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Old Mar 1, 2012, 08:44 PM   #126
shortcut3d
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512GB Samsung 830 Firmware Upgrade

Unfortunately, my 512GB Samsung 830 SSD already had the current firmware. So all my stability test were performed with the most current firmware available for the Samsung 830

It looks like stability will not be gained through an SSD firmware update in this case.

I'm wondering if the 2011 Mac mini server has something different that makes it stable.

I'm having trouble accepting that a large SSD takes more power than a large 7200RPM 2.5" HDD.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 08:55 PM   #127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DCJ001 View Post
I bought an OCZ Vertex 3 120GB SSD today from Tiger Direct.

I'm not concerned with using the SSD without an enclosure. I've got one of these silicone sleeves on the way from Hong Kong for $1.52:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Silicone-Ski...ht_4026wt_1165

as described by the original poster in this thread, as shown in the last two pictures here:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost...3&postcount=35
If anyone wants/needs to connect a 3.5" HDD, I'd recommend one of these:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16812119152

Comes with a power adaptor with one SATA and one molex power connector, as well as a 3.5" and 2.5" silicone sleeve (seems identical to the one you bought from Hong Kong). In addition, grab one of these SATA cables to connect the HDD to the T-Bolt sled:

http://www.microsatacables.com/all-p...sion-cable-20/

Note: if you want to go eSATA to the T-Bolt sled, grab this cable:

http://www.microsatacables.com/all-p...sata-cable-20/

You'll need to snap off the little plastic end pieces, but they pop right off.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 09:02 PM   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DCJ001 View Post
I bought an OCZ Vertex 3 120GB SSD today from Tiger Direct.

I'm not concerned with using the SSD without an enclosure. I've got one of these silicone sleeves on the way from Hong Kong for $1.52:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Silicone-Ski...ht_4026wt_1165

as described by the original poster in this thread, as shown in the last two pictures here:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost...3&postcount=35


That does work perfectly fine. You just will want to prop the back up a touch as was described by philipma1957 before. I used a thin piece of cardboard towards the back of the drive sled area to even things out a bit.

I just like the thought of a proper Seagate enclosure in case I want to pack my SSD and thunderbolt cable along with my fiancÚ's MacBook Air when going on a trip, etc. to have "my" computer on the go. Also, it would be sort of fun (and useful) to be able to boot your own SSD system drive on your friends HDD based Mac faster than they can boot their own!

I bet we could all sell a few friends on Seagate docks and SSD's pretty easily after that demo...

Frank
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 09:54 PM   #129
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Originally Posted by fgullama View Post
Hey Tim,

Sounds like you got the bottom of the speed issue. Bummer about the bad drive, but at least you have an answer now so you can fix it.

As far as the USB connections on your 2011 iMac not working, I tried a 1tb 2.5 external USB Seagate as well as a 500gb 2.5 external USB Western Digital with no issues. I plan to leave one plugged in full time for Time Machine backups. I also have an Asus external BluRay drive plugged in full time which is still working fine. I'm only using one port for data and power, not the double dongle thing.

I did however plug these devices directly into the system. Were you coming off of a USB hub for any of the USB drives by chance? I could see an unpowered (or even powered) hub potentially having issues. Why only when the Thunderbolt drive is plugged in though... Perhaps the extra draw from the Thunderbolt drive drops power a bit across the USB bus? seems kind of strange. I can tell you my setup seems to work fine though, so it should work. I just tested a BluRay movie with one of the the external USB drives connected at a time with the Thunderbolt SSD being my boot drive. I do have an unpowered hub hooked up full time as well for another small audio device, the iPad, thumb drives, etc. that still works as well.

Hopefully this helps you a bit in troubleshooting.

I hope nobody minds my posts here, as I'm using an iMac with the Seagate, not a Mini. I figured the extra info might still help others with the Seagate.

Frank
actually i welcome the imac info

Quote:
Originally Posted by timdafweak View Post
Frank, philipma1957 and Shortcut3d,

Thanks for checking with your systems. I am glad that you guys aren't seeing the issue, and so far the problem is intermittent on my end, as I have been able to recreate the issue only once since.

I was connecting the bus powered USB drive to the iMac directly (sorry, just like Frank I too am using an iMac for these tests, not a Mac Mini), and not via a Hub, though I will try connecting it to a powered USB hub and see if the issue persists.

In the meantime if any of you bought a t-bolt connector without having a GoFlex drive, you can buy a GoFlex 2.5" enclosure from eBay. Here's the link. Mine just arrived this morning, and for $24 it is a steal compared to the amount we spent getting the t-bolt cable and adapter.
ditto.

to me this tech is great for iMacs and minis


to update my testing the samsung series 470/810 worked for 40 hours or so flawless.

the intel 600 gb series 320 worked for 30 hours flawless.

I am busy and have not set the next ssd up

I am dropping in a crucial m4 120gb sata III

I am going to do a network recovery for the first test. should start it soon.



Okay I put in a crucial m4 with a windows format but empty. I booted the mini using the option key and called up the recovery partition from the internal oem hdd. so far it has formatted the crucial m4 128gb ssd and is half way through a recovery download.
this is a good test for quite a few reasons.

I will post later tonight if the recovery worked. okay it loaded a new osx to the crucial



here is an xbench

and a black magic 380 read 185 write for this drive is okay


crucial specs it at 500 read 175 write see link and read for the 128gb.


http://www.crucial.com/pdf/Tech_spec...-11_online.pdf.


I will run this for about 40 hours. so far it seems like the seagate has improved since the mini did the 1.6 firmware.
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Last edited by philipma1957; Mar 1, 2012 at 11:10 PM. Reason: more info.
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Old Mar 2, 2012, 03:52 PM   #130
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480GB OWC Mercury Extreme Pro 6G

I decided to test the 480GB OWC Mercury Extreme Pro 6G in the Seagate Thunderbolt GoFlex 2.5" adapter. The 408GB OWC Mercury Extreme Pro 6G was originally installed in a 2011 15" MacBook Pro 2.3GHz Quad-Core Intel i7. I removed the drive from the internal MacBook Pro 2.5" drive bay and replaced it with a 256GB Samsung 830 SSD HFS+ format and empty.

Initially, I had trouble using the Mac bootloader (hold option) to select the 480GB OWC Mercury Extreme Pro 6G installed in the Seagate Thunderbolt GoFlex 2.5" adapter. Not a good sign. Eventually, I got a clean boot. Things were looking up, I could access all the folder, iTunes, Safari, etc. Then I tried to do a large incompressible copy (Transformers Dark of the Moon Blu-ray converted to 720p m4v H.264) weighing in at 6GB. It copied to the temporary internal 256 Samsung 830 impressively quick (the Samsung 830 was showing its power with incompressible data). Next, I tried the reverse copying from the 256GB Samsung 830 to the 480GB OWC Mercury Extreme Pro 6G. The OS locked up immediately giving me a beach ball.

For reference, I had similar failed with the 512GB Samsung 830 on the 2011 Mac mini 2.7GHz Dual-Core Intel i7 and on the 2011 15" MacBook Pro. However, one combination of Apple Thunderbolt Cable and Seagate Thunderbolt GoFlex 2.5" adapter did successfully pass the test on a 2011 Mac mini server.

Similar to other people's experience, the smaller 240GB and 256GB SSDs do not have trouble.

An additional note, small file copy does not seem to be an issue.

On personal note, I am very disappointed in the Seagate Thunderbolt GoFlex 2.5" adapter because I was looking forward to RAID performance in a small, self-contained, portable package.
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Old Mar 2, 2012, 09:51 PM   #131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shortcut3d View Post
Next, I tried the reverse copying from the 256GB Samsung 830 to the 480GB OWC Mercury Extreme Pro 6G. The OS locked up immediately giving me a beach ball.
Is the firmware on the OWC 6G current?
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Old Mar 2, 2012, 10:41 PM   #132
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is the firmware up to date on mini i7 dual core and is the firmware up to date on the 2011 mac book pro . So far my base mini worked with 2 sata II ssds even the big 600 gb intel and it recorded an 18 gb eyetv it off loaded it to the internal and recorded it back.

ON monday I will test this with the big samsung. 512 gb series 830. this was the worst ssd with the non 1.6 firmware up date.
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Old Mar 3, 2012, 02:14 AM   #133
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Originally Posted by Edge View Post
Is the firmware on the OWC 6G current?
Yes, the firmware is up to date on the 480GB OWC Mercury Extreme Pro 6G, 2011 Mac mini 2.7GHz Dual-Core Intel i7 and 2011 15" MacBook Pro. Unfortunately, my only SATA II SSD is a 240GB Mercury Extreme Pro 3G deep inside my 2010 27" iMac. Plus, it's not a large capacity drive which tends to be the problem.

Some further detail... The large capacity SSDs in the Seagate Thunderbolt GoFlex 2.5" adapter disconnect and fail to write large files (+1.5GB) when the source is faster than USB 2.0. The faster the source the faster the disconnect and failure. For example, going from the 480GB OWC Mercury Extreme Pro 6G internal to the 512GB Samsung 830 external is near instant. The same copy over Ethernet fails in a minute. USB 2.0 copy completes without issue. It might be IO related to the controller in the Seagate Thunderbolt GoFlex adapter.
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Old Mar 4, 2012, 12:30 AM   #134
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Opened Support Ticket with OWC

As I'm sure that Samsung nor Seagate will comment on the issues we are seeing with the Seagate Thunderbolt GoFlex 2.5" adapter, I've opened a detailed ticket with OWC. Maybe they can comment on the issue.
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Old Mar 4, 2012, 03:23 AM   #135
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AS A follow up I will continue to use the series 320 600 gb intel even though it is sata II it is big and it is working.

I get sequential numbers;

like 225 MB write and 180 MB read.



along with random 4k numbers :

of 55 MB write and 14 MB read


So size of the ssd plus sata III seems to be the problem not size alone.

Also this worked like SH!!!!!!t with the same mini before the 1.6 firmware.


Any one with a big ssd sata II or Sata III please let us know if your gear works.

Also let us know if you have a mini (with 1.6 firmware).

or iMac ,macbook pro, airbook.


I would love to see if the problem is across all t-bolt ports with a 480gb plus ssd sata III. While copying a large file.
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Old Mar 6, 2012, 03:02 PM   #136
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I ordered the Seagate GoFlex Thunderbolt adapter on 2/24 and it just arrived today. I ave not opened the box yet... and I still need to buy a Thunderbolt cable. I do have a GoFlex HDD that I will test it with first... and then I'll try using it with my SSDs.

I have a quick question. Can I continue to use the HDD or SSD as both a Thunderbolt drive, and a USB 2.0 drive? The reason I ask is because my MBA is Thunderbolt, but my 2009 iMac is only USB 2.0.

/Jim
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Old Mar 6, 2012, 06:29 PM   #137
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Originally Posted by flynz4 View Post
I have a quick question. Can I continue to use the HDD or SSD as both a Thunderbolt drive, and a USB 2.0 drive? The reason I ask is because my MBA is Thunderbolt, but my 2009 iMac is only USB 2.0.

/Jim
Sure. But not at the same time. You'll need to swap interfaces when you move from one Mac to another.

Here's some news that I saw today:

Elgato offers Thunderbolt SSD
Quote:
According to the company’s website, the Thunderbolt SSD is capable of reading data at a rate of 270MBps—that data was gathered using a 15-inch 2.2GHz Core i7 MacBook Pro and the Extended Test in the QuickBench benchmark tool. A Thunderbolt channel, based on the specification, can provide up to 10Gbps of data throughput.

The Thunderbolt SSD is available in two capacities. The 120GB version is $430. The 240GB model is $700. Thunderbolt cable is not included.
http://www.macworld.com/article/1657...rbolt_ssd.html

I bought a Seagate GoFlex Thunderbolt Adapter and an OCZ Vertex 3 120GB SSD for $228 ($202 less than the Elgato SSD). I ran the Blackmagic Design disk speed test and recorded read speed of 376.6 MBps, which is about 40% faster than the Elgato SSD.

For the sake of speed and cost, I think that the Seagate GoFlex Thunderbolt Adapter and an OCZ Vertex 3 120GB SSD is a pretty good value. But I'm pretty new to SSDs and Thunderbolt.

What do you think. Is this a pretty good value?
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Old Mar 6, 2012, 07:10 PM   #138
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Originally Posted by DCJ001 View Post
Sure. But not at the same time. You'll need to swap interfaces when you move from one Mac to another.

Here's some news that I saw today:

Elgato offers Thunderbolt SSD

http://www.macworld.com/article/1657...rbolt_ssd.html

I bought a Seagate GoFlex Thunderbolt Adapter and an OCZ Vertex 3 120GB SSD for $228 ($202 less than the Elgato SSD). I ran the Blackmagic Design disk speed test and recorded read speed of 376.6 MBps, which is about 40% faster than the Elgato SSD.

For the sake of speed and cost, I think that the Seagate GoFlex Thunderbolt Adapter and an OCZ Vertex 3 120GB SSD is a pretty good value. But I'm pretty new to SSDs and Thunderbolt.

What do you think. Is this a pretty good value?
yes it appears to be a good deal I am finding that my crucial m4 128gb runs very nice with the t-bolt cable. also my huge intel 600gb ssd works fine. If your 120 vertex runs well it is a good deal as it is at least 100 bucks less then the elgato drive costs.
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Old Mar 6, 2012, 09:38 PM   #139
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OWC Ticket Update

OWC contacted me today said they are escalating the ticket for testing. They thanked me for the level of detail and variety of platforms I was able to report the issue. Hopefully, we will get a technical answer sooner than later.

I'm testing a 1TB Seagate FreeAgent GoFlex Drive (2.5" 5400RPM) in the Seagate Thunderbolt GoFlex 2.5" adapter. The extended real world read test demonstrated read stability with 12,000 plus random file type copy (60GB). I also performed the Transformers Dark of the Moon write test which the drive successfully passed. The drive also had lack luster Thunderbolt performance in Black Magic Disk Speed Test of 80MB/s. I imagine that the 1TB Hard Disk Drive in the Seagate FreeAgent GoFlex Drive has a pretty high power draw for a 2.5" drive.
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Old Mar 6, 2012, 10:09 PM   #140
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OT: I ordered a couple Seagate FreeAgent GoFlex enclosures from the eBay link a few posts ago. They arrived today with all the hardware and clean glossy piano black surfaces. However, the plastic snaps were pretty butchered and some broken off completely. I used crazy glue where I could and the enclosures ended up working just fine. Buyer beware.
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Old Mar 6, 2012, 10:20 PM   #141
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Originally Posted by shortcut3d View Post
OWC contacted me today said they are escalating the ticket for testing. They thanked me for the level of detail and variety of platforms I was able to report the issue. Hopefully, we will get a technical answer sooner than later.

I'm testing a 1TB Seagate FreeAgent GoFlex Drive (2.5" 5400RPM) in the Seagate Thunderbolt GoFlex 2.5" adapter. The extended real world read test demonstrated read stability with 12,000 plus random file type copy (60GB). I also performed the Transformers Dark of the Moon write test which the drive successfully passed. The drive also had lack luster Thunderbolt performance in Black Magic Disk Speed Test of 80MB/s. I imagine that the 1TB Hard Disk Drive in the Seagate FreeAgent GoFlex Drive has a pretty high power draw for a 2.5" drive.
as does the intel 600gb ssd. I thought that the problem was power based. Now I am not so sure.

what throws me off is mini-lacie-seagate with the seagate as the osx the lacie as a raid0 or a raid 1 or jbod works with everything I test.

but mini-seagate works with a lot but not all hdds and ssds. Now I know the power supply of the lacie sends juice to the seagate when daisy chained so I figured it was a power issue. but the lacie has a controller and the seagate has a different controller they seem to talk nice in every case. bugs me that I can't get every drive to work with the seagate alone.
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Old Mar 7, 2012, 06:59 PM   #142
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1TB Seagate FreeAgent GoFlex

I just had my first disconnect copying approximately 6GB from the 1Tb Segate FreeAgent GoFlex connected to the Seagate Thunderbolt 2.5" adapter. It now appears this issue is broader than just SATA III SSD larger than 480GB.
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Old Mar 8, 2012, 12:15 PM   #143
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I received a response from OWC and it appears the problem is with the Seagate Thunderbolt GoFlex 2.5" adapter and Seagate is aware.

Quote:
Hi shortcut3d,

Glad to hear it's performing well otherwise. *I spoke to some of our product development people, and apparently this is a problem that many makes/models of storage devices have with this particular adapter. *I've been told that Seagate is aware of the issue, so hopefully they'll be resolving the issue soon.
Sincerely,

OWC xxxxx
Technical Customer Service Representative
Other World Computing, Inc. (OWC)
OWC.net, Inc.
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Old Mar 9, 2012, 03:07 PM   #144
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I received a response from OWC and it appears the problem is with the Seagate Thunderbolt GoFlex 2.5" adapter and Seagate is aware.
I tried the Seagate GoFlex Thunderbolt STAE121 adapter with a Crucial M4 512GB on a 2011 iMac 27". Tried several simple tests of folder copies (about 6GB size) from internal HDD to the SSD and it always disconnects and was never able to copy more than 2GB.

I tried with TRIM enabled and disabled, made no difference.

I tried with the Crucial M4 firmware revision 009 and also the latest and greatest 0309 and it made no difference. I also have the same Crucial M4 on another iMac as an internal drive and its flawless.

I picked the Crucial M4 over the Samsung 830 as its supposed to have a better power usage profile; there have been some articles on the Samsung 830 having a high intermittent power draw.

The iMac has all the latest software, firmware and EFI.

This has got to be an adapter issue. Opened a case with Seagate but so far with less than a stellar response (does the mac have the latest drivers, firmware etc).

Oh well, it's new enough tech that we should expect teething troubles I guess. It's not called bleeding edge for nothing. I just hope the firmware on the Seagate adapter is user upgradeable.

SM
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Old Mar 9, 2012, 03:24 PM   #145
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Originally Posted by satishmovva View Post
I tried the Seagate GoFlex Thunderbolt STAE121 adapter with a Crucial M4 512GB on a 2011 iMac 27". Tried several simple tests of folder copies (about 6GB size) from internal HDD to the SSD and it always disconnects and was never able to copy more than 2GB.

I tried with TRIM enabled and disabled, made no difference.

I tried with the Crucial M4 firmware revision 009 and also the latest and greatest 0309 and it made no difference. I also have the same Crucial M4 on another iMac as an internal drive and its flawless.

I picked the Crucial M4 over the Samsung 830 as its supposed to have a better power usage profile; there have been some articles on the Samsung 830 having a high intermittent power draw.

The iMac has all the latest software, firmware and EFI.

This has got to be an adapter issue. Opened a case with Seagate but so far with less than a stellar response (does the mac have the latest drivers, firmware etc).

Oh well, it's new enough tech that we should expect teething troubles I guess. It's not called bleeding edge for nothing. I just hope the firmware on the Seagate adapter is user upgradeable.

SM
Thank you for contributing to the thread. I hope that Seagate does not shy away from this issue because we are using drives from manufacturers other than Seagate. I've only had one instance where the drive disconnected using an official 1TB Seagate FreeAgent GoFlex drive.
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Old Mar 9, 2012, 05:31 PM   #146
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really is a shame as the darn thing works great with my SATA II series 320 600gb intel. I am going to run it with a 240gb series III mushkin ssd today. Has a sandforce controller and is a new ssd never formatted or used. I had to do a lot of clean up first I hope to start testing in an hour or so.

I will format this for mac. I will copy large eyetv files to it 18 gb in size. this seems to be the acid test.

this is the drive.

http://www.neweggbusiness.com/Produc...82E16820226226
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Old Mar 9, 2012, 08:03 PM   #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shortcut3d View Post
Thank you for contributing to the thread. I hope that Seagate does not shy away from this issue because we are using drives from manufacturers other than Seagate. I've only had one instance where the drive disconnected using an official 1TB Seagate FreeAgent GoFlex drive.
Well, got an email back from Seagate Tech support stating that the adapter will only work with Seagate drives. I am returning my adapter. I would suggest others stay away from this adapter if their intent is to use non-seagate drives until the adapter is known to work with the standard SATA spec. Too bad, Seagate could have made a killing for the near future as the only Thunderbolt to SATA adapter manufacturer.

SM
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Old Mar 9, 2012, 08:41 PM   #148
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Well, got an email back from Seagate Tech support stating that the adapter will only work with Seagate drives. I am returning my adapter. I would suggest others stay away from this adapter if their intent is to use non-seagate drives until the adapter is known to work with the standard SATA spec. Too bad, Seagate could have made a killing for the near future as the only Thunderbolt to SATA adapter manufacturer.

SM
The STAE121 is not restricted to working with only Seagate drives. My OCZ Vertex 3 120GB SATA III drive is great with this adapter. And Seagate is doing pretty well without supporting other drives with their Thunderbolt adapters.
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Old Mar 9, 2012, 09:23 PM   #149
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I will submit a ticket with Seagate because I experience similar disconnect problems with the 1TB Seagate FreeAgent GoFlex drive in the Seagate Thunderbolt GoGlex 2.5" adapter. My guess is the adapter can not be easily updated and it's an issue with the internal controller.
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Old Mar 9, 2012, 09:56 PM   #150
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seems hit or miss but I have had all my ssd drives that were Sata II work. As big as a 600gb intel.

here is my first mush kin test. a 240gb ssd data III on xbench


here is the second test 7 big files on a mass copy so far so good. but this is from the internal 5400 rpm hdd. still it is a complex task. almost done
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Last edited by philipma1957; Mar 9, 2012 at 10:36 PM.
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