 3.33GHz Hex-Core model that can post some stats on CPU temperatures and fan speeds?

I'd like to compare those with my 3.46GHz model and see how much hotter this one runs.

[IceMacMac]

Is it remotely possible that Apple could with a future upgrade "break" one of these cobbled systems....in essence sabotaging the DIYer?

For me I see two risks...one that I'd screw up the installation...or that something would go amiss software compatibility. (immediately or in the future)

[vvrinne]

That doesn't sound very likely. Especially if you use the 3680 which I guess is the exact same chip that you get when buying direct from Apple? It's a shame there is such a huge difference in price between the 3670 and the 3680 compared to the much smaller difference in performance.

[philipma1957]

Originally Posted by IceMacMac

Is it remotely possible that Apple could with a future upgrade "break" one of these cobbled systems....in essence sabotaging the DIYer?

For me I see two risks...one that I'd screw up the installation...or that something would go amiss software compatibility. (immediately or in the future)

My thought is the new mac pro may offer a quad 3.2 as the base hex 3.2 as the middle model and the hex 3.46 as a step up for single core cpus.

Now they are quad 2.8 quad 3.2 hex 3.33


If they do a small refresh before 2012. That would be cheap and easy for them to do. They could make a good profit on it.



The cpu chip is kind of like ram so it will stay good as far as software is concerned. I suppose apple could write something into the osx banning a cpu, but they have not done this as far as I know. An example would be mac mini's that are from 2006 to 2008 you can put in a 2.33 C2D cpu this was a hot upgrade for years apple never did anything to stop it. If you keep an older osx on hand in case they write something to prevent the 3.2 hex or the 3.46 hex from working you would be good.


If you want to be completely safe use the 3.33 hex chip below:

http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-Intel-Xeon-U...ht_3297wt_1250


this is the oem part in use now. apple can't disable it with software if they did do that all hex 3.33 systems that they sold would break.



As far as doing a bad install yeah that can happen with easy installs. BTW this is really pretty easy to do.

[sskino]

Originally Posted by IceMacMac

Is it remotely possible that Apple could with a future upgrade "break" one of these cobbled systems....in essence sabotaging the DIYer?

For me I see two risks...one that I'd screw up the installation...or that something would go amiss software compatibility. (immediately or in the future)

I doubt they would do this. As long as the chipset (X58) will support it, I would say it should work. There are some exceptions because the microcode has alot to do with how the system will detect the CPU, but I doubt they would go that route. It makes me wonder if they built the newer models with that mind because from what I understand, the older (2009/2008) models did not use the CPU sockets that have a lever on them. They rely on the heatsink to supply enough pressure to the CPU and socket so that they maintain contact. Not sure if this applies only to the dual-cpu systems. At least that's what I gathered from this article on Anandtech. http://www.anandtech.com/show/2800/10

I thought about that myself and researched the heck out of it before I decided to go with the W3690.

But again, all the more reason for me to hang on to my original processor just in case.

[philipma1957]

Originally Posted by sskino

I doubt they would do this. As long as the chipset (X58) will support it, I would say it should work. There are some exceptions because the microcode has alot to do with how the system will detect the CPU, but I doubt they would go that route. It makes me wonder if they built the newer models with that mind because from what I understand, the older (2009/2008) models did not use the CPU sockets that have a lever on them. They rely on the heatsink to supply enough pressure to the CPU and socket so that they maintain contact. Not sure if this applies only to the dual-cpu systems. At least that's what I gathered from this article on Anandtech. http://www.anandtech.com/show/2800/10

I thought about that myself and researched the heck out of it before I decided to go with the W3690.

But again, all the more reason for me to hang on to my original processor just in case.

Yeah I read how anandtech put in a lidded cpu and then tightened the heatsink to the stop point this crushed the pins on the cpu board and cost a lot to fix!.. The nice thing about the 2010 single socket is the heatsink is designed to fit a lidded cpu like the one I pulled and replaced. basically you can't over tighten it (within reason).

Anandtech was fooled by the tension that the pins gave when being crushed. I am thinking a lot of apple techs had problems putting in lidless cpus so lidded ones were put back in.

I really think they won't write a code blocking 3.2 or 3.46 hex cpus I think that the next mac pro will use one or the other as a lower end model.

[johnnymg]

Originally Posted by philipma1957

Yeah I read how anandtech put in a lidded cpu and then tightened the heatsink to the stop point this crushed the pins on the cpu board and cost a lot to fix!.. The nice thing about the 2010 single socket is the heatsink is designed to fit a lidded cpu like the one I pulled and replaced. basically you can't over tighten it (within reason).

Anandtech was fooled by the tension that the pins gave when being crushed. I am thinking a lot of apple techs had problems putting in lidless cpus so lidded ones were put back in.

I really think they won't write a code blocking 3.2 or 3.46 hex cpus I think that the next mac pro will use one or the other as a lower end model.

My guess is that the next MP will be SB. There's very little "value" for Apple doing an 'incremental' update with the heritage CPU's. JMO.

[philipma1957]

You may be right that the next mac pro will be fully sb . I was thinking they may do a small refresh in early fall or late summer.

Then maybe sb in jan or feb 2012. Well it is all a guess for now. I am happy with the 3.2 hex and I have a few copies of 10.6.6 and 10.6.7 osx just in case.

[sskino]

Originally Posted by philipma1957

One more thing I am going to sell the W3530 CPU so I will get a final price for upgrade once it sells.

With no discounts this was about 650.


Right Now My price was about 559 usd.


This is a bit lower due to the coupons and discount I got on the cpu chip.


That I purchased here:

http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-Intel-Xeon-U...ht_3265wt_1250


I paid about 90 less then that.



Also A little info on temps:


Ambient__________________________86F
CPU 1 __________________________93F
CPU A __________________________91F


And FANS

Booster 1________________________ 856rpm
Exhaust ________________________ 598rpm
Expansion Slots___________________1001rpm
Intake _________________________ 598rpm
Power Supply ____________________ 999rpm

This is under no stress just surfing the net and typing this.


I found a good stress test cputest I am pushing the cpu to about 75- 80 watts with it and I needed to boost the fans to keep the cpu under 150f see the attachments first one I used an 8 core setting and never got past 80 watts or 147f . the second test I used a 16 core setting this maxed all cpus at 100% and after 5 to 6 minutes I got to 153f. Since 154F is max for the cpu I stopped the test. It was interesting to see that all cpus fully maxed pulled about 85 watts. This does not mean you can't max the cpu fully at 100% per core you just need higher fan settings then I tested with. I have to say I am impressed that it is only pulling 85 watts when fully maxed. Although there is a second watt figure of 16 something. It may be to figure your full use of watts for the cpu you need to add them which is 102. Still good since the cpu is supposed to pull as much as 130. I am going to reset the fans a little higher and run a few cpu at 100% maxed tests. so look back in an hour or so.


So I set the fans a little faster and watts are 81 plus 16 or 97watts and temps stay around 140. The fans are set fast but maxing out all your cores at 100% Is not normal usage. So far I am more then 14 minutes into the test and 141f was the highest temp I got.

This is the last test in after 50 minutes with fans set as in the last picture the cpu temp is stable at 140f that is 14f under max temp allowed. So if you want to really push your machine you will need the fans set a bit higher. These would be loud settings to a lot of people. But you are well under max fan speed.

I fell pretty safe in saying that;

2050 Rpm for the expansion slots fan

1275 Rpm for the power supply fan

1325 Rpm for the exhaust fan

1625 Rpm for the intake fan

2075 Rpm for the Booster 1 fan



Will keep the Hex core 3.2 GHz machine under 140F in a room temp of 80F under high cpu use, in my last two test cases all 6 cpu cores were 100% all of the time.

I'm just curious... Shouldn't the system be auto-adjusting the speed of the fans based on temperature and load? I am wondering if the CPU upgrades is defeating this function. Mine is not auto-adjusting and under heavy load I need to alter the fan speeds also.

[mdgm]

Originally Posted by philipma1957

You may be right that the next mac pro will be fully sb . I was thinking they may do a small refresh in early fall or late summer.

It would be nice if they did a small refresh (this would make the Mac Pro better value for money than it currently is). But without SATA III or Thunderbolt many would continue to hold off.

Originally Posted by philipma1957

Then maybe sb in jan or feb 2012. Well it is all a guess for now. I am happy with the 3.2 hex and I have a few copies of 10.6.6 and 10.6.7 osx just in case.

Early 2012 would be great timing. I just hope the Aussie dollar continues to rise against the US dollar so that the Mac Pro price over here falls.

What do you need those copies of 10.6.6 and 10.6.7 for?

[philipma1957]

Originally Posted by sskino

I'm just curious... Shouldn't the system be auto-adjusting the speed of the fans based on temperature and load? I am wondering if the CPU upgrades is defeating this function. Mine is not auto-adjusting and under heavy load I need to alter the fan speeds also.

I never linked apples fan control always felt it was too slow to speed up. I must not be the only one since istats and smc fan control
were written for better fan speed management then apple offers. I set my machine on a set speed program and leave it be. I have a temp warning speed on the top bar along with temp. I always like a computers vital signs easy to see and I get to control the fans just the way I want.

Originally Posted by mdgm

It would be nice if they did a small refresh (this would make the Mac Pro better value for money than it currently is). But without SATA III or Thunderbolt many would continue to hold off.

Early 2012 would be great timing. I just hope the Aussie dollar continues to rise against the US dollar so that the Mac Pro price over here falls.

What do you need those copies of 10.6.6 and 10.6.7 for?

I have a 10.6.6 and a 10.6.7 in case my computer/cpu goes nuts after an update. I will boot with them and if the computer works I know the update did something. BTW this works for stock machine also lots of times a new update kills things off.

[Mufasa804]

That is absolutely amazing. Nice job!!

[philipma1957]

Originally Posted by Mufasa804

That is absolutely amazing. Nice job!!

thank you.

for quad 2.8 2010 owners this upgrade and the adding of an intel ssd

(I prefer intel) with cindori's trim app


see his link:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1125400



makes for a very good powerful mac pro. for under 3k

[zephonic]

Is there any reason why this mod won't work with a 2009 Nehalem?

[ActionableMango]

Originally Posted by zephonic

Is there any reason why this mod won't work with a 2009 Nehalem?

I could be wrong, but I don't think the 2009 supports hexacore CPUs.

However, you could use the quad-core equivalents:

W3580 3.33 GHz
W3570 3.20 GHz
W3565 3.20 GHz

[philipma1957]

Originally Posted by zephonic

Is there any reason why this mod won't work with a 2009 Nehalem?

be very careful the 2009 cpus do not have lids if you put in a lidded cpu you could crush the pins if you over tighten the heatsink there is a link about someone doing this I will look for it.


read this and decide if you want to do it:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2800/10


you would need 4 spacers of an unknown height to do it correctly.

too thin the cpu and the pins under the cpu can be damaged.

too thick and the cpu could overheat.

This is my opinion drawn from reading the thread.

[zephonic]

Originally Posted by ActionableMango

I could be wrong, but I don't think the 2009 supports hexacore CPUs.

However, you could use the quad-core equivalents:

W3580 3.33 GHz
W3570 3.20 GHz
W3565 3.20 GHz

Yeah, I was looking at those as well. But I could not find any reason why the hex can't be retrofitted into a '09 MacPro. It is the same socket and bus speed.
http://ark.intel.com/Compare.aspx?id...18,39721,39718,

Originally Posted by philipma1957

read this and decide if you want to do it:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2800/10

Yeah, I read that article. Proceed with caution and at own risk. However it also says this:

The lidless Nehalems are only used in the 8-core version as far as I can tell. The standard quad-core Nehalem Mac Pro uses regular Xeons with an integrated heat spreader.

But other than that, is there a technical reason why the hex won't fit on a '09 logic board?

[philipma1957]

Originally Posted by zephonic

...


The lidless Nehalems are only used in the 8-core version as far as I can tell. The standard quad-core Nehalem Mac Pro uses regular Xeons with an integrated heat spreader.

But other than that, is there a technical reason why the hex won't fit on a '09 logic board?

it looks like it fits. if you purchase it from buy dot com like i did you have 30 days to return it.




this is the lowest cost one it is the one I used. it works on the 2010. I have a theory that only this one will work for you. I say that because it uses 1066 ram and the qp i is 4.8 rated. If you buy it and follow my mod it may work. if it does not you can send it back to buy dot com in 30 days or less. it would really be cool if it works. now both the w3680 and w3690 spec for 1333 ram with 6.4 qpi. They may not work and they cost more. The w3670 is only 604 see link and read the return policy.


http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-Intel-Xeon-U...ht_3265wt_1250

here are the three hexes on the market

http://ark.intel.com/ProductCollecti...x?series=48311


here is the return policy for the ebay seller

http://stores.ebay.com/Buys-Internet...rn-Policy.html

I am not a lawyer , but I read that you just have to repack it in the oem packing and pay to ship it back. Say it was not compatible and get a full refund except for return shipping. For this item you 30 days not 45. So it looks like for an hours work to install and 20 or so to return if it does not work may be worth trying.

I would be more inclined to use the w3670 since it cost less and has the 1066 ram spec and the qpi of 4.8. Just a guess there may be others that say it can't be done. I have found over the years a lot of gear works that is not supposed to. Unless someone has done this and it failed I am thinking it is worth a shot.

[ListedFirst.com]

Originally Posted by philipma1957

((Last post has new cputest scores))


Links for arctic silver kit


http://www.amazon.com/ArctiClean-3-5...0821393&sr=8-1 $11.50

Don't know if you guys have seen this, but it's all I use

IC Diamond Thermal Compound

Diamond transfers heat MUCH better than silver. It's absolutely fantastic stuff!



http://cgi.ebay.com/IC-Diamond-24-Ca...item1e5ba4198e


(and no, that's not my item lol)

[Transporteur]

Originally Posted by zephonic

But other than that, is there a technical reason why the hex won't fit on a '09 logic board?

As already mentioned, the hex cores (3600/5600) CPUs do NOT work in the 2009 Mac Pro. Those new CPUs come with a new microcode that is not supported by the '09's firmware.

[philipma1957]

Originally Posted by Transporteur

As already mentioned, the hex cores (3600/5600) CPUs do NOT work in the 2009 Mac Pro. Those new CPUs come with a new microcode that is not supported by the '09's firmware.

I would agree with the w3680 and the w3690 not as sure as the w3670. The microcode in the w3670 may be a bit different then its cousins since it supports 1066 ram as a max. It also does have the different 4.8qpi.
It depends on the firmwares microcode and what it keys off to allow or disallow a cpu.

Certainly if it just counts cores it won't work. It may do it that way.