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Old May 5, 2005, 04:42 PM   #1
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Mac's Tiger Gives Panther Owners Little Reason to Pounce




Category: Mac OS X
Link: Mac's Tiger Gives Panther Owners Little Reason to Pounce

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Old May 5, 2005, 05:03 PM   #2
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heh

You get used to Spotlight and you'll never go back to Panther.
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Old May 5, 2005, 05:04 PM   #3
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I actually e-mailed this guy. He is usually very pro-Apple.

I was like Rob, you missed like 20 MAJOR features.
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Old May 5, 2005, 05:58 PM   #4
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Give me that advice again when I'm editing in FCP 5.5 with native HDV and realtime filters in 10.4.8.
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Old May 5, 2005, 06:34 PM   #5
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Or using Automator to add your own features to the OS, appearing right in the right-click menu for any file.
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Old May 5, 2005, 06:58 PM   #6
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Not sure how safari is "clunky" by having pop-ups not blocked as default!? How hard is it to turn that on!

I disagree wholly with the conclusion. I installed Tiger on one of my systems, thinking that I would try it out etc, and then install it on my other (older)system later, after a project I am working on finished and I had the time, but guess what, a few hours in I was backing up and clean installing. The new features are good, and will only get better! A few things niggle me still, like H.264 - No way on a G3 500, and epson print utility busted, but otherwise good.

You guys tried out the dictionary thing from the seminar - kick ass!!

For those who don't know:
1. Open Dictionary App (is has to be in the apps folder NOT put into a different one)
2. Preferences> Check "open dictionary panel"
3. While browsing etc. hold down apple-ctrl and press D
4. Just linger your mouse over a word and see the definition straight away
5. Works in most apps (not word - grrr)
6. Can be a thesaurus too!

For me, spotlight is already essential, and automator has me hooked. Dashboard is good, not life-changing, but occasionally damn useful. New iCal great, new way of .Mac Syncing - heaven! thank god they fixed it! (I use to bite my nails as those arrows spun, now i dance a jig!)
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Old May 5, 2005, 07:38 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James Philp
Not sure how safari is "clunky" by having pop-ups not blocked as default!? How hard is it to turn that on!

I disagree wholly with the conclusion. I installed Tiger on one of my systems, thinking that I would try it out etc, and then install it on my other (older)system later, after a project I am working on finished and I had the time, but guess what, a few hours in I was backing up and clean installing. The new features are good, and will only get better! A few things niggle me still, like H.264 - No way on a G3 500, and epson print utility busted, but otherwise good.

You guys tried out the dictionary thing from the seminar - kick ass!!

For those who don't know:
1. Open Dictionary App (is has to be in the apps folder NOT put into a different one)
2. Preferences> Check "open dictionary panel"
3. While browsing etc. hold down apple-ctrl and press D
4. Just linger your mouse over a word and see the definition straight away
5. Works in most apps (not word - grrr)
6. Can be a thesaurus too!

For me, spotlight is already essential, and automator has me hooked. Dashboard is good, not life-changing, but occasionally damn useful. New iCal great, new way of .Mac Syncing - heaven! thank god they fixed it! (I use to bite my nails as those arrows spun, now i dance a jig!)
I need to watch that seminar now. That dictionary trick is awesome!
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Old May 5, 2005, 07:59 PM   #8
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This guy is WRONG. I don't have Tiger yet but went to a client's yesterday. He's not the kind of guy who gets excited about computers but he was raving about how amazing the new system is. He prefaced his praise with " I don't get excited about an operating system but this is amazing" and proceed to show me about half of Tiger's new features. Mac Bytes obviously is out of touch with Mac Users.

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Old May 5, 2005, 08:31 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBytes


Category: Mac OS X
Link: Mac's Tiger Gives Panther Owners Little Reason to Pounce

Posted on MacBytes.com
Approved by Mudbug

you just knew it was going to be bad when the title is Mac's Tiger...umm hello it's Apple's Tiger. How many times do they have to be told that the company's name is Apple Computer not Mac?

Sheesh
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Old May 5, 2005, 08:33 PM   #10
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Yeah, i agree with most of the posters. This donkey-puncher is obviously not a developer, a content creator, or a guy who cares about his OS running faster. I mean seriously, what do people expect? And the thing is, as market share increases, the price of these updates will be decreasing. I hear a lot of people complain about the cost of the updates and they say the stupidest things I've ever heard. i.e. "Microsoft gives their service packs away for free." And after I bludgeon them with a ball-peen hammer, I explain to them that it's because MS is patching up crap that they fudged the first time around, whereas apple is releasing new features and better performance. Some people will just never get it.
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Old May 5, 2005, 09:12 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rkphoto
This guy is WRONG. I don't have Tiger yet but went to a client's yesterday. He's not the kind of guy who gets excited about computers but he was raving about how amazing the new system is. He prefaced his praise with " I don't get excited about an operating system but this is amazing" and proceed to show me about half of Tiger's new features. Mac Bytes obviously is out of touch with Mac Users.

rk
Uhmmm ... It was a Washington Post column. MacBytes is a sister site to MacRumors and simply publishes the links to various Mac related news items.
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Old May 5, 2005, 09:29 PM   #12
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For crying out loud...stop trying to crucify the guy because he's not in bed with Apple.

The fact is Panther (right now) is much more rock solid than Tiger is (right now). That was the point of the article. He never said that Tiger won't ever get there. It's hard to deny that Tiger has PLENTY of annoying quirks and bugs. Frankly I find it refreshing that he's the only reviewer I've seen so far that was honest enough to talk about the glaring bugs in Tiger.

-Mail DOA
-Return of the spinning beach ball - with a vengeance
-Spotlight doesn't find some things that it should
-GUI quirks

So far I've installed Tiger 3x (the latest was a clean install) and none of these issues were resolved by any of the "fixes" on Apple's discussion boards -- and all the bugs are still here...after 3 installs.

It's very obvious that Apple rushed this out the door; I've never been dying for an update like I am now!
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Old May 5, 2005, 10:09 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jakemikey
For crying out loud...stop trying to crucify the guy because he's not in bed with Apple.

The fact is Panther (right now) is much more rock solid than Tiger is (right now). That was the point of the article. He never said that Tiger won't ever get there. It's hard to deny that Tiger has PLENTY of annoying quirks and bugs. Frankly I find it refreshing that he's the only reviewer I've seen so far that was honest enough to talk about the glaring bugs in Tiger.

-Mail DOA
-Return of the spinning beach ball - with a vengeance
-Spotlight doesn't find some things that it should
-GUI quirks

So far I've installed Tiger 3x (the latest was a clean install) and none of these issues were resolved by any of the "fixes" on Apple's discussion boards -- and all the bugs are still here...after 3 installs.

It's very obvious that Apple rushed this out the door; I've never been dying for an update like I am now!
Interesting. I have almost exactly the same system, except my CPUs are 2.5 GHz, and I'm not having any of the issues you're reporting. If it's that bad, go back to Panther for a while. I always back up the previous release to my firewire drive, so I have problems I just change my startup disk and boot back to the last release.

You wouldn't be running Virex or some other AV or 3rd party firewall or VPN, would you?
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Old May 5, 2005, 10:18 PM   #14
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You guys haven't been paying attention at all, have you? Rob Pegoraro is a respected tech columnist who is definitely extremely well versed when it comes to consumer electronics of all kinds. He reads rumor sites like MacRumors, too, just so you know. And he is very pro-Apple (I've read his columns and web chats for a long time now), but he's also very utilitarian.

His general statement is that right now, OS X Tiger has too many bugs to make it an immediate buy for most users. Panther is very good; it's not that once Tiger comes out, Panther is suddenly a piece of crap. Basically he's saying don't drop $130 unless you really really need the features now.

I've found Tiger to have a fair number of flaws (Quartz rendering in Word is messed up, some menu bar glitches, Mail problems, iTunes Sound Check problems, my roommate has issues with Dashboard and his iPod Shuffle, etc. etc.). It's been rumored that Apple programmers were really pushing to get it done as soon as possible, and we all read that 10.4.1 is coming soon.
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Old May 5, 2005, 10:57 PM   #15
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The only major problem I had with the article and this goes for about 95% of the tech articles I read is that they never talk about the core of the OS and what that means for the future. If they can't see it when they use it, they treat it like it doesn't exist. But he does get points for actually having thought about the product, even if I don't really agree with him. But then again, we all don't use the computer the same way and what one man finds useless, another man loves.
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Old May 5, 2005, 11:01 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maedus
The only major problem I had with the article and this goes for about 95% of the tech articles I read is that they never talk about the core of the OS and what that means for the future. If they can't see it when they use it, they treat it like it doesn't exist. But he does get points for actually having thought about the product, even if I don't really agree with him. But then again, we all don't use the computer the same way and what one man finds useless, another man loves.
He did mention CoreImage in his recent web chat, and from his comments it looks like he's definitely expecting Tiger to become really, really awesome. But he made a comment a while back in another one of his chats that he's a consumer electronics guy, so he always tries to focus on what Joe User will see and think about, which is -not- CoreVideo/Audio/Image, but whether the OS and included apps are easy to use.
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Old May 5, 2005, 11:10 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aptenergy
He did mention CoreImage in his recent web chat, and from his comments it looks like he's definitely expecting Tiger to become really, really awesome. But he made a comment a while back in another one of his chats that he's a consumer electronics guy, so he always tries to focus on what Joe User will see and think about, which is -not- CoreVideo/Audio/Image, but whether the OS and included apps are easy to use.
I guess that's what happens when you take links out of context.
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Old May 6, 2005, 12:09 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jakemikey
So far I've installed Tiger 3x (the latest was a clean install) and none of these issues were resolved by any of the "fixes" on Apple's discussion boards -- and all the bugs are still here...after 3 installs.

It's very obvious that Apple rushed this out the door; I've never been dying for an update like I am now!
Hmm. I have an original 2x2 like yours, 1.5GB of RAM, but with two internal 250GB drives instead of your mix of internal and (I assume) external RAID. I did an archive/install from Panther, and the only problem was that Stuffit isn't in Tiger (and PathFinder which I have grown to depend on requires the Stuffit libs in /Library/frameworks). Once that was solved, not a single problem since then.

Mail DOA? Are your mailboxes corrupted somehow? I have two IMAP, two POP3 accounts with a collection of eleven rules in Mail, all auto-synced between three different computers thanks to .Mac, and it all just worked from the first moment. Well, there was a sync issue where adding the third computer to the set apparently decided to send the "no rules" set up instead of pulling the 11 rules back down, but a careful "Hell no I don't want to remove 11 rules on this computer!" the next time the other once synced up fixed that issue quite well.

If you have 15-20GB of extra HD space, the best approach when nearing new OS time is to make a couple System partitions, and one User partition. Install the old OS on one of the System partitions, and use NetInfo Manager to move your User folder over to the Users partition. That way you can go back and forth between the two systems without too much trouble when necessary. I do this for development because I need to be able to verify changes on multiple versions of OS X, and I imagine it would help the "slightly-more-advanced-than-average" user get through a major OS update without too much turmoil ...
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Old May 6, 2005, 01:09 AM   #19
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THe basic fact is that Tiger is a .0 product, but as a .0 product is actually MUCH better than Panther was at this stage. A .1 update is due in a few days I think, or maybe a week. It'll be welcome, but I'm not going back to Panther because of the problems (mail has syncing problems, etc). Spotlight alone makes it worth the upgrade, not to mention the concurrency improvements that make my dual 2.5 a speed freak.
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Old May 6, 2005, 04:45 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jakemikey
For crying out loud...stop trying to crucify the guy because he's not in bed with Apple.

The fact is Panther (right now) is much more rock solid than Tiger is (right now). That was the point of the article. He never said that Tiger won't ever get there. It's hard to deny that Tiger has PLENTY of annoying quirks and bugs. Frankly I find it refreshing that he's the only reviewer I've seen so far that was honest enough to talk about the glaring bugs in Tiger.

-Mail DOA
-Return of the spinning beach ball - with a vengeance
-Spotlight doesn't find some things that it should
-GUI quirks

So far I've installed Tiger 3x (the latest was a clean install) and none of these issues were resolved by any of the "fixes" on Apple's discussion boards -- and all the bugs are still here...after 3 installs.

It's very obvious that Apple rushed this out the door; I've never been dying for an update like I am now!
I have an iMac G4, like my sig says. The only issue I'm dealing with of the 4 you listed is "GUI quirks".
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Old May 6, 2005, 07:51 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jakemikey
For crying out loud...stop trying to crucify the guy because he's not in bed with Apple.

The fact is Panther (right now) is much more rock solid than Tiger is (right now). That was the point of the article. He never said that Tiger won't ever get there. It's hard to deny that Tiger has PLENTY of annoying quirks and bugs. Frankly I find it refreshing that he's the only reviewer I've seen so far that was honest enough to talk about the glaring bugs in Tiger.

-Mail DOA
-Return of the spinning beach ball - with a vengeance
-Spotlight doesn't find some things that it should
-GUI quirks

So far I've installed Tiger 3x (the latest was a clean install) and none of these issues were resolved by any of the "fixes" on Apple's discussion boards -- and all the bugs are still here...after 3 installs.

It's very obvious that Apple rushed this out the door; I've never been dying for an update like I am now!
As with others, I'm only dealing with a couple GUI quirks...nothing serious. Other than that, nothing. You must have a defunct copy or something. Mail DOA? Spinning beach ball? Maybe you need some more memory or something.
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Old May 6, 2005, 08:18 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jakemikey
For crying out loud...stop trying to crucify the guy because he's not in bed with Apple.

The fact is Panther (right now) is much more rock solid than Tiger is (right now). That was the point of the article. He never said that Tiger won't ever get there. It's hard to deny that Tiger has PLENTY of annoying quirks and bugs. Frankly I find it refreshing that he's the only reviewer I've seen so far that was honest enough to talk about the glaring bugs in Tiger.

-Mail DOA
-Return of the spinning beach ball - with a vengeance
-Spotlight doesn't find some things that it should
-GUI quirks

So far I've installed Tiger 3x (the latest was a clean install) and none of these issues were resolved by any of the "fixes" on Apple's discussion boards -- and all the bugs are still here...after 3 installs.

It's very obvious that Apple rushed this out the door; I've never been dying for an update like I am now!
This is the first negative Apple review I've seen this guy write.
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Old May 6, 2005, 08:36 AM   #23
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The column is entirely reasonable

This is how he concludes the article. Does he sound like he is anti-Apple?

Quote:
Flaws and all, Tiger still beats Windows soundly, from its smooth, nag-free installation (save a brief but heavy-handed promotion of Apple's $100-per-year .Mac online service) to its sleek, shimmering graphical interface. But it's not such a huge leap past Panther to merit upgrading today. Some cleanup work from Apple could fix that. If the management there can hold off on starting the next big OS X project, there should be plenty of time to do the job right.
If you read his stuff regularly, like I do, you realize that he is by no means anti-Apple. He often mentions how the Mac OS does something better than XP. But, like all of us, he criticizes Apple when he thinks something has fallen short of the quality that we have come to expect. What's wrong with that? Sheesh!
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Old May 6, 2005, 09:04 AM   #24
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I completely agree with his review.

But as he says, part of why it is ho hum, is that Panther is a good OS already.

If you used Windows XP on a daily basis (as I do for work), and an OS came along that fixed a lot of the very annoying problems that XP has, you would be extremely grateful and excited.

Panther just didn't have a lot of problems, if any, that needed to be fixed.
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Old May 6, 2005, 01:58 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swingerofbirch
Panther just didn't have a lot of problems, if any, that needed to be fixed.
Unless you had a FireWire-800 hard drive.

Panther had plenty of problems in its initial release. But they were (mostly) fixed, and so people don't remember them today.

Tiger's got its share of problems as well. And I'm sure they'll be fixed in a few montsh by the 10.4.1 and 10.4.2 updates. And then everybody will love it and wonder why anyone wouldn't want to upgrade. But we're not at that stage right now.
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