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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:16 AM   #51
DanteMann
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Typical. Apple copying Samsung. Can't wait for all the Samsung bashers to come out and show their blatant hypocritical ways. You know how much you enjoyed bashing Samsung for giving the consumer option of different sizes. Well better get all your made up reasons why Apple is so revolutionary and smart for offering a 7-ish inch tablet. Oh wait, I think I already know what it is. I think when Apple copies others or follows what the market leaders are doing it's called, "Apple doing it the right way."


What a joke.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:17 AM   #52
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Originally Posted by wikus View Post
4:3 is an old and dated aspect ratio, going back 10+ years to old CRT monitors and tube television sets.

16:10 would be far superior for movies, tv shows and other video content, especially since basically everything now is either 16x9 or 16x10.

For gaming, this isnt even debatable.

For reading, a huge majority of books were all much taller than wide on a single page, and this is especially true with newspapers.

4:3 may work for you. The reality is, its gotta go.

Personally, I don't care for tablets, I think theyre all useless toys that fail miserably to replace my laptop. But if I was going to get any one of them, it'd be either a playbook (i like its size and aspect ratio, as well as it is quite fast) or an Asus Transformer... and I'd probably go with a Transformer seeing how much more there is available on Android as well as the ability to root and flash the device with a custom rom.
The 16:10 and 16:9 aspect ratios are great for movies and games, but horrible for web browsing, books, text books. On the other hand, the 4:3 aspect ratio is great for web browsing, books, text books, it's decent for movies, and good for games, and overall it's better for apps since you've got a good amount of width and height to deal with. It's neither too high in portrait, nor too wide in landscape.

Based off what you've written, it sounds as if you've never used one. I've used an iPad, and I've read books on it, and I wouldn't want my iPad to be less wide when in portrait, nor less tall when in landscape.

I'd recommend you actually use one for some period of time and integrate it into your daily life before you bash 4:3 or praise 16:10.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:17 AM   #53
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I hope so, Jobs is gone and he wasn't always right.

A smaller iPad would be great and cater to different people and THEIR WANTS. Plus it'd get apple more money which after all, is what apple wants right? It would also allow them to not increase the iPad 3 price. There are people who would buy a regular iPad and a iPad mini.

People like options.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:21 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by DanteMann View Post
Can't wait for all the Samsung bashers to come out and show their blatant hypocritical ways. You know how much you enjoyed bashing Samsung for giving the consumer option of different sizes. Well better get all your made up reasons why Apple is so revolutionary and smart for offering a 7-ish inch tablet.

What a joke.
You assume everyone who said 7 inch slates were a mistake for Samsung won't do the same for Apple. I couldn't care less what Samsung does, but I don't see Apple ever releasing a 7 inch slate -- it's unlike them on many levels.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wordsmithmac View Post
I hope so, Jobs is gone and he wasn't always right.

A smaller iPad would be great and cater to different people and THEIR WANTS. Plus it'd get apple more money which after all, is what apple wants right? It would also allow them to not increase the iPad 3 price. There are people who would buy a regular iPad and a iPad mini.

People like options.
It may not necessarily make them enough money to be worth it. How many new customers would a 7 inch iPad actually bring? Or in other words, how many would buy a 7 inch iPad but absolutely refuse to buy a 9.7 inch iPad.

I think many would buy a 7 inch iPad, but I think they would also buy a 9.7 inch iPad if the option wasn't available. It's essentially taking sales off the larger iPad.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:26 AM   #55
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Not so far fetched

I see how news of two releases in the same year have never come true, and that the source isn't super reliable.

I just think this might be different, for the following reasons:

1. The ability to take on the Kindle Fire directly, during the Holiday season
2. Maybe it's not an iPad:

3rd quarter, back to school, amazingly priced ePad with all major textbooks ramping up.

I'm always wrong, but it's not that crazy. Can students afford a $500 iPad? You can't get a tipping point with that....but a $249 ePad, slightly smaller, ramped up with tons of text books...you could make a major impact with that.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:26 AM   #56
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People aren't getting it


Apple's in the content biz folks. They make money at the sale and then when you buy apps, music, books and video.

They have Apple TV for streaming content from the iOS device and a licensing strategy for "Made for iDevice"

They're not worried about cannibalization, as Tim Cook said, they have as much of an opportunity to profit after the sale as before.

Next up is monetizing cloud services.

Music in the cloud ....check
Backup in the cloud ...check (for iOS)
Photos in the cloud ...check (photostream)

Folks welcome to the Post PC era. The content no longer has to be tied to a local device. You may have a 7" iPad today but tomorrow you may have a 9.7" or a Mac.

Stop thinking small.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:32 AM   #57
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Originally Posted by MythicFrost View Post
I'd recommend you actually use one for some period of time and integrate it into your daily life before you bash 4:3 or praise 16:10.
I used a 4:3 monitor for about 10 years. I hated it. I'd hate a tablet at that ratio too. Reading books on basically a SQUARE screen is ridiculous. Browsing even THIS forum would be beneficial on 16:10 turned vertically.... just like a newspaper.

My phone is 16:10. I'd never want it to be 4:3.

Apple really dropped the ball on it though, but I don't care, since I'm never going to buy an iPad. To be honest, they dropped the ball on it from the get go, I was expecting something far closer to OS X for tablet than just an oversized iphone in the outdated 4:3 ratio.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:36 AM   #58
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I printed out the mockup that was posted and was actually very comfortable with the size. I don't see any reason why it couldn't work. It's a more comfortable size (and likely weight) for reading and web browsing. The current iPad is a bit too big for comfortable gaming, while the iPod touch is kind of a bit small. The in between size may be just right in that regard.

As much as I appreciate Jobs' product vision, I can't really understand why a 7.xx inch tablet wouldn't work while a 3.5 inch iPod touch or iPhone would.

Beyond that, in a generation or two, the iPad is likely to be able to run a full version of OS X. This may be a way to differentiate the product in the long run, still making an iOS tablet available for those who want one, with a full sized version running a full-grown OS.

I don't necessarily see it as imminent, but it's not a ridiculous idea.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:40 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by Mak47 View Post
Beyond that, in a generation or two, the iPad is likely to be able to run a full version of OS X.
This should have been the case since DAY ONE.

When I heard it was basically a giant iPhone, it was the biggest snoozefest I've ever experienced from apple.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:41 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by nuckinfutz View Post
Tim Cook said



http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Mobile-and-...dustry-477883/

I'm not sure Apple cares about cannibalization as long as they're in control. The developers don't have to make much changes. The reason why 7.85 is chosen as the screen size is because it's the same 4:3 ratio 1024 x 768 screen which means the UI elements get smaller but developers do not have to create new artwork.
How do they differentiate iPad 7.8 to 9.7 unless the 9.7 increases Resolution?

Well if they ported Autolayout from Cocoa Lion they could set the 8.7 as base line and scale up with fixed density.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:41 AM   #61
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I think they might produce it but not call it an iPad. It will be a new iPOD Touch
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:42 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MythicFrost View Post
You assume everyone who said 7 inch slates were a mistake for Samsung won't do the same for Apple. I couldn't care less what Samsung does, but I don't see Apple ever releasing a 7 inch slate -- it's unlike them on many levels.

It may not necessarily make them enough money to be worth it. How many new customers would a 7 inch iPad actually bring? Or in other words, how many would buy a 7 inch iPad but absolutely refuse to buy a 9.7 inch iPad.

I think many would buy a 7 inch iPad, but I think they would also buy a 9.7 inch iPad if the option wasn't available. It's essentially taking sales off the larger iPad.
there are a lot of people who don't want a 10inch tablet...they got kindle fire's... i saw no use for a 10inch tablet but I have an iPad1 that I use for a variety of things including reading and I'd prefer a smaller tablet. I want something more portable that I can handle with one hand more often as well.

Apple is changing, they can't cater to one rabid sect of buyer who see no purpose in having a smaller iPad. They'd go gangbusters in schools and with parents of small children as well. Apple is abandoning the Mac in favor of iOS, u seriously think they're just gonna make ONE style iPad forever? People don't want a 4inch iphone but it will happen at some point, why? consumers want it.

Apple is no longer the counter culture hippy barefoot radical and happy having a niche market... Apple is now the big corporation that answers to a board in a suit that wants total domination of their market and an interest in edging closer to per $1,000 shares.

It's evolution, multiple price points of a diverse product line, consumers decide. Apple keeps rolling in the money.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:46 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuckinfutz View Post
People aren't getting it


Apple's in the content biz folks. They make money at the sale and then when you buy apps, music, books and video.

They have Apple TV for streaming content from the iOS device and a licensing strategy for "Made for iDevice"

They're not worried about cannibalization, as Tim Cook said, they have as much of an opportunity to profit after the sale as before.

Next up is monetizing cloud services.

Music in the cloud ....check
Backup in the cloud ...check (for iOS)
Photos in the cloud ...check (photostream)

Folks welcome to the Post PC era. The content no longer has to be tied to a local device. You may have a 7" iPad today but tomorrow you may have a 9.7" or a Mac.

Stop thinking small.
Apple makes significantly more off of hardware than content sales. The content exists to sell more hardware, not the other way around (which would be Amazon's model). iCloud could follow the same paradigm. The more I integrate iCloud into my life, the more of a hassle it is for me to use non-Apple devices. Content feeds hardware sales. That's why so much of iCloud is free (at the moment).

So Apple won't put out hardware just for the sake of pushing content if the hardware doesn't pass its high usability standards. I still think a 7.85" screen lies awkwardly in "tweener" land. With the way iPad sales have been so far, there's no reason to diversify to a smaller and less usable screen size ... yet.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:47 AM   #64
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Originally Posted by Warbrain View Post
Scheduled for 3Q. Why? Because it doesn't exist and won't exist this year.
Correct. The demand for smaller tablets is pretty low.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:50 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by pewra View Post
Not gonna happen.
I agree.
Apple won't release more then one patch of iPads in one year. And secondly this inbetweener size does nothing bar fragment the iOS developer community who would have to develop their apps for multiple screen sizes.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by dreinfeld View Post
I think they might produce it but not call it an iPad. It will be a new iPOD Touch
Not going to happen. The Touch and the iPhone have the same screen size for a reason. So developers can develop for both without worrying about multiple screen sizes to develop for. iPad and touch/iPhone screens are enough.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 01:54 AM   #66
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Not going to happen. The Touch and the iPhone have the same screen size for a reason. So developers can develop for both without worrying about multiple screen sizes to develop for. iPad and touch/iPhone screens are enough.
Thats not an excuse though. If a developer is having difficult making a scalable application, he/she shouldnt be a developer in the first place.

Applications developed for desktops seem to be working JUST FINE on a plethora of resolutions. Why is it only now that apple has this ridiculous mandate on screen size now that we are to assume applications wont work on different screen sizes?
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 02:03 AM   #67
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Originally Posted by ixodes View Post
The naysayers must take that stance to bolster their need for negativity. You'd think they'd trust that Apple knows what they're doing.

I for one will buy a minimum of two of the smaller iPads, as an ideal more mobile companion to my full size models. The smaller size is just right for international flights where a more compact size is appropriate.

My opinion is once they've been shipped, suddenly they'll be praised as though Apples done the impossible. Funny the hypocrisy.
There is already a smaller version of the iPad it's called the iPod Touch and the iPhone.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 02:06 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thelookingglass View Post
Apple makes significantly more off of hardware than content sales. The content exists to sell more hardware, not the other way around (which would be Amazon's model). iCloud could follow the same paradigm. The more I integrate iCloud into my life, the more of a hassle it is for me to use non-Apple devices. Content feeds hardware sales. That's why so much of iCloud is free (at the moment).

So Apple won't put out hardware just for the sake of pushing content if the hardware doesn't pass its high usability standards. I still think a 7.85" screen lies awkwardly in "tweener" land. With the way iPad sales have been so far, there's no reason to diversify to a smaller and less usable screen size ... yet.
I think a fall launch of a smaller iPad tablet and iPhone creates a HUGE mobile push for Apple.

iOS 6 ships and tablets will probably be the "in thing" for this years busy shopping season. Amazon didn't hurt the iPad but they are looking to move to a larger Kindle Fire and that could compete a bit better.

If I can manage on my iPhone just fine a 7.85 screen isn't going to be too much of a struggle.

If there's not a market for smaller iPads there will be in 6 months.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 02:09 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by nuckinfutz View Post
I think a fall launch of a smaller iPad tablet and iPhone creates a HUGE mobile push for Apple.

iOS 6 ships and tablets will probably be the "in thing" for this years busy shopping season. Amazon didn't hurt the iPad but they are looking to move to a larger Kindle Fire and that could compete a bit better.

If I can manage on my iPhone just fine a 7.85 screen isn't going to be too much of a struggle.

If there's not a market for smaller iPads there will be in 6 months.
When has Apple Updated a version of a Product or added to it besides computers more then once a year? I don't think a mini iPad will happen this year or if it will happen at all. The ipad is Perfect the other tablets out there just aren't very good and they all try to copy the iPad.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 02:12 AM   #70
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Originally Posted by wizard View Post
Size has a lot to do with the Fires success. Everybody dismisses that but it is fact.
No it's not a fact, the kindle fire has had success because of the price and because it's made by a reliable trusted company, plus they have a HUGE kindle fan base. But mostly the price. If the tablet would've been 10" (and less laggy) they would've sold way more. And if they would've priced it at $500 they would've hardly sold any.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 02:28 AM   #71
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Too bad they waited until Steve Jobs died to bring out this one.

Apple wasn't in the game of racing to the bottom before, hopefully it doesn't become a trend for them to pander to the lowest common denominator.

Last edited by Drunken Master; Mar 1, 2012 at 11:27 AM.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 02:42 AM   #72
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I'd love to see a rimless design so you wouldn't lose that much of actual screen size.

Use as a telephone with a plug-in microphone/earphone would be great, too, both on wireless networks and on wifi.

PS: Looks like the success of the smaller Kindle and Nook (just saw it today at B&N) has made Apple think about smaller iPads.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 02:43 AM   #73
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Originally Posted by shanmugam View Post
while samsung churning out 7" tabs.

1024x768 pixel 7" or near to 8" will work wonders. let us wait and see.
Samsung? "Churning them out?" HAHAHAHAHA. Perhaps they're churning them out, but they're sitting on the shelves.

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I made a statement as a free speech citizen of the untied states I basically said Chxxx Suxxx. <rant snipped>
Don't let the door hit you, you xenophobic, uneducated hick.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kresh View Post
hmm. If the Kindle Fire and other 7" tabs are having no effect on Apple, as claimed by Cook, why is Apple building this device?
They're not building the device.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wikus View Post
1024x768 translates to 4:3. That aspect ratio is a disgrace.

I've no idea why Apple is using it. 16x10 should be the standard.
You have no idea what you're talking about. 16:10 is horrible for anything but watching movies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wikus View Post
For movies and gaming, 16x10 wins big time. For reading, I would imaging it'd be a lot better as the 'page' would be taller, much more like a real book.

If you've ever seen the playbook, it'd be very similar, just a little taller when in landscape mode.
For movies, yes. For gaming? No. Vertical real estate is key. If you have any kind of heads up display / status bar, you WANT that vertical real estate, otherwise it's cutting into the field of play for the game. Extra space on the sides of the screen is just that: extra.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wikus View Post
4:3 is an old and dated aspect ratio, going back 10+ years to old CRT monitors and tube television sets.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wikus View Post
4:3 may work for you. The reality is, its gotta go.
Delusional.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wikus View Post
Personally, I don't care for tablets, I think theyre all useless toys that fail miserably to replace my laptop. But if I was going to get any one of them, it'd be either a playbook (i like its size and aspect ratio, as well as it is quite fast) or an Asus Transformer... and I'd probably go with a Transformer seeing how much more there is available on Android as well as the ability to root and flash the device with a custom rom.
Off the deep end, mate. You're still complaining about tablets and where they fit in the market? You're wrong. Very, very wrong. They may not fit your needs, but you're a geek. You're in the extreme minority. Deal with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanteMann View Post
Typical. Apple copying Samsung. Can't wait for all the Samsung bashers to come out and show their blatant hypocritical ways. You know how much you enjoyed bashing Samsung for giving the consumer option of different sizes. Well better get all your made up reasons why Apple is so revolutionary and smart for offering a 7-ish inch tablet. Oh wait, I think I already know what it is. I think when Apple copies others or follows what the market leaders are doing it's called, "Apple doing it the right way."
What a joke.
Did you just call Samsung the market leader? Wow. I hope you're just not very good at sarcasm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nuckinfutz View Post
People aren't getting it


Apple's in the content biz folks.
I suggest you take a look at Apple's earnings statements, then come back. You're correct that someone "isn't getting it", but it's not the people that you think.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wikus View Post
To be honest, they dropped the ball on it from the get go, I was expecting something far closer to OS X for tablet than just an oversized iphone in the outdated 4:3 ratio.
yawn.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wikus View Post
This should have been the case since DAY ONE.

When I heard it was basically a giant iPhone, it was the biggest snoozefest I've ever experienced from apple.
Geek.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 02:43 AM   #74
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Originally Posted by nuckinfutz View Post
Multiple sources have reported the testing of a smaller iPad.
I'm sure certain Apple employees have walked around testing multiple smaller iPad AND iPhone prototypes.
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Old Mar 1, 2012, 02:46 AM   #75
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Great. Now, for the similar sized MacBook Air. The ultimate Keynote and PowerPoint presentation tools. For heavier work, just get the larger models.
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