If The Mac Pro is Dead - What next?

[Derpage]

The "current" Mac Pro is a dinosaur, with a meteor heading right towards the planet. That meteor will either be a new model Mac Pro, or the killing off of the product. I hope for the first option.

[pprior]

Last time I bought the mac pro, they had the new workstation processors before everyone else. The fact that the new workstation processors are now shipping and not a peep from Apple does not bode well at all.

[Umbongo]

Originally Posted by pprior

Last time I bought the mac pro, they had the new workstation processors before everyone else. The fact that the new workstation processors are now shipping and not a peep from Apple does not bode well at all.

Last time they launched a Mac Pro it took them 5 months before they shipped.

[24Frames]

Originally Posted by pprior

Last time I bought the mac pro, they had the new workstation processors before everyone else. The fact that the new workstation processors are now shipping and not a peep from Apple does not bode well at all.

It means nothing whatsoever.
HP are shipping, but only in the US.
Lenovo are shipping, but only in the US.
Dell have announced, but aren't shipping anywhere!
Apple will announce, but only when they have something to ship. With luck that will be in the coming days or weeks.

Intel seem to be having problems ramping up the production of both the new Xeon E5-2600 series and Ivy Bridge. We don't really know how good the supply of AMD and NVidias new GPUs is to OEMs.

Apple and the other vendors have sample CPUs months before the release for testing. They have also been receiving (according to Intel's CEO's comment on the matter in late January) production Xeons since late January. The problem lies in Intel's ability to ramp up production so that there are enough chips to actually release new PCs / Macs.

No News means no more or less than that. Apple will announce and ship when they have Macs ready to buy. Until then it is a waiting and guessing game.

All these companies want to ship as fast as technically possible to maximise their returns. They are probably even more frustrated than you are!

[G51989]

The Mac Pro is a super cool machine, I would hate to see it go, I would use one for my job if I could. But, OSX+I can build a machine twice as fast for less money kinda kills that, esp when my department won't pay for a Pro lol.

If the Mac Pro goes away, which I highly doubt it will. People who need Mac Pro performance will move over to high end 7 Machines.

The Mac Pro can ONLY make money, even if they don't sell a lot of them. For the most part they use off the shelf parts, so R and D cost for Apple is VERY low. So they'd be retarded to get rid of the Mac Pro. The lack of a refresh is the main reason I haven't bought one yet, Sure I have a couple awesome PC rigs, but I have money to burn and a Mac pro would look sexy sitting next to my main PC rig on my work desk.

Oh and by the way, I'm sick and tired of people saying " Oh why would you want to run OSX on a ugly cheap POS ". Let me tell you something right now, sure lower end HPs Dells and Gateway are crap. But there are PC makers out there who blow the hell out of Apple when it comes to build quality. Rain PC, Falcon Northwest, Sager, Shuttle, GAMEPC just to name a few. Yeah, Apples are awesome. But there are plenty of PC makers in existence that build computers just as well, and some of them even do it better.

[Luba]

I heard of Falcon Northwest which make high end gaming PCs, the others I have heard of . . . Rain PC makes a nice looking workstation. But looks like only Rain and Shuttle make workstations. A high end gaming PC could be turned into a workstation by changing the graphics card for 3D work, video editing, etc., correct?

Originally Posted by G51989

The Mac Pro is a super cool machine, I would hate to see it go, I would use one for my job if I could. But, OSX+I can build a machine twice as fast for less money kinda kills that, esp when my department won't pay for a Pro lol.

If the Mac Pro goes away, which I highly doubt it will. People who need Mac Pro performance will move over to high end 7 Machines.

The Mac Pro can ONLY make money, even if they don't sell a lot of them. For the most part they use off the shelf parts, so R and D cost for Apple is VERY low. So they'd be retarded to get rid of the Mac Pro. The lack of a refresh is the main reason I haven't bought one yet, Sure I have a couple awesome PC rigs, but I have money to burn and a Mac pro would look sexy sitting next to my main PC rig on my work desk.

Oh and by the way, I'm sick and tired of people saying " Oh why would you want to run OSX on a ugly cheap POS ". Let me tell you something right now, sure lower end HPs Dells and Gateway are crap. But there are PC makers out there who blow the hell out of Apple when it comes to build quality. Rain PC, Falcon Northwest, Sager, Shuttle, GAMEPC just to name a few. Yeah, Apples are awesome. But there are plenty of PC makers in existence that build computers just as well, and some of them even do it better.

[ClassObject]

If its dead it's dead. Big deal. I'll go for a walk, bike ride, roll with my wife, or maybe get a different computer. If it is dead, something will replace it.

[JoeG4]

Meh, @ the "a high end gaming computer could be turned into a workstation by changing the video card" comment. Not exactly. Then again, Apple's machines are usually about that.. they use Xeons and thus, Xeon boards.. so they're more like 2/3 real workstation.

However, I'm positive. Ultra positive, that Apple will be releasing a new Mac Pro sometime soon. Yep. They better!

[theSeb]

I wish there was some concrete info on availability so we could stop feeling around in the dark

[bottleneck]

Originally Posted by theSeb

I wish there was some concrete info on availability so we could stop feeling around in the dark

Word.

People who use Mac Pros for buisness should be able to plan ahead.
"Either you take our old hardware and pay way over marketprices or keep feeling around in the dark."

That attitude or buisnessplan starts to irritate me.

[xgman]

I guess we are really on the verge of changing this thread title to simply "what now"

[JimT1701]

I wish Apple would simply release a Mac tower, basically rip the display off the iMac. I currently use 3 displays on my Mac Pro 2006 and no other Mac line supports this. C'mon Apple stop forcing your expensive displays on us.

[jshbckr]

Originally Posted by G51989

The Mac Pro is a super cool machine, I would hate to see it go, I would use one for my job if I could. But, OSX+I can build a machine twice as fast for less money kinda kills that, esp when my department won't pay for a Pro lol.

If the Mac Pro goes away, which I highly doubt it will. People who need Mac Pro performance will move over to high end 7 Machines.

The Mac Pro can ONLY make money, even if they don't sell a lot of them. For the most part they use off the shelf parts, so R and D cost for Apple is VERY low. So they'd be retarded to get rid of the Mac Pro. The lack of a refresh is the main reason I haven't bought one yet, Sure I have a couple awesome PC rigs, but I have money to burn and a Mac pro would look sexy sitting next to my main PC rig on my work desk.

Oh and by the way, I'm sick and tired of people saying " Oh why would you want to run OSX on a ugly cheap POS ". Let me tell you something right now, sure lower end HPs Dells and Gateway are crap. But there are PC makers out there who blow the hell out of Apple when it comes to build quality. Rain PC, Falcon Northwest, Sager, Shuttle, GAMEPC just to name a few. Yeah, Apples are awesome. But there are plenty of PC makers in existence that build computers just as well, and some of them even do it better.

One thing you're not considering, though, is that people who use Mac Pros professionally (including myself) can't deal with the compatibility issues that come with creating a hackintosh. Most of us don't even upgrade our software (OS or otherwise) without having a backup or checking compatibility. I work on projects with incredibly tight deadlines, our company can't afford a computer being down for even a day. That extra couple thousand dollars is nothing when the computer is your professional tool and you need the reliability that comes with running OS X on a real Mac Pro.

[ugru]

Originally Posted by JimT1701

I currently use 3 displays on my Mac Pro 2006 and no other Mac line supports this.

Current iMac does, even with non apple displays...

The whole point of a MacPro is:
- processor's raw power (more cores) for software that actually uses it;
- GPU power;
- ability to upgrade and expand easily HD/SSD - GPU - RAM and/or other internal hardware;
- reliability under heavy load.

if you do not need/want any of the above iMac is a perfectly suitable choice for you

[JimT1701]

I guess I should say I prefer a computer with no built-in display (unless it is a laptop). Also I am using DisplayPort and DVI displays. Which currently selling Mac (besides the Mac Pro) would allow me to use my 2x Dell U2412M over DisplayPort and my Dell 2007FP over DVI? Has anyone released a Thunderbolt dock with 3 display outputs and eSATA? I am not a huge fan of USB display adapters. I would love to move over to a MacBook Pro only if I could drive all my displays 90% of the time using some sort of docking solution. Knowing the time I would use it as a laptop would only be if traveling.

[asnozz]

Originally Posted by 24Frames

It means nothing whatsoever.
HP are shipping, but only in the US.
Lenovo are shipping, but only in the US.
Dell have announced, but aren't shipping anywhere!
Apple will announce, but only when they have something to ship. With luck that will be in the coming days or weeks.

Thats not strictly true, but I agree with your point. Lenovo is still selling and shipping D20's, they havent said when the D30's will be released (the Lenovo equivalent of the Mac Pro).... but atleast they have pre-announced the machines (which Apple rarely does anyway)

[derbothaus]

Originally Posted by JoeG4

Meh, @ the "a high end gaming computer could be turned into a workstation by changing the video card" comment. Not exactly. Then again, Apple's machines are usually about that.. they use Xeons and thus, Xeon boards.. so they're more like 2/3 real workstation.

However, I'm positive. Ultra positive, that Apple will be releasing a new Mac Pro sometime soon. Yep. They better!

Yeah. It's kind of the other way around. A workstation can be turned into a gaming computer by changing the video card. It depends on your work needs. Compiling and science/math disciplines have definite needs that are better served by Xeon over consumer i7. You have a great gaming computer processor if it is 2.6GHz Quad core or better. Either in core or clock speed. The bottleneck is always the GPU and Hard Disk.

[JoeG4]

I think you're giving the Xeons a little too much credit, in most cases they're just i7s with the added capability of multi-processor configurations and ECC memory. That in itself is nice Good workstations also use better motherboards than the consumer-grade hardware, though gaming boards are really really good (they probably beat the crap out of low end workstation boards).

The 1st gen Mac Pro had some liquid electrolytic capacitors in it. Surprised the crap out of me. They called THAT a workstation? Really?

[derbothaus]

Originally Posted by JoeG4

I think you're giving the Xeons a little too much credit, in most cases they're just i7s with the added capability of multi-processor configurations and ECC memory. That in itself is nice Good workstations also use better motherboards than the consumer-grade hardware, though gaming boards are really really good (they probably beat the crap out of low end workstation boards).

The 1st gen Mac Pro had some liquid electrolytic capacitors in it. Surprised the crap out of me. They called THAT a workstation? Really?

I am not giving Xeon's any credit actually. Just the distinction that they are slightly different and have features that i7 doesn't. Mostly in error tolerance and binning not "just" ECC and dual QPI. It is up to you whether you need them or not. My point was that any proc will work for a video game beyond a certain point. Not every i7 will work for a professional workstation. Take a PC with a GTX 580 or similar in it. What is the difference between a 3.4GHz i7 and a 5.4GHz i7 in your video game? Like 3-10FPS maybe. Any X58/ X79 board will do. It is the features and over-clocking tools you pay for. And why really bother when you are GPU bound? There are some dev's who swear a Xeon clocked the same and same gen as an off the shelf i7 compile 50% or more faster in something like Xbench. For example.

[deconstruct60]

Originally Posted by 24Frames

Intel seem to be having problems ramping up the production of both the new Xeon E5-2600 series and Ivy Bridge. We don't really know how good the supply of AMD and NVidias new GPUs is to OEMs.

The E5 and Ivy Bridge may be coupled if Intel had originally planned to use the "excess" capacity on the 32nm lines as the Sandy Bridge Core i wound down to ramp up the 32nm E5's. If they had to continue to crank out SB Core i for a couple of months then there wouldn't be any "excess" to ramp into.


There is a bit more evidence that the E5-1600 may be playing a role here too. Folks have posited that because 2600's are available at newegg that Apple should be able to get their hands on them. Well, the 1600's is missing 2/3 of the line-up (1650 and 1620 ) at newegg ( so it isn't being shipped by them either).

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...dge-ep&x=0&y=0

This isn't really "new". It has been that way for about a month now. So it is doubtful they "ran out earlier this week" and temporarily dropped it from the line up.


That HP , Dell and many other large vendors have slow rolled this roll out points to some non-Apple specific issue. There may be some Apple contribution also (e.g., GPU card selection that is also stalled) but in general alot of folks have their underwear in a twist much more then there is a real problem here.

All these companies want to ship as fast as technically possible to maximise their returns. They are probably even more frustrated than you are!

Crap happens. Even the most detailed plans can be sidetracked (e.g., Japanes earthquake/tsunami and Thailand floods last year).

[JoeG4]

Originally Posted by derbothaus

There are some dev's who swear a Xeon clocked the same and same gen as an off the shelf i7 compile 50% or more faster in something like Xbench. For example.

Those devs are nuts, besides who professionally uses computer benchmarks besides reviewers? I kinda wish Apple would drop the "Pro" name because it doesn't really mean anything since what people use their computers for professionally varies. To many, an iPad is a professional computing device since their profession requires minimal computer use.

The most vocal crowd when it comes to the capabilities of the Mac Pro appears to be video editors. Curiously, I bet a lot of Mac Pros in the setup thread are owned by porn editors.

Perhaps Apple has truly "sold out" in the sense that they are only going to make whatever makes them the most money possible from this point forward; After all, that seems to be a well-respected viewpoint around here. It'd be a real shame, just like when Google killed off their Labs projects. Companies NEED a little bit of oddness and some hobby projects - that was always the difference between Silicon Valley companies, and IBM.

[top]

Since there will never be a mac pro again I will be getting an iMac. I use my machine for video edition 3d motion graphics and adobe products



iMac 27 maxed out processor
Maxed out video card
256 SSD + 1TB (WISH I COULD PUT A SECOND DRIVE IN MANUALLY BUT NOPE
32Gb of ram
Thunderbolt display
Pegasus R6 6tb thunderbolt display (Raid 10)
Thunderbolt cable
Time capsule (need a new router plus to back up the iMacs drives)

[Nostromo]

There will be a Mac Pro.

PS: If this thread is dead, what next?

[Crazy82]

It's clearly so Apple if you don't upgrade the Mac pro's regulary then people won't buy it and you don't make any money of it. So my advice to Apple is upgrade the damn thing!! AND SOON!!

----------

Just to be clear I will by a iMac!!

[derbothaus]

Originally Posted by JoeG4

Those devs are nuts, besides who professionally uses computer benchmarks besides reviewers? I kinda wish Apple would drop the "Pro" name because it doesn't really mean anything since what people use their computers for professionally varies. To many, an iPad is a professional computing device since their profession requires minimal computer use.

The most vocal crowd when it comes to the capabilities of the Mac Pro appears to be video editors. Curiously, I bet a lot of Mac Pros in the setup thread are owned by porn editors.

Perhaps Apple has truly "sold out" in the sense that they are only going to make whatever makes them the most money possible from this point forward; After all, that seems to be a well-respected viewpoint around here. It'd be a real shame, just like when Google killed off their Labs projects. Companies NEED a little bit of oddness and some hobby projects - that was always the difference between Silicon Valley companies, and IBM.

So sorry Joe I meant Xcode ffs Not Xbench. I typo'd. Some users need more than 4 physical cores no matter what the single thread prowess is on those cores. It sounds like you think no one needs the power. Professional means what it has always meant. Someone who uses the tool to make their primary income. Can you write off your Mac on your taxes? Then you qualify. Has little to do with actual work routines (to me anyway). Porn editors ARE pro as well if they make their money in porn business. I don't confuse "Pro" with "tasteful" or "talented" or "video" or anything else.