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Old Jun 11, 2012, 04:42 PM   #51
The-Pro
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So *********** annoying. Real shame.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 04:47 PM   #52
that1guyy
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Just because it wasn't updated today doesn't mean it's dead. Maybe they're working on a retina display for the 17inch and it won't be ready until August or something. They have released the 17inch later than the smaller models before. So calm the hell down kids. There is still hope.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 04:47 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by CylonGlitch View Post
This seems to make sense to me. The positive point of the 17" was the higher resolution display. Now the 15.4 Retina MBP blows it out of the water; thus the right move. I never wanted a 17" because it was just too big; but I WANT this new 15 inch.
The 17" screen had a larger working space.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 04:51 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by macnerd93 View Post
But who other than a few high end videographers and hipster kids with rich parents, who think they are a pro photographers because they can make a photo black and white in iPhoto actually bought them? It was a very niche market, due to the high cost.

Clearly I'm kidding but you get the point. Pretty obvious a certain minority have no sense of humour on here.

The 15'' retina appears way more powerful size is about perfect for a laptop. Not too big or too small, I know you lose the express card slot though

Although back in 2003 I'd have been laughing if someone said to me 9 years from now Apple are gonna drop the 17'' model from their lineup and focus on 13'' and 15'' models from now on as i'd have thought they'd have focused on going slightly larger like 19'' heck even 20'' it was 2003 lol

Sure, they ran the numbers and sales didn't add up, but the truth is, as nice as the new 15" retina looks...I need the that real estate. Heavy to carry, yes..But an essential tool for me. I guess I;m lucky to have an eight month old top spec 17"...I'm sad, but as you point out, it's all about the numbers and I'm not surprised if I'm really honest with myself. What would a 17" retina to end have cost? Many many $$. Would I have upgraded to one. Yes.

The end of an era..
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 04:55 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by that1guyy View Post
Just because it wasn't updated today doesn't mean it's dead. Maybe they're working on a retina display for the 17inch and it won't be ready until August or something. They have released the 17inch later than the smaller models before. So calm the hell down kids. There is still hope.
I truly hope so but with current business model Apple isn't showing much love to their old core users so I'm not very optimistic about that.


Then again... I ****ING hate the days when I had to edit with that tiny 15" PowerBook. When 17" was released it made working on road so much better. I truly hope Apple will show some serious love for those who loved their 17" MBP.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 04:58 PM   #56
osx86
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a slow death

F@cking great.
Of the 2 models I exclusively use, 1 got discontinued and 1 got a "on-life-support" refresh.

Say goodbye to the diehard mac-heads...
First they killed the servers. Then it was the OS, the server OS, and
FCP being neutered. Now it is the 17" mbp dying a horrible death at the hands of the suits. Next it will our beloved mac pros.

We plead with you to stop killing the professional hardware & software.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 04:59 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guyy View Post
Just because it wasn't updated today doesn't mean it's dead. Maybe they're working on a retina display for the 17inch and it won't be ready until August or something. They have released the 17inch later than the smaller models before. So calm the hell down kids. There is still hope.
The 17" has been pulled from the Apple Store. It's only available in the refurb section. I could be wrong, but usually an item only gets pulled from the store when Apple decides they are no longer going to sell it. If it was just going to be updated later then I think we would still see the current model for sale.

I'm really sad because I love my 17" MBP. I like having the screen real estate for multitasking.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:09 PM   #58
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This was a very short-sighted decision and will annoy many high-end users.

The user base might not be as high in numbers, but it's not all just numbers.

Quite a few people in film/video and audio need larger notebooks, and they don't care about maximum portability.

Seen in context with the poor Mac Pro "upgrade" I am now really questioning if Apple is still interested in retaining a professional user base.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:11 PM   #59
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Squinting, bending forwards or paying up?

Squinting?
I use the 17" half of the time as desktop replacement, other half on the road. Works great for technical drawing, photoshop and other lots-of-toolbars-in-your-screen software.

Bending forwards to see everything on a 15", however high the resolution, works on the road, but as a desktop replacement? I think it replaces my 17" with a hernia from bending forwards.

Or paying up?
Getting a 1000,- external monitor for the 50% of the time I am at a desk?
Smart move Apple, you justed forcefully increased sales!

I don't expect a 17" release with the new MBP seeing how much battery power the retina display eats up.
Or maybe try to create a short cut key for every command possible so I can get rid of the toolbars and have a bit of workspace in my screen left over.

I doubt I'll ditch my 17" in the near future. I love my back too much so I might take in on an intercontinental holiday (big Apple?) with the family from the money I didn't spend on a new MBP with external monitor...
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:14 PM   #60
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I love my 17. Its a back-breaker (relative to the airs and the new 15"), but the screen is worth every second of agony hauling it around. For me, resolution and size are BOTH important. Yes, I could work on the new 15. I want one despite the fact its not the size I'd prefer.

As an IT guy who dabbles in graphics (3d rendering) and programming, the 650m has me drooling, a lot of the latest CUDA/OpenCL stuff needs the latest architecture - and Kepler is just the thing. I'd kill for it to be in the 17" format though, because that extra screen real estate during a presentation, working with code, or doing complex mesh work? Its a lifesaver. And heaven knows, I can plop my 17" down in front of most people and give a one-on-one presentation without too much trouble. But a 15"?

rant

This decision to axe the 17" AND the earlier one that eliminated the X-Serve hardware really makes it difficult for my IT coworker and I to pitch moving to a fully mac based environment. We only put server class equipment in the server room (right now DL360 G7s) and we want to put all mac on the floor. iMac's for most everyone, 15" MBPs for the mobile workers, and new Mac Pros for the creative staff (our plans of giving them 17" MBP's for remote work just went out the window). Its annoying that to manage such a deployment we'd have to hack a linux file-archive solution in order to get the desktop and local-user archive folder info backed up regularly so that our staff doesn't have to think about the tech or manually put their data on a windows share. And no, its not an elegant solution to load up server on a mac-pro and stuff it on a shelf in a rack! I want the X-serve, or let me legally load a copy of server on ESX!

/rant
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:18 PM   #61
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When is someone going to release a Intel laptop, non-Apple that runs OSX out of the box?

yes there are hackintosh but it's a pain to get all of the drivers working.

if a company built one like a screaming gaming machine, that would run OSX out of the box, i'd buy it and never look back.

like this one
http://rjtech.com/shop/index.php?dis...oduct_id=30028

i can trick this out for $2,419 and it would destroy any MBP17"

Last edited by the-wanderer; Jun 11, 2012 at 05:28 PM.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:31 PM   #62
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Apparently flash on Retina MBP is not in a form of SSD drive but built on the motherboard. Also the memory is not user replaceable (seriously?!?). Colleague of mine just talked with Apple rep who gave him this info. This sounds seriously bad and I truly hope Apple rep was misinformed.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:35 PM   #63
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During the WWDC this picture was up on the screen of the 15" MBP Retina display. They Cook specifically said the video on the upper right was a full 1080p video. Thus using that, and the known resolution of the Retina we can see the proportions of the new display, 1080p, and the old 17" MBP.

You should have a TON more room with the new 15" MBP.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:37 PM   #64
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That's the most stupid thing that could happen!

I was just awaiting for the next refresh of MBPs 17 and MacPro (you know, running a recording studio there's NO other hardware to work the mix). And the news are: no more 17 and no Macpro refresh! I just can't believe it!

Currently writing and working on my third MBP 17 in 4 years. It is (it was) really the most advanced notebook on planet Earth. And now it's dead.

Running the portable recording sessions in October 2011 model (refurbished) 2 years from now will just be... I don't know, I just can't believe it.
Or alternatively Apple suggests buying a set of +3 reading glasses to read 3mm-wide Logic channel strips on the 15 retina. Ah so if next news is that Logic Pro is discontinued then, so long Apple.

I hope there's just going to be such an amount of complaint from us "poor" 1% revenue makers that some big brain at Apple will go back thinking that they're just killing the pros (or putting them in real real trouble).

I think it's just not Apple any more.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:40 PM   #65
Nuvi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the-wanderer View Post
When is someone going to release a Intel laptop, non-Apple that runs OSX out of the box?

yes there are hackintosh but it's a pain to get all of the drivers working.

if a company built one like a screaming gaming machine, that would run OSX out of the box, i'd buy it and never look back.

like this one
http://rjtech.com/shop/index.php?dis...oduct_id=30028

i can trick this out for $2,419 and it would destroy any MBP17"
In the clone era Power Computing, UMAX and couple of others were selling fully licensed HIGH END Mac clones. They were much faster then Apple's. In matter of fact Power Computing had fastest personal computer around Windows machines included. Eventually Steve Jobs killed the clones (Apple bought Power Computing) because Apple wasn't able to compete with then.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:43 PM   #66
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As many others have said, it's not just about resolution, it's also about physical size. The MBP 17 has a large enough screen to show photos to two clients at a size that has them feel comfortable; a 15-inch screen doesn't. On my MBP 17, I can have two apps side-by-side on the screen and the smallest text in each is comfortably readable at a normal viewing distance; that is not the case on a 15-inch screen.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:45 PM   #67
Sincci
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Originally Posted by CylonGlitch View Post
During the WWDC this picture was up on the screen of the 15" MBP Retina display. They Cook specifically said the video on the upper right was a full 1080p video. Thus using that, and the known resolution of the Retina we can see the proportions of the new display, 1080p, and the old 17" MBP.

You should have a TON more room with the new 15" MBP.
Image
While the video might be full hd 1080p, it doesn't mean that what you are seeing in that picture takes 1920x1080 pixels of space..
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:48 PM   #68
CylonGlitch
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Originally Posted by Sincci View Post
While the video might be full hd 1080p, it doesn't mean that what you are seeing in that picture takes 1920x1080 pixels of space..
My understanding and it does correspond to approximate sizes that yes it is the full 1920x1080.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:49 PM   #69
Nuvi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CylonGlitch View Post
During the WWDC this picture was up on the screen of the 15" MBP Retina display. They Cook specifically said the video on the upper right was a full 1080p video. Thus using that, and the known resolution of the Retina we can see the proportions of the new display, 1080p, and the old 17" MBP.

You should have a TON more room with the new 15" MBP.
Image
Sure the video is 1080p but the rest (GUI) is pixel doubled 1440x900. So there is much less room for GUI elements then in 17" MBP. Just compare iPad 1 or 2 and new 3rd gen iPad and you get the consept or Retina displays. Then take a look at HiDPI GUI elements in OS X. Retina displays are all about crispness of GUI elements and has nothing to do with additional workspace. If you are not using pixel doubling then the GUI elements will be super tiny.

Edit: MBP Retina display is 220 dpi and regular is about half of it. They used to be 72 dpi but now they are around 100 or bit more. OS X HiDPI elements are huge ass graphics if viewed on regular display but on 220 DPI screen they are same size as normal but with good detail. As said Retina is ultimate eye candy but has zero help if you want more working space.

Last edited by Nuvi; Jun 11, 2012 at 06:00 PM.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:50 PM   #70
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Originally Posted by CylonGlitch View Post
You should have a TON more room with the new 15" MBP.
But at what cost? I use my 17-in MBP most of the time in my lap. It's not sitting on a desktop, so the screen is a good 3-feet away from my eyes. Even with the 17-in screen at 1920 x 1080, there are times where I need to use the zoom feature to be able to read some tiny text, or physically move the monitor closer. This new retina display, while stunning, will also have serious potential to be a major eye strainer.

I hope Apple changes their minds and starts offering a 17-in model again.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 05:54 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by Av1o3 View Post
They quietly upgraded it. Look at the apple store.
That wasn't an upgrade.
It was 5770, no USB3, no Thunderbolt kick in the slats.
Insulting to call that POS new.
Nobody is fooled, least of all outraged Mac Pro users.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 06:01 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by Bubba Satori View Post
That wasn't an upgrade.
It was 5770, no USB3, no Thunderbolt kick in the slats.
Insulting to call that POS new.
Nobody is fooled, least of all outraged Mac Pro users.
So true....Many Hackintosh plans are being made as we post I think.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 06:04 PM   #73
Nuvi
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Originally Posted by Croq View Post
But at what cost? I use my 17-in MBP most of the time in my lap. It's not sitting on a desktop, so the screen is a good 3-feet away from my eyes. Even with the 17-in screen at 1920 x 1080, there are times where I need to use the zoom feature to be able to read some tiny text, or physically move the monitor closer. This new retina display, while stunning, will also have serious potential to be a major eye strainer.

I hope Apple changes their minds and starts offering a 17-in model again.

You won't get any additional screen space on Retina MBP. It's just like the old 1440x900 15" MBP but with more sharper graphics just like in the new iPad.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 06:04 PM   #74
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Weeping over this. A bit angry over this.

I LOVE my 17" MBP. I debated screen size for a week or two, read a bunch of differing opinions, then got the 17" and was so glad I did. If you work on a lot of different applications or prefer having more screen real estate for graphics, music, or film editing, it's amazingly helpful. It's also really nice for movies. I feel constrained when working on a 15" now; it's possible to get things done, but not nearly as efficient for my work and the screen just feels a bit cramped. As the MBP weights are getting lighter over time it even starts to reduce the only significant 17" drawback, so it would be sad to see them go away now.

There are a few aspects of responsibility toward a customer base that Apple should be considering, particularly when the customer base is so loyal to them. A small percentage of users who strongly prefer/need a particular model should be accommodated wherever there's no huge loss to doing so, even if the marginal profit isn't big. There's an advantage to offering a range of product types as a set so you bring people in to the fold. For example, a company providing laptops for ten people, one or two of whom want a 17" laptop, gets pushback if Apple can't provide that.

Yikes. I'm really hoping they are just working toward a retina 17" when feasible. Else I'm clinging to this 17" MBP for years to come.
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Old Jun 11, 2012, 06:05 PM   #75
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The new MacBook Pro's seem great. However, I am seriously disappointed that they did not announce a new 17". 2012 is an upgrade year for me and I was ready to buy. Now I don't know what to do. I'll probably wait and see. Hopefully a new 17" will be announces in the future.

For me, the benefits of having a physically larger screen, totally outweigh the heavier weight. I've had 3 of these babies, (2003, 2006, 2009), and have easily carried them with me all around the world. The ONLY disadvantage I have ever come across is that they don't fit in some smaller in-room safes.

Also, having higher resolution on a 15" is not the same thing as having a 17" screen.
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